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Archive 2015 · Need help with Sandie edits

  
 
Sharona
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Need help with Sandie edits


Hello - I hope it's OK if I post this here. I seem to have lousy luck with the weather each year I head out to see the Sandhill Cranes here in Nebraska! Today I went out with an 800mm loaner, and used my Canon 1D4 for these images. It was terribly windy and dark (cloudy) all day. I will be out there Sat. night in an overnight blind and of course am hoping for better weather, but could some of you bird experts tell me if this type of image is salvageable? My goal is to get some crane behavioral type shots, and I finally got a wonderful courtship sequence but at ISO 1600 and f5.6, they are very dark and grainy. I am not great at getting noise out of photos and I wonder if it is worth trying with these. I bumped up the Exposure Comp when I realized these were so dark. I used the hood and roof of my car for support on these and shot from the road.

Anyway, I guess what I'd love to know is do any of you ever get shots this dull and are they "editable?" I seem to get mushy looking cranes unless I have the very best light, which hasn't been often.


Thanks in advance, SHaron



© Sharon Loudon 2015



Edited on Mar 25, 2015 at 07:48 PM · View previous versions



Mar 25, 2015 at 07:21 PM
arbitrage
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Need help with Sandie edits


Well my first thought in seeing the EXIF is why 1/8000. The most you need for a large bird like this is 1/1600 in my experience with eagles. If you had dropped down to even 1/2000 that would have dropped your ISO to 400. Then you could have just bumped up the ISO to around 640 and had a bit brighter image as this image is underexposed a bit. If the light is nice and constant I would shoot only in full manual mode and do a few test frames and check the histogram to get an exposure that is pushed to the right without any clipping. Do this when there is no action so you are all ready when action happens.

Now as to rescuing this image, it is hard to see at this small web size. At this size I can't even see any noise and a small bump in the exposure would lighten it up a bit. But I think the most important thing is to get the exposure right so they aren't dark and grainy. I find it is better to bump up the ISO as high as needed to get a nice bright image versus keeping the ISO low and getting a darker image. You usually end up with more noise in the darker image even if the ISO was lower.



Mar 25, 2015 at 07:47 PM
Sharona
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Need help with Sandie edits


Thank you for this. I just shot in Av mode, and I guess I thought I needed the ISO up to get the action in focus! Birds are not my forte! I admire more and more what I see here! So, you don't think it's just a resolving power issue, it's my exposure. I was preoccupied with the crappy weather as well, so I guess I was not thinking very clearly. So, I can decrease my ISO in these situations. (I didn't do much editing to this. But it's just soft and "mushy" looking. These birds have so little contrast. The other thing is that the 800 really hunted unless I had my focus point on the feathers, and not the eye which is where I usually place my focus point. (I've never shot with a lens this long, FWIW). Do you shoot birds in shutter priority?
Thank you again for the help, (she says, a little embarrassed...)



Mar 25, 2015 at 07:54 PM
arbitrage
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Need help with Sandie edits


I shoot 99% of the time in M mode. I set my exposure with a few test shots based off the histogram and go from there. I would concentrate on getting a good exposure no matter what ISO you need to achieve it. However, in the above shot I think you could have easily been down at 1/1000-1/2000 shutter speed and that would have got your ISO down considerably. But I do think you needed a bit more exposure in the example photo to get a cleaner image.

Make sure you set the focus limiter switch to the far - infinity setting to help with it getting focus. Unless you are close enough to need the lower range. That might help the focus. The good thing is it looks like the focus plane is right so I don't think you have to worry about any MFA adjustment for the rented lens.



Mar 25, 2015 at 08:09 PM
sbeme
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Need help with Sandie edits


Quick, dirty re-work. Much better results with more time, full sized capture an ideally RAW.
Cranes seem a bit soft and probably could be better sharpened than this quick rework. Adjusted B, W points, slight curves. Localized clarity/sharpness over two cranes. Noise reduction in DFine with masking over two cranes.

