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Archive 2015 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife

  
 
ChipinSD
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Hello,

For many years I have dreamed of owning a 300 F2.8 lens for outdoor sports and wildlife. I currently use a 70D or 7D body with either the 70-200 F2.8 non-IS zoom or the 300 F4 with IS. I usually shoot with a monopod and almost never use the IS on the 300 F4.

The 300 F2.8 IS models are way out of my budget. However, every now and then I see someone selling an old 300 F2.8 non IS for around $1,800. I could swing that as an upgrade to my current F4.

Here are my questions:

1. I am pretty sure Canon no longer supports the non-IS model. If this is true, what do you do if your model needs calibration or repair service?
2. Besides looking at a seller's reputation on FM or some other board, how can you tell if you are buying a good model?
3. For my applications, with my camera bodies, will I see a big difference between the F2.8 and the F4 in terms of AF speed and IQ?
4. What is a good price for one of these lenses?

Thanks for your thoughts on this.

Chip



Jun 30, 2015 at 03:34 AM
Milan Hutera
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


I briefly considered purchasing the 300 non IS a few months ago, but in the end, I went with the IS model in like new condition (amazingly, it was made in the first year of production in 1999). As the saying goes - you only live once

I also use 70-200 non-IS and the difference between 300mm and the zoom is mind-blowing in some cases.

As you said, Canon no longer supports the non IS model, you have to ask around for a reputable 3rd party repair shop.

Hard to say what can you do to find a "good model". I've once witnessed the non-IS model to fall from 1 meter height and it did not add any external damage to its already beaten body. These are tough beasts. If the exterior is nice or even pristine, there's a great chance that everything's in order inside. But any electronic part can stop working for no apparent reason the next day you get it.

Hopefully I was of some help.



Jun 30, 2015 at 03:48 AM
ChipinSD
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Thanks Milan for your thoughts. Out of curiosity, how much did your IS version cost?

I am also thinking about trading the 300 F4 in for the 70-300L. I tend to use the 70-200 90% of the time due to the zoom functionality. From where I am usually standing, I need about 120 or so for infield shots while 300 would help in the outfield (baseball). I know it is apples and oranges comparing the fixed and zoom. All I know is the F4 is RARELY used and I would like to sell it for something more useful. If the 300 F2.8 will blow me away, I will deal with the loss of zoom.




Jun 30, 2015 at 04:02 AM
Milan Hutera
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Unfortunately mine was 3.8K EUR, since I was purchasing from a store, and not from an individual user. Very steep price and will take quite a lot of time to recover from that bill

Well, sell the f4 IS and keep the 70-200, this is still an extremely important lens.

You can check out some of my tennis galleries, they were taken almost exclusively with 300mm IS and 70-200 f2.8 non IS:

http://www.tennis-arena.cz/fed-cup-2015-postup-specatila-schmiedlova-6827cz/
http://www.tennis-arena.cz/empire-slovak-open-2015-nielen-stvrtfinale-dvojhry-7157cz
http://www.tennis-arena.cz/v-trnave-sa-ide-do-finisa-7168cz
http://www.tennis-arena.cz/v-trnave-potlesk-pre-ciernohorku-7175cz



Jun 30, 2015 at 04:15 AM
OntheRez
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Chipin,
Never had the privilege of even holding a 300mm f/2.8 - nor is it likely to happen. I do shoot the 300mm f/4.0 non-IS which I love, BUT control of your camera and working against your shake is a learning success. The fastest shutter speed possible is your friend. Can't comment on repair or longevity of an "end of life" product. Perhaps others can help.

Robert



Jun 30, 2015 at 08:26 AM
hotdog12
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


I bought a Canon 300 f/2.8 non-IS new back in 1993 and it is still one of the sharpest lenses I own. I don't think Canon services this (or a LOT of other pro gear--grump!) anymore, but this lens is built like a tank and if you get one that works, it will probably keep working. Focusing is lighting fast, even with a 1.4X attached; a 2X is more problematic for action.

This is a "bread and butter" sports and action lens, so the extra f/stop over a f/4 version is not even a consideration for my work (editorial photography). Price? I think a clean used version might go for US $2000-$3000.

Note that the non-IS version is heavier than the IS version and I always use mine with a monopod. Also, you will probably need a new carrying case. My original Canon leather carry case literally rotted and fell apart! I replaced it with the Lightware Z300 case and love it.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/31369-REG/Lightware_Z300_Z300_Long_lens_300.html

I know I did not address all your concerns, but I hope this info is useful.



