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Archive 2015 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?

  
 
anselwannab
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


I see that the T240 based Monochrom is rumored to be in the works soon.

http://leicarumors.com/2015/01/05/rumors-the-new-leica-monochrom-camera-will-be-announced-in-februarymarch.aspx/

I noticed that the launch of the M9 based Monochrom was about the same time as the announcement of the T240. Could the next Leica iteration be in the works soon? A T360 or T5?? even?

I think the current camera has held up technically, and camera refresh rates (outside of Sony) are getting longer. They hold their value (or at least price) over their production life time, so it seems if you are going to get one, it seems to makes more sense to get it earlier in its lifespan than latter. Plus, if a new one comes out, I'd like M9s to get to about the price of M8.2s and M T240 to M9 prices.

I haven't seen any posts or rumors lately.



Jan 12, 2015 at 06:14 PM
Mescalamba
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


They should use 36 mpix FF at least..


Jan 12, 2015 at 07:36 PM
jfreak
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


Mescalamba wrote:
They should use 36 mpix FF at least..


I feel the Achilles heel for leica has always been the whole electronic package to support the sensor. It's not just 36mp or 51mp or whatever. You need rest of the electronic components to support this sensor. Companies like sony, panasonic etc have these electronic expertise being electronics companies from the beginning but leica primarily has a different heritage.



Jan 12, 2015 at 07:55 PM
rscheffler
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


Another M is inevitable. If you look at the release digital M release cycle, it would seem announcement in 2015 is logical.

M8: 2006
M9: 2009
M240: 2012 (though shipping wasn't until early 2013, right?)

It might be a bit early to get a good feel for historical digital M resale values because IMO the popularity of the M9 and the difficulty Leica had keeping up with demand skewed resale values, nearly as much as was the case for M lens values. Leica seems to have been able to keep on top of M240 demand better. Yes, there was about a one year period between when they finally started shipping and when they were more or less easily found in stock, but during that time too, there were many opportunities for demo cameras. With the M240 being a much more modern camera and significantly better in certain areas of functionality, it's possible that whatever comes next may seem like a less dramatic upgrade and therefore a more difficult sell to the many who are very happy with their M9s and M240s.

I agree with Vik about Leica's electronics. Maybe it's a German thing? Anyway, you have to give Leica some credit for their rapid progress between the M8/9 and S2 and M240. Especially between the M9 and M240. For me at least, the M9 is like using a DSLR from 2001 and the M240 is a decade more advanced.

Going higher megapixel will be double-edged. The Ms are very much handheld shooting platforms that don't really excel on a tripod. Stick in a 36+ MP sensor and technique becomes ever more critical. Already with the M9 and M240 I can easily see the consequences of lax technique when I shoot with 50mm+ lenses in the 1/180-1/360 range. And for some reason I have a very difficult time avoiding camera shake with vertical shots at 1/125 and 50mm... That said, I've shot a bunch of M lenses on the a7R and I can't think of any that couldn't out resolve that sensor (for central resolution). Maybe there's a market for an M technical camera with 50+ MP? Well, I image at some point we'll all be shooting 100+ MP and not thinking much about it.



Jan 12, 2015 at 08:15 PM
uhoh7
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


Mescalamba wrote:
They should use 36 mpix FF at least..

Why? I sent the Sony 36 back.

It's the quality, not the quantity.

I don't think anyone should hold their breath on a new color M, the 240 only became readily available last spring. If they do replace, I hope they come to their senses and give us back the M6 footptint.



Jan 12, 2015 at 08:27 PM
jfreak
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


I agree with Ron on the handheld ability of Leica. I remember, denoir (Luka) had posted a lot of handheld shots in low light and gave the M9 the ability to overcome poor high ISO limitation. I agree this does no apply if your subject is moving and all that. I would not like to lose this charm of Leica for high pixel count and resolution.

Unless Leica can come up with options like sony for those who want higher MP. I think 24 is probably the far end of pixel count before it starts to show the problem in handheld as seen with sony a7r. I am sure a group of people will like the medium format resolution in Leica body for which the sensor needs to by higher MP and thus saying may be a sony approach.



Jan 12, 2015 at 10:22 PM
anselwannab
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


uhoh7 wrote:
Why? I sent the Sony 36 back.

It's the quality, not the quantity.

I don't think anyone should hold their breath on a new color M, the 240 only became readily available last spring. If they do replace, I hope they come to their senses and give us back the M6 footptint.


I agree. I've only demo'd a 240 and I found it a little chunky. My CL is almost too small for my hands.



Jan 13, 2015 at 12:06 AM
Mescalamba
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


jfreak wrote:
I feel the Achilles heel for leica has always been the whole electronic package to support the sensor. It's not just 36mp or 51mp or whatever. You need rest of the electronic components to support this sensor. Companies like sony, panasonic etc have these electronic expertise being electronics companies from the beginning but leica primarily has a different heritage.


Not sure its true, cause they always used Kodak sensors (even M240 is from same people, just brandame is different). There isnt much more to be squeezed from those sensors. Sure electronics werent up to date (M9 is.. bit slow to say at least), but sensors are simply kinda "old when new". Leica T thanks to having Sony sensor has suprisingly nice output. Would be nice if electronics and sensor in new M was that good..

And why 36 mpix? Cause difference between 24 mpix BW and 36 mpix converted to BW isnt that much.. unless you like that whole RF experience thing (thats nice, sure..).



Jan 13, 2015 at 10:58 AM
ryankarr
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


Leica and Panasonic expanded their partnership in September, which to me reads that Panasonic electronics will be used more in Leica cameras.

"Leica will be able through the expansion and strengthening of technological cooperation to utilize Panasonic's digital technology in its own product development. "

http://news.panasonic.net/archives/2014/0919_29096.html




Jan 13, 2015 at 11:19 AM
rscheffler
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?



Mescalamba wrote:
Not sure its true, cause they always used Kodak sensors (even M240 is from same people, just brandame is different). There isnt much more to be squeezed from those sensors. Sure electronics werent up to date (M9 is.. bit slow to say at least), but sensors are simply kinda "old when new".


Not sure about this. From my understanding, Kodak only supplied sensors, such as for the DMR, M8, M9, S2. M8 and M9 (and assume DMR) electronics were outsourced (the company's name escapes me but was mentioned in an interview with Leica about the M9's development - electronics weren't done in-house due to limited resources, so were pretty much ported over from the M8, hence the reason the M9's electronics 'feel' old...). S2 electronics development was in-house, though the Maestro processor is from Fujitsu. The M240 is similar, though the sensor is from CMOSIS (since acquired by ON Semi), the founders of which were previously from FillFactory. FillFactory supplied Kodak with the 14MP FF sensor for the DCS-14 camera. I can't find any reference, upon a cursory search, of a connection between FillFactory and Kodak's in-house sensor division....



Jan 13, 2015 at 01:29 PM
Mescalamba
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Leica M Monochrom Rumor - harbinger of a new(er) M coming?


ryankarr wrote:
Leica and Panasonic expanded their partnership in September, which to me reads that Panasonic electronics will be used more in Leica cameras.

"Leica will be able through the expansion and strengthening of technological cooperation to utilize Panasonic's digital technology in its own product development. "

http://news.panasonic.net/archives/2014/0919_29096.html



That might explain why Leica T is working like fast smartphone.



Jan 13, 2015 at 02:11 PM





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