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Archive 2015 · Any Surface Pro users out there?

  
 
beavens
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Knocking around the idea of editing on a Surface Pro for extra mobility/flexibility.

Has anyone out there had any experience with this?

How was the touchscreen? How are the colors? How is the performance?

Thanks!

Jeff



May 01, 2015 at 01:00 PM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


yep Im a surface pro user or perhaps i should say .

mine is a Version 1, but a lot of this would relate to the SP2

Its fine for what it is but its certainly no laptop . in fact the one place it won't sit well is on my lap .
I run Lightroom on it and for what I need it for it does that quite well . I only really use smart previews on it (more info on the best way to use smart previews if you want to PM me )
I haven't really tried PS but probably will now I'm a CC subscriber .
Lightroom 5 (not got round to putting CC on it yet) can be really annoying . the menus are to small and are quite hard to use . I tend to do most things by keyboard shortcuts . maybe things will be different with CC as thats supposed to be tablet screen optimised . I will also add that I find (in LR5) flicking thru images too quickly can make the program crash

But I have to say for more than a little bit of stuff I find the 10" screen too small . Maybe its the 16:9 form but I actually find my iPad screen seems bigger .

I Ditched the microsoft pen and bought a cheap Wacom pen (in fact the microsft pen ditched me as i lost 3 of them) which does the job just as well and is better to hold .

general stuff : (a lot of this is a win8 rant in general)
Metro is great (for as far a metro goes) but the desktop mode annoys the crap out of me . again too small and text doesn't seem to be that crisp compared to metro . I hate how metro IE won't talk to desktop IE

The mag power is great in that its magnetic so unlike my wife's lenovo yoga catching the cable won't wreck the connector but its also a pain to try and fit properly because of the shape of the machines side . its nice that it has a USB port on the power brick but it would be eevn better if they made that a data port as well (usb2 would be ok by me) . as only 1 usb3 port is a drag .


would I buy it again ? probably not . the later versions may address some of the issues but I'd want to use an SP3 for a few days to see if its more usable as a laptop . But for what an SP3 costs considering the keyboard is extra I think id be looking at a Yoga or the HP spectra unless I really wanted a tablet (which i find the iPad makes a much better fist of )



May 01, 2015 at 01:39 PM
blob loblaw
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


wait for Windows 10.
8.1 is not really great for touch screen unless you're using the pen all the time

there's a reason why Apple is not deploying touch screens for the OSX.

that said Surface Pro 3 with i5 is fantastic - the screen is clear and good colours. The dock allows you to connect external monitor,keyboard,mouse easily.



May 01, 2015 at 01:52 PM
beavens
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Thanks for the info, guys!

My brother has a SP3, and it seemed pretty slick after using it for a few minutes.

I would definitely wait for Windows 10.

Does the SP3 use full-blown Windows or the slimmed down tablet OS (RT I think)?



May 01, 2015 at 02:06 PM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


can you sit with the SP3 on your lap comfortably (i.e. just like or at least close) a laptop . ?
thats my 1 big gripe about my SP1 .

as for Win 10 . I do hope so as i absolutey hate win8 . My main machine at home is an iMac . but before I bought that I had never used OS X and I have to say a couple of days of using OS X it made a ton more sense than win8 has ever made to me .

Apparently strangely enough the SP1 is one of the best candidates for a Hackintosh install . I did have a go but couldn't get mine to see the install stick . maybe I was doing something wrong and probably should have another go



May 01, 2015 at 02:06 PM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


beavens wrote:
Thanks for the info, guys!

My brother has a SP3, and it seemed pretty slick after using it for a few minutes.

I would definitely wait for Windows 10.

Does the SP3 use full-blown Windows or the slimmed down tablet OS (RT I think)?


SP3 is full windows . RT is dead . even the new Surface 3 (not the pro) which replaced the Surface 2 (RT) runs Full windows .




May 01, 2015 at 02:08 PM
beavens
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Ian.Dobinson wrote:
SP3 is full windows . RT is dead . even the new Surface 3 (not the pro) which replaced the Surface 2 (RT) runs Full windows .