I have many pictures with less than ideal light, exposure that end up being keepers. I do find noise to be a problem, hurting extraction of detail.

I really like the "pose" of the two cranes and the BG, BTW. Worth the salvage.

Scott







Mar 25, 2015 at 08:26 PM
surfnron
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Need help with Sandie edits


To me, this is OK at a small size, but probably would not work any larger. If possible, try to get closer. you could lay on the ground with a tripod set real low, or use a groundpod. Cover yourself with a camo blanket, or something close to the color of the field. Of course, you may not be able to get permission to go on the land, so the car would be your fallback plan. If you have never shot while laying on the ground, schedule a back massage for after the shoot ~ Ron


Mar 25, 2015 at 08:57 PM
marklankton
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Need help with Sandie edits


My two bits (worth exactly what you are paying for it): the non-inspiring light can be discouraging but don't let it get you down. Some really nice images can be made in these conditions, though it takes more fiddling in post-processing. Scott's quick edit above should be encouraging for you. If you like a composition, work with it and see if you can make a final image that you enjoy.
Along with the comments from others about somewhat slower shutter speed which enables somewhat lower ISO and thus lower noise from your 1D4, I'll bet the biggest payoff will come from practicing stabilizing that 800mm somehow. From my experience, camera/lens motion is probably the biggest contributor to the slight softness, even though you would think that super-high shutter speeds would avoid that. Everyone says that every time you move to a significantly longer lens you have to learn how to make it work, and at least for me that has always been correct.
It is hard to shoot these critters in the dark, just ask the hordes of people who try! Keep at it, good luck, work hard on the images you get, and show us the results!
Mark



Mar 25, 2015 at 09:14 PM
Sharona
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Need help with Sandie edits


Hey - Thanks everyone. Just as an aside, I didn't do much to that image. I wanted you to be able to see what I was working with, although the raws are significantly darker. The thing is, the cranes are on private farm land, so no go on the tummy shooting, otherwise I'd be all over that. And really even getting out of your car is considered a no-no, in terms of disturbing the cranes. This is their last stop and I want their welfare to come first, which is why I'm doing a blind on the river where they roost this weekend. I have to agree that some of this was technique and today's outing was mostly for practice anyway. But damn, I got such a great sequence of these two birds, and was really disappointed in the IQ. It was VERY windy out there today, and I think even though it seemed I had the lens stable it probably wasn't. Will do more practicing tomorrow and Friday and will share my results after the weekend, if they're better!

BTW: I cannot get my camera to shoot in M mode. My 5D3, yes, but not the 1D4. I've got something set so that it won't adjust both aperture and shutter, and I have not had time to really figure out why. (I've read the manual, etc...)

Thanks once more!



Mar 25, 2015 at 10:25 PM
surfnron
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Need help with Sandie edits


Sharona wrote:
Hey - Thanks everyone. Just as an aside, I didn't do much to that image. I wanted you to be able to see what I was working with, although the raws are significantly darker. The thing is, the cranes are on private farm land, so no go on the tummy shooting, otherwise I'd be all over that. And really even getting out of your car is considered a no-no, in terms of disturbing the cranes. This is their last stop and I want their welfare to come first, which is why I'm doing a blind on the river where they
...Show more

Make sure the "on" button is all the way on. It's 3 position, (off - on - all on. I don't know the position names, but you get the idea). [just checked - pg 34] The second position does not allow the wheel to work.

Also, apply a little down pressure to the front of the lens with your left hand to dampen vibrations. I suggest you google "long lens technique". There are several good articles out there. I believe Moose Peterson has a short, but good one ~ Ron




Mar 26, 2015 at 08:07 AM
sbeme
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Need help with Sandie edits


Sharon,

Here's an Artie Morris article on long lens technique.
Interestingly it mentions his experience with the Canon 800 and 1D Mk IV.

http://www.outdoorphotographer.com/how-to/shooting/long-lens-tips-and-techniques.html#.VRVi4-GlEZx

Scott



Mar 27, 2015 at 09:03 AM





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