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Archive 2015 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d

  
 
SKMoss
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Hi all,

I'm looking to upgrade gear. I've been shooting a 20d I bought used several years back. NOT particularly happy with it. Actually prefer my old Rebel 300d.

Probably going to go with something used again. I've been thinking about a t5i. I can find them used for reasonable prices, but the discounted values are still pretty close to big box retail.

Any other suggestions? I'd like to stay <$700. I've got decent L series glass to put in front of it, but that new 18-55 IS kit lens is interesting.



Apr 05, 2015 at 06:53 PM
timbop
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


What attributes of the body are most important? Size? weight? Frames per sec? video?


Apr 05, 2015 at 07:41 PM
Wobble
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Not knowing what you like to shoot and what features are important to you, there is a 7D for $500 on the B&S board.


Apr 05, 2015 at 07:59 PM
curious80
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Well there are quite a few bodies available in the used market for low prices which will provide you a significant upgrade over the 20D and/or 300d. However I am very curious to know what makes you unhappy with 20D and makes you prefer 300D. Knowing that will be important in deciding what is a good fit for your preferences. As such 20D was a vastly superior camera to 300D.


Apr 05, 2015 at 08:13 PM
timbop
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


curious80 wrote:
As such 20D was a vastly superior camera to 300D.


owned both, and fully agree



Apr 05, 2015 at 08:39 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


SKMoss wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking to upgrade gear. I've been shooting a 20d I bought used several years back. NOT particularly happy with it. Actually prefer my old Rebel 300d.

Probably going to go with something used again. I've been thinking about a t5i. I can find them used for reasonable prices, but the discounted values are still pretty close to big box retail.

Any other suggestions? I'd like to stay <$700. I've got decent L series glass to put in front of it, but that new 18-55 IS kit lens is interesting.


If you liked the previous cameras you would probably be very happy with the t5i.

Dan



Apr 05, 2015 at 08:58 PM
SKMoss
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Thanks all. I'll try to answer as best as I can.

Size and weight are a bit of a factor. I'm a big guy and small cameras don't fit so well. Weight really doesn't matter that much, but heavier feels better.

FPS is important. I tend to do a lot of animal photography and catching the shot is about getting frames at the right time. Video is a huge bonus. I expect to get an UW housing and thats going to play a big part of my future diving. I volunteer for a veterans support group that uses SCUBA to help with PTSD. Getting UW video will be good.

I'm 100% positive the 20d is vastly superior. And that may be my problem. It may well be that im not driving it correctly. Shooting my 300d I never had much problem with exposure control. When I go to correct levels the curves always made sense, and there was little clipping going on. With the 20d, I'm almost always clipping on both ends.

I liked the controls on the 300d, but then that just a case of priory learning. 300d is what i learned with, so it's what i like the best. I noted that the t5I has the same basic control setup as the 300d.

I did test shots this weekend with both the 20d and 300d for an upcoming photo shoot for my train club. A lot of it was very close up work, but not macro. In order simulate real world photos I stopped the camera all the way down to get the widest DoF, and shot off a mono pod, or just laying on the layout. Both did ok. But the 20d's shots were more grainy when I started zoom in. I'm going to have to crop a lot, and hope theres pixels enough left over.

B&S board? (EDITED) I figured that out. Found the camera in mentioned.



Apr 05, 2015 at 08:58 PM
richierich1212
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


FPS? Movies? Less than $700? I'd go with a 7D.


Apr 05, 2015 at 09:23 PM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Ive had most of the Crop bodies (350D , 30D, 450D, 40D, 50D, 7D) and have to say the disappointing ones out of those were the 30D (basically a 20D with better buffer and larger screen) and the 50D . the 450D was a great sensor but in a bad sized body . never liked the pentamirror VF's of the Rebel cams (like looking thru a keyhole) .

the 7D was and still is a great camera (even if it gets loads of hate around here) and that would be my choice really .
If your wanting a rebel then they are pretty much the same from the point they went to the 18mp sensor but really if your looking at one of those for the size gain over the XXD and XD bodies then Id be looking at the little SL1


EDIT:
OK I just read you additional post . from what your saying if its a crop body your looking at I think I would really go to the 7D or 70D (still think the 7D beats the 70 in use) or if you can really push the boat out the 7D2 .

from what your saying about getting a water housing for the DSLR you really may want to push the budget as far as you can . the housing will cost you a fortune so your better off getting a body thats a new as possible so you can get the most life out of it . Plus its going to be used in lower light a lot so you want one thats as good in low light / Hi ISO as possible . which in canon crop terms is the 7D2 .




Apr 06, 2015 at 02:52 AM
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


1D Mark II N. And you'll be hooked.


Apr 06, 2015 at 03:33 AM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Snopchenko wrote:
1D Mark II N. And you'll be hooked.


had 2 of those as well . fun to play with but I never got on with mine (yeah I know I have no idea why I went back for a 2nd time ) .

Also wouldn't be my candidate for a waterproof housing body either .



Apr 06, 2015 at 03:39 AM
dhphoto
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Ian.Dobinson wrote:
had 2 of those as well . fun to play with but I never got on with mine (yeah I know I have no idea why I went back for a 2nd time ) .

Also wouldn't be my candidate for a waterproof housing body either .


I agree about the 1D2N, never really liked it.

I'm using my 7D for holidays now and it's great for that (i.e. when there's plenty of light) so I'd say either a 7D or a 60D, both of which are exceptional value now.

There's nothing whatsoever wrong with the much-used 18 meg crop sensor if you expose correctly



Apr 06, 2015 at 03:55 AM
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


Ian.Dobinson wrote:
had 2 of those as well . fun to play with but I never got on with mine (yeah I know I have no idea why I went back for a 2nd time ) .