Sweet - thanks!

One big issue I've got with the SP3 is the problem with some people's wifi. My brother unfortunately has this issue where you can't connect to wifi and it pretty much makes the thing useless. Nothing I've yet so far has fixed the issue (he hasn't cleared the thing off so I haven't had a chance to completely wipe it). Apparently the Marvell wireless isn't all that reliable.



May 01, 2015 at 02:11 PM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Don't know much about the SP3 . mi SP1 occasionally won't connect to my wifi but its nothing a quick on/off of the wireless or a quick restart (which the surface does really quickly) doesn't fix .


May 01, 2015 at 02:19 PM
beavens
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Ian.Dobinson wrote:
Don't know much about the SP3 . mi SP1 occasionally won't connect to my wifi but its nothing a quick on/off of the wireless or a quick restart (which the surface does really quickly) doesn't fix .


Wish that did it! I've turned off wireless, reloaded drivers, rolled back drivers, installed updates and rolled back the OS/updates to a previously known spot and still nada.

It's gotta be a hardware issue IMO.



May 01, 2015 at 02:21 PM
Mr Mouse
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


blob loblaw wrote:
wait for Windows 10.
8.1 is not really great for touch screen unless you're using the pen all the time

there's a reason why Apple is not deploying touch screens for the OSX.

that said Surface Pro 3 with i5 is fantastic - the screen is clear and good colours. The dock allows you to connect external monitor,keyboard,mouse easily.


Windows 10 has more user friendly windows touch features to help snap windows and other windows touch functions. However that will not help applications with old UI which were not designed for use with touch. Scaling UI larger does not help much. Old icons and button design to be used with a pointing device like a mouse or pen are still to small and close to other fingers are not precis.

I have Windows 10 on my Surface Pro 3. Applications like Photoshop CC 2014 that have a 2x UI option do not work well. The surface pro 3 display is 2160x1440. When Adobe UI is scaled to half resolution the UI basically has 1080px by 720 px to work with. Photoshop's UI was designed for a minimum of 1024x768. 720 does not cut it. Some of Photoshop UI does not fit on the Surface Pro 3 Display scaled 2X. And what does fit is not usable with touch you need a mouse or the Surface Pro 3 pen.

I do not use CC 2014 2x UI option on the surface pro 3. I run CC 2014 at 1x UI. I found that a utility like touchkey can make custom touch UI for use with application like CC 2014. I can use CC 2014 with touch and it is even usable without a keyboard. Touchkey give me Photoshop Keyboard shortcuts via touch...

The Surface Hub application does not work on Windows 10. So I can not adjust the Surface Pro 3 Pen's feel. My Wacom Intuos Pro also works well on the Surface Pro 3, Windows 10 when the Wacom wireless dongle plugged into the surface pro 3 USB 3 port. I 'm sure Microsoft will update the Surface Hub application to work with Windows 10.

I also use my Surface Pro 3 as a third high ppi display on my windows workstation at times. Done using Spacedesk over my local network. My Workstation is wired to the network where the Surface pro 3 connection is wireless. The performance is fine for sill image editing. High resolution video editing over a wireless network I'm sure would be a different story.

The SP3 Wireless problem was fixed a while ago with a firmware update.



May 01, 2015 at 04:07 PM
Mar73
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


I have an ASUS T100 which is comparable in size to the surface pro and runs windows 8.1 like the surface. It's great for traveling but I only used it as my primary editing PC for about 2 months before I moved back to a desktop.


May 05, 2015 at 07:08 AM
Arka
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


I used a Surface Pro 2 256GB i5 for a time, and was fairly pleased with it. Unfortunately, as an imaging machine, the pen/tablet concept is one that is not all that well executed on the Surface. The pen feels like an afterthought, and this is even more true since Surface moved to the nTrig tech (SP1 and 2 were Wacom, which are better digitizers). Also, the out-of-box experience on the Surface (at least for pen functionality) was sub-par. I had to figure out what drivers to download to enable pen pressure in Photoshop and Painter, and when I installed them, they didn't work until I uninstalled and reinstalled them three times. Given that MS controls the hardware and software for the Surface, I would have expected better out-of-box functionality from their flagship computer product.

