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Archive 2015 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Bsmooth
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Been trying to shoot swallows in flight and am just not getting many keepers at all. Using a 1DMKIV and 100-400 version 1. I'm getting better at keeping them in the viewfinder, which I was really poor at first. Sometime though I'll have it in the viewfinder in AI servo and it just seems to lag trying to focus.
One of the issues is I have the lens set to the far setting for quicker focus, but I wonder If it crosses into the closer setting sometime and loses focus.
Granted I'm shooting freehand, with an ISO of 800 to keep shutter speeds of 1/1600 up to 1/4000, and shooting in AV mode set to 6.3 aperture.
Anyone have any pointers to help ?

Jun 15, 2015 at 08:57 AM

jcolwell
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Shoot lots.

Also, a lens with faster AF might help.

Jun 15, 2015 at 08:59 AM

Tenn.Jer
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

A quick search of the Nature and Wildlife forum turned up a couple dozen threads of swallow photographs; you may get more suggestions asking there. One member here (Mark Fadely) used to post some of the most amazing shots, and he stood above a bridge (or dock? I'm not sure) where they nested, and was able to time their turns and swoops as they came in to land...

All my successful swallow captures have been when they're perched, and you probably know how rare that is...
Good luck,
Jerry

Jun 15, 2015 at 11:02 AM

Bsmooth
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Is the 100-400 Ver 1 not as fast with AF ? I thought maybe it was my old 1DMKII that was the culprit. I thought by moving to the 1DMKIV it would help.
I know I can't afford the larger 500 and 600 Big Whites. What lenses are best for shooting BIF ?

Jun 15, 2015 at 11:24 AM

PetKal
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Digital Rebel T6 + 135L is not a bad setup for shooting swallows in flight.
If I had sufficient patience to go beyond 300 frames fired, I feel I might have gotten some better shots than the ones shown below.

Edited on Jun 17, 2015 at 02:26 PM · View previous versions

Jun 15, 2015 at 11:36 AM

rdcny
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Yes - go to a place where they nest and shoot them entering/leaving the nest. They usually nest in colonies. Or try a migration watch site - that is where I photographed this Red-rumped Swallow and Pacific Swift. For any location, you want to find a spot where there is a head-wind or strong updraft - these birds will pause in that type of wind - or at least slow up. These are with the 5D3 (Canon) and 800mm F5.6 - handheld...both 1600 iso at about 1/2000 to 1/2500 sec exposure

Red-rumped Swallow on migration in Chumphon, Thailand (17 Oct 2014)

Forktail (Pacific) Swift on migration in Chumphon, Thailand (26 Sep 2014)

Jun 15, 2015 at 11:54 AM

Imagemaster
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Well for swallows in flight, the 100-400 certainly does not have adequate AF. 500, 600 & 800mm lenses are certainly not the best choices either.

Jun 15, 2015 at 01:14 PM

mark fadely
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

The problem with shooting swallows is you need a long lens to fill the frame with these tiny birds and the longer the lens the less field of view to help track them.

The equipment performance is critical for success as well. While the 400 5.6 prime is the best all around compromise, I believe you can get acceptable results with your 100-400 II.

The MKIV is an excellent body for shooting swallows.

First:

Find an area with swallow activity and try to get close with good lighting. Then study their flight patterns as they may repeat flight paths when near the colony.

Next:

Zoom out a bit with your 100-400 to say around 250mm and work on acquiring the birds and getting a couple of in-focus shots off. Always use Ai-servo focusing. As a rule use center-point only, and especially with there is a background. Only use all-points if you are shooting against clear sky. Sky backgrounds will be much easier of course, but they are not as interesting as ground-in-view shots. Once you get the hang of focus locking on the birds gradually start to zoom in to fill more of the frame. Anticipate when they might enter the viewfinder by shooting with both eyes open much of the time. Optimally when the swallow fills at least 1/4 of the frame you will usually only have 1-3 frames @10fps until the bird exits the viewfinder. The problem with trying to anticipate focus lock-on is that if you activate focus and miss then by the time the focus re-aquires the target it is often too late. By anticipating I mean watch with both eyes and when you see the bird near the lens line of sight be ready to mash the AF just as the bird crosses into the frame. Close the eye outside the viewfinder and track as best as you can. Even keep the shutter button pressed for a few extra frames in case you get a lucky re-acquisition somehow.