Jun 30, 2015 at 09:18 AM
danski0224
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


ChipinSD wrote:
Hello,

For many years I have dreamed of owning a 300 F2.8 lens for outdoor sports and wildlife. I currently use a 70D or 7D body with either the 70-200 F2.8 non-IS zoom or the 300 F4 with IS. I usually shoot with a monopod and almost never use the IS on the 300 F4.

The 300 F2.8 IS models are way out of my budget. However, every now and then I see someone selling an old 300 F2.8 non IS for around $1,800. I could swing that as an upgrade to my current F4.

Here are my questions:

1. I am pretty sure
...Show more

1- it becomes a doorstop. There is no manual focus without power. If the USM dies, that's it. In practical terms, there are no replacement parts available anywhere in the world. At some point, the version 1 IS lenses will be in the same boat. You will need to AFMA the lens to the camera. Canon will not touch it.

2- Visually, you can't. It is assumed that a nice looking copy has been taken care of. If the USM makes noise or is jumpy, choose another. Test it in "manual focus" also.

3- You may use more/different AF points with a f/2.8 vs f/4 lens. I'd check the camera manual.

4- Check completed auctions on that other site.

Comparatively speaking, the V1 IS lenses are not that much more, maybe 1/3 or about $1k USD. I'd have a hard time spending the dough on a known obsolete and non repairable lens unless it was > 50% less than the V1 IS lens.



Jun 30, 2015 at 12:27 PM
Tenn.Jer
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Midwest Camera Repair fixed my 80-200L for a reasonable price, and they have a good reputation for repairing long out-of-production lenses.
http://www.midwestcamera.com

There are parts for many lenses available (search "fleabay" to see examples), since the "doorstops" are sold for parts when the owner is ready to get rid of it. Many older lenses deserted by Canon are legendary, loved and used everywhere (200 1.8L, 300 2.8L, 80-200L, 17-35L, 500 4.5L, just to name a few). You are taking a chance with an unsupported lens, but they are built to last, and most of them do.

A 300 2.8 lens is ideal for many outdoor sports, as the large aperture provides such great separation from background. I'm on my third IS version, since I keep selling it when I'm not doing any outdoor sports, and it just keeps coming up too short for lots of wildlife. Its sharpness is so highly acclaimed (and rightly so) that it has always been the holy grail for me; that's why I keep re-acquiring one...

If you can get one (I'm sorry, I have no actual experience with the non-IS lens), I'd say do it - or you'll keep wanting something you don't have...
Good luck, and have fun;
Jerry



Jun 30, 2015 at 12:57 PM
danski0224
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


I personally spoke with Toshio Fujishima at TF Camera Repair no more than a couple of months ago about the feasibility of repairing a 200 f/1.8.

He does not have any USM motors or circuit boards for this lens. TF is supposedly the last stop for Canon repairs, according to internet lore.

I do not know if there are any common electrical parts across the line of USM non-IS lenses, and I suspect that 50 or more 80-200's were made for every (1) 300 f/2.8. The 80-200 f/2.8 does not have a USM motor.

Out of all of those USM non-IS lenses, I would only consider the 200 f/1.8 or the 500 f/4.5.

The 300, 400 and 600 are comparatively close in pricing to V1 IS lenses that are still repairable.

If I bought any of the USM non-IS lenses, it would be with the knowledge that the odds of fixing one, should it break, isn't good... but they are substantially cheaper than the VII lenses, and may be the only ticket to the big white club for many (me too ).






Jun 30, 2015 at 07:36 PM
Ralph Thompson
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


I have a 300 2.8 IS, but I have a 400 2.8 II (non IS) & a 600 F/4 non IS... Depending on the price and the previous owner's use, I would not bat an eye on pulling the trigger on an older lens. I'm a full-time pro and use the crap out of my older glass....


Jun 30, 2015 at 10:40 PM
JimmyJames
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


I have a 300 f2.8L non IS I picked up long ago here at FM and it still works flawlessly even on my newest 5DIII and 7DII bodies.


Jul 01, 2015 at 06:46 AM
ChipinSD
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Milan - thanks for the tips. I do think I will sell the F4 IS. I'm just not sure what I will replace it with. I clicked on the second link and enjoyed your photos very much. It is a good thing I mostly shoot baseball and football. If I was shooting women's tennis my wife would question my motivation behind wanting a better lens...


Jul 01, 2015 at 01:12 PM
ChipinSD
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


hotdog12 - thanks your information was helpful. I need to digest all of this info and may get back to you with some follow-up questions.


