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Archive 2014 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?

  
 
thebeginning
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


Does anyone offer final images to brides via online download only?

It would save me *tons* of time to do that instead of burning discs/ordering custom USBs.

I don't disclose how I package and deliver my images to clients, so I may be able to make the switch and frame it as something 'fast and easy to share with family'.


Anyone have thoughts on positives or negatives, aside from missing the 'tangible factor'?


More importantly, is there a site/service like this for photographers to dump 5-7Gb of files at a time? I'd rather use something a little more fancy/specialized than just Dropbox.








Dec 22, 2014 at 01:13 AM
dhp_sf
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


I've only delivered a couple of weddings via digital download (international clients). I've started only delivering portrait / engagement session files via download though.

Zenfolio, which I use (and probably Smugmug) allows for a "download full gallery" option in the viewing pages for clients, but it doesn't offer an option to download at different sizes, I don't think. Zenfolio has plans that allow unlimited uploads for a reasonable annual price. If you want to sign up you can use my referral code: XT8-CBN-EAH (it gets you 10% off and gives me 10% off). It's pretty customizable and can look quite good.

Positives: It's really easy (generally) to download. And you can get files to your clients much faster. Lots of savings on shipping/packaging

Negatives: Much higher risk of losing sales to other guests/family members as they can simply download the images and have it printed wherever. So if print sales to guests are a big factor for you it may not be as ideal. Clients may be less inclined to download everything and expect you to keep everything available (unless you tell them otherwise).

I think the experience of the tangible packaging can be made up with a really good gallery experience.



Dec 22, 2014 at 01:24 AM
D. Diggler
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


thebeginning wrote:

Anyone have thoughts on positives or negatives


I use the product packaging to support my brand. Impress the girls with a nice package.




Dec 22, 2014 at 01:35 AM
myam203
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


I use Zenfolio and always deliver via an online gallery, mainly because it's easy. I resize to 4000px on the long side at a quality that gives me files smaller than 2 MB each. My last wedding was less than a gig for 520 images—I don't think people would be thrilled about downloading 5+ gigs of images.

The presentation is pretty nice and it's super easy to just upload and send clients a link, but I've considered moving to USBs instead. One reason is my wife, a recent bride, feels that brides appreciate tangible things like that, maybe with a complimentary print or gift to end our relationship on a high note.



Dec 22, 2014 at 01:45 AM
thebeginning
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


myam203 wrote:
I use Zenfolio and always deliver via an online gallery, mainly because it's easy. I resize to 4000px on the long side at a quality that gives me files smaller than 2 MB each. My last wedding was less than a gig for 520 images—I don't think people would be thrilled about downloading 5+ gigs of images.

The presentation is pretty nice and it's super easy to just upload and send clients a link, but I've considered moving to USBs instead. One reason is my wife, a recent bride, feels that brides appreciate tangible things like that, maybe with a
...Show more


Dude holy crap...is that exporting from Lightroom? I resize to 3500px, 300dpi, 90 quality and my weddings are like 4Gb each (~700 images)



Dec 22, 2014 at 02:04 AM
D. Diggler
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


myam203 wrote:

my wife, a recent bride, feels that brides appreciate tangible things like that, maybe with a complimentary print or gift to end our relationship on a high note


We men need to think like women in this business instead of like techno-geeks. I often distribute a complimentary fancy-framed print with the final delivery.



Dec 22, 2014 at 02:28 AM
myam203
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


thebeginning wrote:
Dude holy crap...is that exporting from Lightroom? I resize to 3500px, 300dpi, 90 quality and my weddings are like 4Gb each (~700 images)


Yeah from Lightroom. Your quality setting is much higher than necessary IMO. I use 62... here is a 100% crop of a file (re-saved in PS even). Most clients won't make huge prints anyway, and this will make an awesome 8x10+ print or a huge canvas easily. In the past, I never printed enough to get a feel for proper file sizes, but now I have a good sense of what works and what is overkill.

Third time sharing this link, but always useful! http://regex.info/blog/lightroom-goodies/jpeg-quality







Dec 22, 2014 at 02:34 AM
glort
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?



Without trying to upset anyone ( which I'll do anyway) the whole online delivery thing -to me- is rather hypocritical to a lot of the parroted mantra shooters go on with and it's also shooting onself in the foot for a lot of extra profit potential.

Many shooters crap on like primmadonna's about the idea only they can edit their pics to their ultimate perfection, only they can know how to shoot and work their clients images to a standard no one else could, they go on about their brand and reputation ad Nauseum.
Then, they go and deliver those images unprinted, not in an album, with no layout to make the most of the presentation of them on the page, without little enhancements like borders and graphics that make such a difference....
To me it's just not Cricket.