Lastly:

Even with years of practice and the best equipment you can only hope for maybe a 5% keeper rate at best. Always shoot manual exposure because it's super easy to underexpose the top side of their wings and then even a great shot will be disappointing.

CAUTION - Excessive swallow shooting can cause mental disorders

http://markfadely.smugmug.com/Nature/Zs-gallery/i-FnkKJRZ/0/X2/IMG_6590l-X2.jpg

Canon EOS 5D Mark II
ISO 500
Focal Length 190mm (70-200 2.8 II)
Aperture f/2.8
Exposure Time 0.0006s (1/1600)

Edited on Jun 15, 2015 at 05:41 PM · View previous versions

Jun 15, 2015 at 02:03 PM

surfnron
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

I'd suggest a wa lens - maybe 10mm. When they enter the frame, depress the shutter and pray.

Then crop - a lot ~ Ron

Jun 15, 2015 at 02:07 PM

PetKal
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

mark fadely wrote:
CAUTION - Excessive swallow shooting can cause mental disorders

Right on. That is why one has to know when to stop. I certainly do.

Jun 15, 2015 at 03:05 PM

Bsmooth
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Hey don't laugh I tried to shoot them using a 100 Macro. I got really sharp shots of the sky and ground. I may also be on the verge of mental disorders already. I was also going to try manual focusing as well.
Can you trap focus with a 1DMKIV ? What I mean is go to manual focus and set a range then depress the shutter and wait for the bird to pass until it focuses and then the shutter will go off ?

Jun 15, 2015 at 03:11 PM

jcolwell
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Bsmooth wrote:
Can you trap focus with a 1DMKIV ? What I mean is go to manual focus and set a range then depress the shutter and wait for the bird to pass until it focuses and then the shutter will go off ?

Nope. You could try a Pentax DSLR, but it probably wouldn't be fast enough, anyway.

I use my 1DIV on AI Servo with centre AF point (surrounding point expansion) and IS turned off.

Jun 15, 2015 at 03:18 PM

PetKal
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Incidentally, lads, in order to earn any creds for SIF shooting, you gotta post more than one sample result of your endeavours......that's an old FM ruling, you can check it with Fred.

Jun 15, 2015 at 03:27 PM

jcolwell
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Jun 15, 2015 at 03:29 PM

PetKal
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

jcolwell wrote:

Jim, I am terribly sorry, the ruling is not my fault.

Jun 15, 2015 at 03:45 PM

Jefferson
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

" ... Sometime though I'll have it in the viewfinder in AI servo and it just seems to lag trying to focus. ... "

You have to shoot in front of them and anticipate where they will be when the shot arrives.

I used to try and shoot them with a 5Dc and Canon 200 f/2.8, but that was a frustrating experience. I finally got wise and tried the Remington 870 "Wingmaster" and 2 3/4 loads of #4 shot ...

My keeper rate increased dramatically and the frustration I experienced just faded away and turned to joy (and maybe a bit of retribution), and now I enjoy shooting more with my new toy ...

I continue to shoot Canon products ... but there is, I find, a certain gratification for the Remington when the Canon just won't due ...

Jefferson ... http://jeffersonposter.smugmug.com/photos/i-JTCh7ZJ/0/Th/i-JTCh7ZJ-Th.jpg

Jun 15, 2015 at 04:28 PM

jcolwell
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Bad doggy!

Jun 15, 2015 at 04:29 PM

Daniel Smith
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

Just like we did with manual focus lenses in "the old days". Pre focus at a specific distance and follow the swallows until they just about to enter that sharp zone - then trip the shutter.

Simple and effective.

Most AutoFocus cameras can't keep a flying swallow in focus and the problem gets worse with bigger glass.

Jun 15, 2015 at 04:31 PM

arbitrage
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

My only luck so far was to get my fastest focusing lens (300 f/2.8 IS II) and put the 7D2 on all 65pt mode. Then try to get one in the VF and let the points try and track it as you try and track it. It can get much more predictable if the swallows are coming and going from a fixed spot like a nest or hillside cavity.

Jun 15, 2015 at 04:33 PM

Doctorbird
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Best method for shooting swallows ?

arbitrage wrote:
My only luck so far was to get my fastest focusing lens (300 f/2.8 IS II) and put the 7D2 on all 65pt mode. Then try to get one in the VF and let the points try and track it as you try and track it. It can get much more predictable if the swallows are coming and going from a fixed spot like a nest or hillside cavity.

I concur. But my keeper rate is still pretty low.

Jun 15, 2015 at 05:10 PM

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