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Archive 2014 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays

  
 
flyfishertoo
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


Canon or the local camera store where I bought it?

On the fence about my 2nd copy. If I return it, does the local store take the hit, or does it pass on to Canon?



Dec 18, 2014 at 09:45 PM
bipock
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


I would think it goes to Canon. They sent a defective item (assuming it is defective) and their loss. If you're just returning it, I would think your store will either charge you a restock fee or just resale it/demo it. In the later, they take the hit.


Dec 18, 2014 at 09:50 PM
flyfishertoo
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


bipock wrote:
I would think it goes to Canon. They sent a defective item (assuming it is defective) and their loss. If you're just returning it, I would think your store will either charge you a restock fee or just resale it/demo it. In the later, they take the hit.


If I return it, I wouldn't be returning just to be returning it. I waited and waited and waited for this camera. But, I can't get a photo that looks sharp to me. I know it is a big step up in sophistication from my 40D, but if I can't get a sharp photo out of the box using the default settings with center point and 4 point expansion, seems like a camera issue to me.



Dec 18, 2014 at 10:13 PM
big country
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


Have you called and spoke to canon?


Dec 18, 2014 at 10:22 PM
ashley138
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


I had this same problem. I say you return it. Hard to say who takes the hit but hopefully the seller returns it to Canon. I had a clear issue with mine and already returned it to Adorama for a new copy.


Dec 18, 2014 at 10:23 PM
EB-1
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


bipock wrote:
I would think it goes to Canon. They sent a defective item (assuming it is defective) and their loss. If you're just returning it, I would think your store will either charge you a restock fee or just resale it/demo it. In the later, they take the hit.

flyfishertoo wrote:
If I return it, I wouldn't be returning just to be returning it. I waited and waited and waited for this camera. But, I can't get a photo that looks sharp to me. I know it is a big step up in sophistication from my 40D, but if I can't get a sharp photo out of the box using the default settings with center point and 4 point expansion, seems like a camera issue to me.


If the body is defective with a clear reason, then send it back. The store will send it to Canon. They will fix it (one hopes) and eventually it will become a refurbished item.

EBH



Dec 18, 2014 at 10:28 PM
UCSB
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


flyfishertoo wrote:
If I return it, I wouldn't be returning just to be returning it. I waited and waited and waited for this camera. But, I can't get a photo that looks sharp to me. I know it is a big step up in sophistication from my 40D, but if I can't get a sharp photo out of the box using the default settings with center point and 4 point expansion, seems like a camera issue to me.


I suspect you are viewing the images at 100%. The lower res cameras like the 40D always looked sharper at the pixel level than the higher resolution cameras. I suspect what you are seeing is normal and you need to recalibrate your eye. Why not post a link to a test shot ... many here will be able to tell you immediately if there is an issue. Bottom line is what you are seeing is probably normal.




Dec 18, 2014 at 10:59 PM
EB-1
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


bipock wrote:
I would think it goes to Canon. They sent a defective item (assuming it is defective) and their loss. If you're just returning it, I would think your store will either charge you a restock fee or just resale it/demo it. In the later, they take the hit.

flyfishertoo wrote:
If I return it, I wouldn't be returning just to be returning it. I waited and waited and waited for this camera. But, I can't get a photo that looks sharp to me. I know it is a big step up in sophistication from my 40D, but if I can't get a sharp photo out of the box using the default settings with center point and 4 point expansion, seems like a camera issue to me.

UCSB wrote:
I suspect you are viewing the images at 100%. The lower res cameras like the 40D always looked sharper at the pixel level than the higher resolution cameras. I suspect what you are seeing is normal and you need to recalibrate your eye. Why not post a link to a test shot ... many here will be able to tell you immediately if there is an issue. Bottom line is what you are seeing is probably normal.


Perhaps expectations are unrealistic, but it's not difficult to obtain a sharp image from a 20MP ~APS-C image with a good lens.