And once the couple get these images the shooter has doted over like a mother hen, what happens then? Are they destined to be shown on mal ajusted computer monitors and maybe TV screens? Maybe bastardised and stuck on face waste to be viewed on tiny phone screens or printed on a machine of quality as questionable and nexts years weather and then -maybe- stuck in some cheap arse chinese album that will degrade the pics and are slapped in with as much knowledge and skill as a photographer could apply to brain surgery.

There is a lot more to a good wedding coverage than the pics and editing thereof.

Another common trend with shooters is their cult like beliefs and opinions that every wedding must be blogged in order to generate new business. That to me seems ironic when they are just going to give the couple a bunch of images over the net.
I haven't blogged a wedding or anything else in my life but to this day, I get loads of brides coming to me whom never knew I existed but saw the girl at works album I shot or their neighbour, friends cousins etc. And repeatedly, thats a lot more frequent to be a year or 3 ago, not last week.

Every single album plan I do I wow people with shots they will tell me they aren't really interested in till I show them how they go together on the page and work to compliment each other and help tell the story. Thats the way I shot them in the first place with that in mind.

It's a case of the sum being a lot more than the individual parts especialy when you throw another part in like an album that a lot of brides carry round with them like a handbag for months after the wedding showing it round to anyone that will stand still long enough for the newlywed to get it out of the box with the little engraved plaque on the front I put there for them. They see my name on cards in the front and back covers of the album and the pile I throw in the bottom of the box which always get handed out.

From the profit POV, I work and always have, on getting a basic coverage fee and then upselling. I find it much easier to sell something tangiable, even in the form of an electronic image when I have it, IE after the wedding, than before where I'm effectively saying " Imagine this".
I can't remember a couple who weren't blown away with their pics and said something to the effect that they didn't think -THEY- would look so good in the pics. By selling the package before you have this leverage to deal with, a shooter is really selling themselves short of maximising what they can get out of each couple.

The idea with digital delivery seems to be to get the pics out the door asap, save time not having to meet with the pesky clients again and get to the next couple as fast as you can. Used car dealers work in the same price range we do yet give their clients more love.

My knowledge of marketing tells me it's a lot easier, cheaper, more profitable and less hassel to work with less people you can get the same amount of money from at the end of the year than working with a heap more.
To me, the job isn't finished till the pics are printed to the same standards as they were created ( and often edited to death) and in a finished album that is of the same quality as what was put into the pics and reflects that.

I understand Digital delivery for lower end job where you have to get what you can out of the clients but to deliver ones preimum work over the net just flys in the face of what so many proport to stand for and to me seems a highly unprofessional and impersonal delivery of customer service amoungst anything else.

I have always spent time with customers on the phone for initial inquirys, I have always met them in person for showings, bookings, confirmations, album plans and deliverys and the reasons for continuing to do so are only mounting not diminishing to me.

I can sell an elegant looking album that has class and oozes value and looks like a family eirloom that looks like a craftsman and artist put it together a lot easier than I can sell a bunch of images that the clients can't see any of the effort and skill that went into them even if they are 3-4 times the price.

Sure it takes more time but my hourly rate is higher than what I would get doing things the other way. Seeing as I haven't yet figured a way to get paid for sitting on my arse and it has always been a lot easier to get the max profit out of existing clients that deal with more new ones, I can't see me ever going to online delivery.

For those in the low end market, it may be a worthwhile time saving ioption but I'd still be able to milk those same clients for a lot better return by giving them something tangible even if it were a disk or USB.

The marketing and referal value along makes a physical delivery a far better proposition for my business.


Anyway, that's my observation on the subject for what little it's probably worth.



Dec 22, 2014 at 03:19 AM
scottam10
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


I think it's hard enough for photographers to justify multi-thousand dollar price tags for what appears to be a single day's work. Give the client something tangible to show off and convince them they got value for money.


Dec 22, 2014 at 03:51 AM
thebeginning
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


scottam10 wrote:
I think it's hard enough for photographers to justify multi-thousand dollar price tags for what appears to be a single day's work. Give the client something tangible to show off and convince them they got value for money.


Wait are you saying even you can't justify your price tag, so you need tangibles to balance that?

Or that most 'average folk' can't justify the price for themselves?




Dec 22, 2014 at 04:42 AM
thebeginning
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


glort wrote:
Without trying to upset anyone ( which I'll do anyway) the whole online delivery thing -to me- is rather hypocritical to a lot of the parroted mantra shooters go on with and it's also shooting onself in the foot for a lot of extra profit potential.

Many shooters crap on like primmadonna's about the idea only they can edit their pics to their ultimate perfection, only they can know how to shoot and work their clients images to a standard no one else could, they go on about their brand and reputation ad Nauseum.
Then, they go and deliver those
...Show more


k.