I have since sold the Surface and moved to the Cintiq Companion 2, which is a far better content creation device. Among the reasons are;
1. Superior pen input, with 2048 levels of pressure and tilt sensitivity that works right out of the box;
2. More powerful CPUs and GPUs (I use the Broadwell 3.4GHz with 16GB RAM and Iris 6100 graphics, which is stupid fast for a computer that weighs less than 4lbs)
3. The programmable hotkeys and floating menus virtually eliminate the need for a keyboard when drawing or processing photos;
4. The screen is larger and higher resolution;
5. I can plug it into another computer and use it as a pen display;
6. I can toggle touch on and off with the touch of a single button.
My only issue with the Companion is that it runs Windows (I would much prefer MacOS, as both my Companion and Surface Pro ran into Windows-specific issues that I've never experienced on my Macs, including hangups during the installation of Windows updates, random driver crashes, and the persistence of the virtual keyboard (on the Surface) even while the type cover was connected. But if you want a decent tablet with strong drawing functionality, Windows is it. And I think the Cintiq Companion 2 is the best product money can buy if visual content creation is your primary goal (though you'll need a lot of money and patience, as the Companion isn't cheap or readily available).



May 06, 2015 at 06:51 PM
kdphotography
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Surface Pro 2 is fine for travel and tethering on location via USB3. But it's small and I think would be really confining if used on a regular basis for processing images. I have a Surface Pro 2 with 512K and 8GB RAM. I use it to tether with a Phase IQ180 MFDB via USB3. You can read more about tethering with the Surface Pro on my blog, https://kendoophotography.wordpress.com/2014/02/18/microsofts-surface-pro-2-a-game-changer-for-phase-one-iq-series-and-leaf-credo-medium-format-digital-backs/

The Surface Pro 3 is definitely a more mature machine and the pen digitizer is much better. Larger screen to boot too. Fine for travel, but I'd still feel confined if I were processing images regularly on such a small device. SP3 is lighter too.

kenhttps://kendoophotography.wordpress.com/2014/02/18/microsofts-surface-pro-2-a-game-changer-for-phase-one-iq-series-and-leaf-credo-medium-format-digital-backs/



May 06, 2015 at 07:44 PM
beavens
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


The Companion 2 looks pretty nice! I think I'd have to step my game up to justify the purchase.

I was looking to use the SP3 (rumor of SP4 launch near the end of the month?) while I was at the office and maybe at home a bit.

Thanks for the info, guys!

Jeff



May 06, 2015 at 08:02 PM
Mr Mouse
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Arka wrote:
I used a Surface Pro 2 256GB i5 for a time, and was fairly pleased with it. Unfortunately, as an imaging machine, the pen/tablet concept is one that is not all that well executed on the Surface. The pen feels like an afterthought, and this is even more true since Surface moved to the nTrig tech (SP1 and 2 were Wacom, which are better digitizers). Also, the out-of-box experience on the Surface (at least for pen functionality) was sub-par.