EBH



Dec 18, 2014 at 11:17 PM
flyfishertoo
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


big country wrote:
Have you called and spoke to canon?


Hadn't thought of that, but what will they tell me or have me do?



Dec 18, 2014 at 11:32 PM
flyfishertoo
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


UCSB wrote:
I suspect you are viewing the images at 100%. The lower res cameras like the 40D always looked sharper at the pixel level than the higher resolution cameras. I suspect what you are seeing is normal and you need to recalibrate your eye. Why not post a link to a test shot ... many here will be able to tell you immediately if there is an issue. Bottom line is what you are seeing is probably normal.



You are correct that I am viewing at 100% and comparing against what I see in my 40D. Why would the lower res cameras looker sharper? I would be happy to post an image(s). What would be best, RAW, jpg, other?

I hope all is fine. As I said, I really want the camera and hope it is just me.



Dec 18, 2014 at 11:35 PM
scalesusa
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


Every time a new camera body is introduced, I see a lot of articles about sharp images and the inability to get them.

Apparently, there are a number of pretty good photographers who received defective cameras and a number of photographers who received good cameras but have not mastered them. Neither one is going to be happy, so returning their cameras seems like a reasonable thing to do.



Dec 18, 2014 at 11:36 PM
flyfishertoo
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


scalesusa wrote:
Every time a new camera body is introduced, I see a lot of articles about sharp images and the inability to get them.

Apparently, there are a number of pretty good photographers who received defective cameras and a number of photographers who received good cameras but have not mastered them. Neither one is going to be happy, so returning their cameras seems like a reasonable thing to do.


If it is me, I don't have a problem putting in the time to figure out what I am doing wrong, and making it work. I have used my 40D for I believe 8+ years. I intend to do the same with the 7D2. As long as I know it is me and that I am not fighting a losing battle in trying to figure it out.

I have no problem admitting that I am the weak spot in the process. Just looking for help in making that determination.



Dec 18, 2014 at 11:43 PM
Ben Horne
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


flyfishertoo wrote:
Canon or the local camera store where I bought it?

On the fence about my 2nd copy. If I return it, does the local store take the hit, or does it pass on to Canon?


the camera store gets dinged with credit cards each way. Make sure there is actually something wrong with it. When you move to a camera with a more sophisticated autofocus system, it takes time to get comfortable with it. Just because the camera has a pro AF system doesn't mean everything will magically be in focus -- it just means you have many more variables to adjust. :-)



Dec 19, 2014 at 12:20 AM
big country
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


Canon may send you a return label and you can get your camera checked out.

I had issues w/ my 7D II. some people said it was me.

Here is the kind of shots i was getting before sending the camera to canon:




here are the kind of shots i am getting after getting the camera back:












Do what you want, but if you want a 7D II, i'd call canon and tell them to send me a shipping label instead of dealing getting another defective camera.



Dec 19, 2014 at 12:55 AM
melcat
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


flyfishertoo wrote:
...I am viewing at 100% and comparing against what I see in my 40D. Why would the lower res cameras looker sharper?


It's the wrong thing to do because the 7D has twice as many pixels and therefore the image on screen viewed at 100% is stretched 1.4× along any given line. This means any lens aberration, poor technique, diffraction, atmospheric haze, wobbly tripod etc. is multiplied 1.4× on the 7D.

The correct method is to upres the 40D image to the same size as the 7D one and compare that to the 7D image. Alternatively, if the 40D's resolution is sufficient for your uses, downres the 7D image and verify it's at least as good as the one from the 40D.

Also make sure both images have the same amount of sharpening (most usefully, none). I've seen some arbitrary defaults in raw processors, so check the actual values in the panel rather than using the defaults for comparison.





Dec 19, 2014 at 01:43 AM
flyfishertoo
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


melcat wrote:
It's the wrong thing to do because the 7D has twice as many pixels and therefore the image on screen viewed at 100% is stretched 1.4× along any given line. This means any lens aberration, poor technique, diffraction, atmospheric haze, wobbly tripod etc. is multiplied 1.4× on the 7D.