It should be said that this is a business as well, not just some 'I'm a fabulous artist' wankery. I started with a method more like yours several years ago, but demands changed. It makes far more business sense for me to focus on up-front sales rather than long drawn out album ordering processes and complicated (or worse, forced) sentimentalities of how my work should be viewed. There's a time and a place for educating and surprising the client with something beautiful, but when it takes me 5x the amount of time for the same amount of money, I just don't see it as feasible. And as an important note, this isn't a high vs. low end issue, at least in my market.




Dec 22, 2014 at 04:49 AM
ricardovaste
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


TRReichman wrote:
I didn't intend to be condescending. My point is that packaging is a factor that positively impact a particular segment of the market. It is irrelevant to other segments and it pays to know who you are marketing to. Some people view packaging as trying to polish a turd. If your core product is executing in the way that it should the packaging becomes irrelevant.

Plus, packaging enters the client-experience chain at an odd time. I would imagine that most people want the client to enjoy the product and not the package. For the package to have lasting value the
...Show more

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1221082/2



Dec 22, 2014 at 05:45 AM
scottam10
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


thebeginning wrote:
Wait are you saying even you can't justify your price tag, so you need tangibles to balance that?

Or that most 'average folk' can't justify the price for themselves?



I mean average folk need help justifying the price for themselves



Dec 22, 2014 at 07:44 AM
IrishDino
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


I do online delivery only for engagement and family sessions. I don't deliver enough or charge enough to justify a full fledged tangible product delivery.

For weddings, I always deliver on a USB. In 2015, I'm delivering them in custom hand made wood boxes. And as soon as portable hand drives drop in price, I'll probably switch to them.

I've used custom USBs in the past, but the quality simply isn't there.



Dec 22, 2014 at 09:15 AM
MRomine
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


glort wrote:
Without trying to upset anyone ( which I'll do anyway) the whole online delivery thing -to me- is rather hypocritical to a lot of the parroted mantra shooters go on with and it's also shooting onself in the foot for a lot of extra profit potential.


Although I don't always agree with everything that you write but I do enjoy reading all of your posts for they are always thought provoking and they make me, at least, examine what I'm doing and how I might be able to do things better and more profitably.

glort wrote:
To me it's just not Cricket.


Not sure what this means, care to elaborate?

glort wrote:
Another common trend with shooters is their cult like beliefs and opinions that every wedding must be blogged in order to generate new business. That to me seems ironic when they are just going to give the couple a bunch of images over the net.
I haven't blogged a wedding or anything else in my life but to this day, I get loads of brides coming to me whom never knew I existed but saw the girl at works album I shot or their neighbour, friends cousins etc. And repeatedly, thats a lot more frequent to be a year
...Show more

I think this is really interesting how well this works for you, showing that various business models can work successfully. Now that does not mean that those who are blogging are doing their business a disservice.

glort wrote:
I understand Digital delivery for lower end job where you have to get what you can out of the clients but to deliver ones preimum work over the net just flys in the face of what so many proport to stand for and to me seems a highly unprofessional and impersonal delivery of customer service amoungst anything else.


Impersonal, yes; unprofessional, I would never call it that. Clients love it and the interface of digital downloads can be very nice and certainly look very professional.

glort wrote:
I have always spent time with customers on the phone for initial inquirys, I have always met them in person for showings, bookings, confirmations, album plans and deliverys and the reasons for continuing to do so are only mounting not diminishing to me.


This maybe somewhat different due to the different cultures of the U.S. and down under. I find it very difficult to get a prospective bride to answer her phone. In the U.S. people are very reluctant to answer their phones if they do not quickly recognize the phone number of the caller. Too much phone spam here in the U.S. Plus many Americans are fearful of being sold or being talked into buying something that they may later regret from a cleaver sales person.

Additionally, like many here, a large chunk of my clients live more than an hour from me and simply are not willing to come back to the studio for any kind of sales session.



Dec 22, 2014 at 10:38 AM
mineymole
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


I've been doing online delivery of files and so far my clients love how easy it is.


Dec 22, 2014 at 11:18 AM
SGallant
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


A lot of my clients are a distance from me as well. I do online delivery for all my weddings, makes everyone's lives so much easier.


Dec 22, 2014 at 11:54 AM
LeeSimms
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


We're on track to shoot 100 weddings in 2015 ... so yeah, I like digital download. No complaint from the clients so far.




Dec 22, 2014 at 11:58 AM
wenkanzhu
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


In my market, few people will bother looking at their wedding albums after the day of. So something ready to be shared online is obviously what they want. However, I believe USB drive is better than downloading, because USB can be erased and used in their daily life, giving the potential clients a chance to know you.


Dec 22, 2014 at 12:11 PM
rondphoto
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · 'Online Only' Delivery for Clients?


D. Diggler wrote:
I use the product packaging to support my brand. Impress the girls with a nice package.



I'd love to see your package.



Dec 22, 2014 at 12:13 PM
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