Jul 01, 2015 at 01:14 PM
ChipinSD
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife



1- it becomes a doorstop. There is no manual focus without power. If the USM dies, that's it. In practical terms, there are no replacement parts available anywhere in the world. At some point, the version 1 IS lenses will be in the same boat. You will need to AFMA the lens to the camera. Canon will not touch it.

2- Visually, you can't. It is assumed that a nice looking copy has been taken care of. If the USM makes noise or is jumpy, choose another. Test it in "manual focus" also.

3- You may use more/different AF points with
...Show more

danski0224, thanks for the input. Your answer to #1 is my greatest fear. Those are good tips regarding testing - if I buy from someone online I will need to make sure I can return if there are any issues. It sounds like I may be best buying from someone close enough to visit and test the lens in person - maybe within a few hundred miles of driving.

Is there any info on how much longer Canon will support/repair the V1 IS version?



Jul 01, 2015 at 01:18 PM
ChipinSD
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Thank you all for your feedback!!! I will be looking into your suggestions and posting some follow-up. This is my anniversary weekend and it may be a few days before I can revisit this.


Jul 01, 2015 at 01:20 PM
Milan Hutera
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Be sure to check out the first as well. It features Daniela Hantuchova,who is still gorgeous... just be sure not to show them to your wife :-D Kidding aside,these are the the most "pro looking" of those I sent :-)

ChipinSD wrote:
Milan - thanks for the tips. I do think I will sell the F4 IS. I'm just not sure what I will replace it with. I clicked on the second link and enjoyed your photos very much. It is a good thing I mostly shoot baseball and football. If I was shooting women's tennis my wife would question my motivation behind wanting a better lens...




Jul 01, 2015 at 02:38 PM
danski0224
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


ChipinSD wrote:
danski0224, thanks for the input. Your answer to #1 is my greatest fear. Those are good tips regarding testing - if I buy from someone online I will need to make sure I can return if there are any issues. It sounds like I may be best buying from someone close enough to visit and test the lens in person - maybe within a few hundred miles of driving.

Is there any info on how much longer Canon will support/repair the V1 IS version?



As others have said, the lens is a piece of pro-quality gear, designed to be used in the rigors of a professional environment everyday. A nice minty copy may continue to function for many years in the hands of an enthusiast that is less demanding. It has been said that the IQ of those USM lenses is more comparable to the VII IS lenses.

The problem is that no one knows when/if the lens will cease to function. At some point, a nice minty copy could be the equivalent of the car stored in a garage for 30 years and then you drive it.... Unlike those old manual lenses, the average Joe isn't mucking around with the innards of high end EF lenses.

The one known item is that the USM non-IS lenses are essentially non-repairable at this point in time. That is the realistic perspective. Finding a NOS stash of parts is unlikely. They have been out of production since 1998? 2000? How many were made and how many spares existed when the line shut down?

If you buy one of those USM non-IS lenses, you have to be OK with the risk of spending a few grand on something that could last for years or could crap out tomorrow and not be repairable.

I'd guess that the V1 IS lenses would be supported by Canon for 10 years after the comparable VII IS lens was officially released. I certainly do not know for sure. It is probable that many more of these lenses were made compared to the USM non-IS lenses. Spare parts may be more plentiful. At least the V1 lens still works with manual focus and IS off.

Last time I looked, there was about a $1k USD spread between a USM non-IS 300 f/2.8 and the V1 IS 300 f/2.8, both copies looking almost like new.

I'd spend the extra grand on the V1 IS lens. I'm pretty sure that it is a bit lighter, it has a shorter MFD and it focuses faster. That said, if a screaming deal came up on a USM lens, I'd take it.




Jul 01, 2015 at 05:14 PM
Kenneth Farver
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


I paid $500 for a broken one and had it repaired for I think $150. I was lucky.
Too bad I wanted a better camera body because I sold it for $1500 locally before I really got to use it.
I am saving for a 300mm F2.8 IS model.
I also had a 200mm F1.8 (focus by wire such as the 300 non-IS) and that was a beauty.
I sold it also to buy a better body.
I don't think I would pay even $1500 for a non-IS, no matter how clean it looked.
Good Luck.



Jul 01, 2015 at 05:21 PM
collicuttl
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Opinion on 300 F2.8 non-IS for Sports and Wildlife


Another possible way to go is the new 100-400. I shoot field sports and used to use the 300 f4. I upgraded to the new 100-400 and loved it. Fast focus, sharp and a great focal range on a 7dII. Of course it's 4.5-5.6 so you won't get as nice a background and it sucks for night games but for shooting day games on a budget it's wonderful.


Jul 03, 2015 at 04:10 PM





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