Also wouldn't be my candidate for a waterproof housing body either .


Yeah, I missed that housing bit until after I posted. But I thought that you, along with myself, Jerry (StillFingerz) and PetKal, would be a big proponent of that camera. I still miss mine sometimes - even though 1D Mark 4 is better in every respect. Maybe it's the two-button operation, or the grit of something unpolished operation-wise (it had some pretty puzzling ergonomical decisions, innit)... Or the fact that it was my first "proper" camera, after the love-hate relationship with the 30D...



Apr 06, 2015 at 05:50 AM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


yeah the 1Dm2 was fun . its image quality was good at lower ISO's . But I had a love hate relationship with it . the affair ended (for the last time) when I took it to the british Moto GP round along with my 7D thinking the 7D would be the 'back up' when in fact i just didnt use the 1 series finding the 7D coped really well . the 1 series stayed in the bag and was a pain on my shoulder all day . the next 2 days I left it in the car and it was up for sale by the end of the week


Apr 06, 2015 at 06:37 AM
CMcG01
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


I was thinking 1d iii except for doing video. I got a later serial # one (after af issues) recently for just over $600-- loving it!


Apr 06, 2015 at 06:53 AM
timbop
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


well, finding an adequate UW housing will be the bigger problem for an older body. A good housing will probably also cost more than the body; you might be better off compromising in that area and getting a good P&S with a UW housing - along with a newer DSLR for above the water. If you do have larger hands, I will guess that a rebel series will not be comfortable to you - I know that I don't like my wife's rebel even with a grip on it.

Do you shoot raw? If not, that may be one reason you aren't happy with the range of the 20d. In either case, a newer body will allow you to alter the contrast and sharpening of jpegs.



Apr 06, 2015 at 07:32 AM
ross attix
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


While I can't answer your upgrade question, there are already several recommendations here to help.

My input is going to concentrate on your comments about train photography, because if you are looking for better quality photos, your technique is part of the problem. Several things you mentioned are working against you:

1- Hand held or monopod doesn't cut it. Using a tripod is mandatory, one with side arm capability if you need to get out over the set from the top (or a mini table top tripod if the layout permits such)
2- Mirror lock up (or live view if the camera offers that feature)
3- Use remote shutter release-they are cheap and don't have to be wireless
4- If you know "I'm going to have to crop a lot...", then why aren't you cropping it at the time of exposure? Do that cropping in camera, otherwise you are wasting data.
5- Ambient light level may not be enough. Think about adding your own hot lights to the scene.
6- "I stopped the camera all the way down.." will give you the most DOF, but the worst detail. Again, if quality and detail are upper most, using f/8 and focus stacking will have a bigger impact than whether you are using the 20D or not.
http://www.wonderfulphotos.com/articles/macro/focus_stacking/
also
http://www.heliconsoft.com/

Upgrading the camera will always help, but not optimizing your technique will be your enemy no matter what camera is used.



Apr 06, 2015 at 07:47 AM
surf monkey
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


SKMoss wrote:
Video is a huge bonus. I expect to get an UW housing and thats going to play a big part of my future diving. I volunteer for a veterans support group that uses SCUBA to help with PTSD. Getting UW video will be good.


Many good suggestions so far, but if video is important, than you should consider the 70D if you must stick to Canon. It's not really in your budget, but considering the very high cost of a decent UW housing and UW lighting setup, I think expanding your budget would make it a wise investment. More recent DSLRs have much better AF for video.
If FPS and video are necessary, then the 7Dii should also be on your radar, but that is obviously another jump in cost. You'll also want to consider a very fast wide angle lens for UW shooting.

Do some research on how video works on your list of potential bodies, because it can be a difficult transition from still shooting to video.



Apr 06, 2015 at 08:46 AM
Paul Gardner
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


I have several thousand 20D images which were shot in RAW. I suggest that you obtain a trial version of Photoshop CC and reprocess any of your files that were shot in RAW and also go out and shoot several hundred images in RAW and process them before upgrading the camera. If the current PS software had been available I doubt I would have upgraded. I skipped the 30D and tried the 40D which I promptly got rid of. The 5D was better, but not enough to satisfy the expense. There are several free classes available for PS, find one and learn how to expose without clipping and how to process RAW files. You may be supprised at how well the 20D files come out.
















Apr 06, 2015 at 09:53 AM
OntheRez
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Upgrading camera from 20d & 300d


The 20D in its day was a fine camera - it was my first DLSR, but time and tech have moved on. Unlike some opinions when I got my hands on a used 1DIIn for the first time I knew I had a "real" camera in my hands. It was likely a golden era for me when I was shooting the 1DIIn and the 1DsII. Both are superb within their design limitations and can be purchased in reasonable condition for absurdly low prices. You mention large hands and weight not being an issue so you might consider one of the older 1D - whatevers. I always own at least one 1D.

You mention video which forces you towards much newer cameras. I don't know what used 5DII are selling for but they are a fine camera if you can live with its AF limitations. A lot of superb pix taken with the 5DII. The later iterations of the 20D (50D - 70D) all had improvements and I can't say where they are price wise. Many people like(d) the 7D which used may be in your price range. I tried one for awhile and it didn’t cut it for my work. Couldn't get good IQ at higher ISO. (Others will disagree with me.)

Water proofing is another whole beast. If it truly needs to be waterproof (rather than moisture resistant which 1D's are) I'd suggest searching for waterproof cases and buying a camera to fit one of them.

Frankly the equation of video + better still performance + waterproof = $700 is going to be real hard to do. You may find you have to give on at least one of the variables.

Robert



Apr 06, 2015 at 11:04 AM
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