You use a Surface Pro 2 Photoshop and others did not work till you figured out what drivers you needed to install to get the pent to work. That thing got worse when Microsoft abandoned Wacom and moved to nTrig pen. Your facts are biases and slanted the fact are not current. You use the Surface Pro 2 which you should have compared to the Cintiq companion not the newer companion 2. It looks like you have not use a Surface nTrig pen yet you judged it bad. The Fact is the Surface Pro 3 with Windows 8.1 and Surface firmware updates work great. Adobe Photoshop CC 2014 works out of the box Adobe Photoshop CC 2014 on Windows 8.1 works with Microsoft INK API now. I chose the Surface Pro 3 over the Cintiq companion 2 because it is way more portable Less than half the weight.smaller and cost $500 or more less then the CC2. The CC2 is quit a bit bigger physically because if its wider Aspect ratio display and the space required for the express keys. The Difference between the CC2 and SP3 display is not great. The CC2 IPS displays has a 220 PPI resolution and the SP3 IPS 216 PPI a difference of 4 PPI. The differences between the two Display Screens Aspect Ratio is quite different. The CC2 has a 16:9 wide aspect ratio where the SP3 has a 3:2 aspect ration like man cameras. Both displays display 1440 Pixels height the SP3 displays width is 2160 where the CC2 width is wider by 1.6" displays 2560 pixels 500 pixel more useful for Photoshop. Photoshop is not usable without a keyboard. Popping up windows on screen keyboard is not really usable. The CC2 express keys help some but you need more. I found a windows utility Touchkey with witch I can create custom touch keys that give me more function than what the CC2 express keys have to offer. If I were to use a CC2 I would also use Touchkey. Yes the CC2 has a better Pen. If I were are artiest a painter that may make a difference but I'm not. At home I use my Wacom Intuos Pro wireless dongle plugged into the Surface Pro 3 USB 3 port I use a Wacom pen and keep my fingers off the display. In fact I prefer to use a tablet and not cover what I'm working on wit my hand and leave finger print on my work. I also hook my SP3 on my workstation wireless as a proofing 3rd display. I was considering the CC2 for I read It new feature lets the CC2 also act like a Cintiq hooked via many wires to a workstation. I also read the CC2 drivers slow down Photoshop performance when operated treated to a workstation as a Cintiq.


Edited on May 07, 2015 at 09:26 PM · View previous versions



May 07, 2015 at 06:54 PM
beavens
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


I appreciate the info, Mr Mouse!

Might just have sealed the deal (after I wait to see if the SP4 is just around the corner).

Jeff



May 07, 2015 at 07:48 PM
flash
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


I dropped my fully loaded 11" MacBook Air for a SP3 (i7) after I upgraded my daughters SP1 to a SP3. The Surface Pro 3 is the best portable I've used. I wouldn't use it as my main machine (I have a Mac Pro for that) but it's fantastic on the road. I've had none of the wifi issues other have mentioned. The digitiser is also better than the SP1 I upgraded. Screen resolution is great but Lightroom needs a mouse. Using pen or touch is nearly impossible. Using the pen for Photoshop selections works great.

The only downside is that the N-trig pens need a battery and they can be difficult to source.

Gordon



May 07, 2015 at 08:23 PM
beavens
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


flash wrote:
I dropped my fully loaded 11" MacBook Air for a SP3 (i7) after I upgraded my daughters SP1 to a SP3. The Surface Pro 3 is the best portable I've used. I wouldn't use it as my main machine (I have a Mac Pro for that) but it's fantastic on the road. I've had none of the wifi issues other have mentioned. The digitiser is also better than the SP1 I upgraded. Screen resolution is great but Lightroom needs a mouse. Using pen or touch is nearly impossible. Using the pen for Photoshop selections works great.

The only downside is that
...Show more

Man, I had never even heard of AAAA!

Sanyo needs to make some quad-A Eneloops.

Thank you for your insight,

Jeff



May 08, 2015 at 10:25 AM
Arka
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Mr Mouse wrote:
You use a Surface Pro 2 Photoshop and others did not work till you figured out what drivers you needed to install to get the pent to work. That thing got worse when Microsoft abandoned Wacom and moved to nTrig pen. Your facts are biases and slanted the fact are not current. You use the Surface Pro 2 which you should have compared to the Cintiq companion not the newer companion 2.


The first-generation Cintiq Companion worked fine with Photoshop CS6 right out of the box. I don't use (and don't ever plan to use) CC in any of its iterations, so for my needs, having the hardware be fully compatible with CS6 right out of the box is important. SP2 was not, and neither was SP3 when I tried installing a trial version at the MS store here in LA. Maybe they've fixed it since I looked a few months ago?

It looks like you have not use a Surface nTrig pen yet you judged it bad. The Fact is the Surface Pro 3 with Windows 8.1 and Surface firmware updates work great. Adobe Photoshop CC 2014 works out of the box Adobe Photoshop CC 2014 on Windows 8.1 works with Microsoft INK API now.

I used it quite extensively before deciding not to buy one (the MS store is within walking distance of my office, and I had quite a few lunch breaks to try it out and install my favorite software on it). It was a product I wanted to love but could not. The stylus is inferior to the Wacom in terms of pressure sensitivity, and it doesn't even have tilt sensitivity (a feature unique to the Cintiq products). Also, the absence of physical hotkeys makes a keyboard mandatory for most things, which is not true of the Cintiq companion 2.

I chose the Surface Pro 3 over the Cintiq companion 2 because it is way more portable Less than half the weight.smaller and cost $500 or more less then the CC2. The CC2 is quit a bit bigger physically because if its wider Aspect ratio display and the space required for the express keys. The Difference between the CC2 and SP3 display is not great. The CC2 IPS displays has a 220 PPI resolution and the SP3 IPS 216 PPI a difference of 4 PPI. The differences between the two Display Screens Aspect Ratio is quite different. The CC2 has a...Show more

I use Photoshop on my Cintiq Companion 2 without a keyboard all the time. I have a backup Bluetooth keyboard in case I need it, but you can certainly get by on the floating menus and hotkeys, as long as you know your workflow.

The CC2 express keys help some but you need more. I found a windows utility Touchkey with witch I can create custom touch keys that give me more function than what the CC2 express keys have to offer. If I were to use a CC2 I would also use Touchkey. Yes the CC2 has a better Pen. If I were are artiest a painter that may make a difference but I'm not. At home I use my Wacom Intuos Pro wireless dongle plugged into the Surface Pro 3 USB 3 port I use a Wacom pen and keep my fingers off...Show more

Any computer can support a Wacom Intuos tablet externally, but that's not a very good reason to spend the cash on a Surface or other tablet computer with pen input. As for one's hand getting in the way of the work, I know many an artist who initially turned down Cintiqs for that reason, but almost all of them came around in the end. When it comes to precision and feel, there is no substitute for seeing what you are drawing on the drawing surface. No matter how accustomed you are to drawing on one surface while seeing on another (and I'd been doing some version of that since 1996), it is much easier to work precisely when the drawing and viewing surface are one and the same.

I also hook my SP3 on my workstation wireless as a proofing 3rd display. I was considering the CC2 for I read It new feature lets the CC2 also act like a Cintiq hooked via many wires to a workstation. I also read the CC2 drivers slow down Photoshop performance when operated treated to a workstation as a Cintiq.


I haven't experienced a significant slowdown when using the companion as a pen display on my Mac.




May 08, 2015 at 06:58 PM
Mr Mouse
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Any Surface Pro users out there?


Arka wrote:
[I use Photoshop on my Cintiq Companion 2 without a keyboard all the time. I have a backup Bluetooth keyboard in case I need it, but you can certainly get by on the floating menus and hotkeys, as long as you know your workflow.


Your use of Photoshop must be quite different then mine. I use shortcut all the time I need a keyboard or touchkey. Your also a faster learner then me. I would never feel using a Surfacr Pro 3 in a Microsoft store at lunch time extensive use. I would need to process some of my PSD assets. Use some of the programs I scripted, plugins I created and use some of my actions. I'm just a retoucher that edits images and make composite. Draw I do not do. I do more masking tilt is not something important to me. 2048 level is also over kill for me. I need finer control. 256 levels and keyboard keys 1 through 0 is what I need to controll things like opacity the way iI use it. I need fine control of ranges using things.

Desktop Applications need a keyboards. An onscreen keyboard is OK to adding text layers but you don't want to need to popup an on screen keyboard to use a shortcut for its no longer short fast access.

I'm sure many feel the CC2 is an excelent device it just not for everyone. I do not think a SP3 or CC2 would be anyone main machine. Its their mobile machine. Its fine to choose a CC2 if that machine is better for you needs.



May 08, 2015 at 10:06 PM
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