The correct method is to upres the 40D image to the same size as the 7D one and compare that to the 7D image. Alternatively, if the 40D's resolution is sufficient for your uses, downres the 7D image and verify it's at least as good as the one from the 40D.

Also make
...Show more

I think that I understand what you are saying, not I'm not 100% certain. So do I not want to want to view at any enlarged detail, or do I want to stop at 50%? In all the years since I have been using RAW, I was always under the impression that to sharpen, I needed to view at 100%. Not true, or no longer true.



Dec 19, 2014 at 05:30 AM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


the problem is that the world (photographic) has grown up obsessed with the 100% crop as measure of an image .

the 100% button should be used sparingly and the user should have some knowledge about what they are looking at .

i went from a 40D to a 7D and yeah when you hit the 100% button the 40D looks better . but then if you view the 40D file at 150% or 200% it looks worse . but these magnifications are closer to what the 7D produces @ 100% .

but think about it for a minute . what sort of print size would a 20mp file produce if printed at the same size as the 100% representation on YOUR screen ? I say YOUR screen because for all we know you could be viewing on a huge 1080 p TV and then standing less than a foot away from it (you could probably see each pixel like that )


And to you original question of who pays ?
it Will be the Store . for a retail outlet thats the danger of dealing in distance selling . if someone buys something and there is a fault then the retailer has to (at least in the UK where I am) pay the cost of the return .
If there isn't a fault (i.e. you've changed your mind) then they can charge you return shipping or you can arrange the shipping yourself . although quite a few will cover that cost also as your more likely to buy other stuff in the future if you have that Safety net

if you don't like the idea of some retail outlet covering the cost then you always have the option of walking into a proper brick and mortar store and walkin out with the item



Dec 19, 2014 at 06:11 AM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


flyfishertoo wrote:
I think that I understand what you are saying, not I'm not 100% certain. So do I not want to want to view at any enlarged detail, or do I want to stop at 50%? In all the years since I have been using RAW, I was always under the impression that to sharpen, I needed to view at 100%. Not true, or no longer true.


yes sharpen at 100% but view your results at 'normal' and then go back and adjust to taste . you will soon build up a recipe(s) of sharpen amount and NR amounts that works best for THAT camera rather than a set of numbers used for something else .



Dec 19, 2014 at 06:15 AM
melcat
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


flyfishertoo wrote:
I think that I understand what you are saying, not I'm not 100% certain. So do I not want to want to view at any enlarged detail, or do I want to stop at 50%?


(I'll carry on below assuming the 7D Mk II has exactly 2× the pixels as the 40D for clarity; actually the 1/√2 should be 3888/5472, which is still 71%.)

You would want to stop at 1/√2 or 71%, except that Photoshop is known to have bugs when scaling to screen at odd values. If it worked, this would be equivalent to downresing. You would be able to see whether the 7D Mk II was as sharp as the 40D, but not see how much better it is.

The best way is to upres a 40D sample image, making sure to disable any extra sharpening that might be bundled in with it (I don't have Photoshop in front of me and forget what's offered). Upres by √2 , or to 141%.



Dec 19, 2014 at 06:18 AM
mogud
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · If I return my 7D Mk II, who pays


I'm confused about the question. Respectively, why do you care who pays?

You purchased an item from a retail establishment that allows you to return that item if you are not satisfied. Can you return the camera to the store or have you gone past the return time period? If you can still return the camera, walk to the store and return it. Either get a new camera or a credit against your credit card.

If you bought the camera online, and still within the return period, call/email the online store and ask them how to return purchases. If you are past the return period, whether purchased online or not, then you have to call/email Canon Service and follow their instruction about shipping the camera to Canon Service for repair.

As an aside, I buy all my lenses and cameras from a retail store and not online so if I have an issue, I return whatever to the store. Just me....




Dec 19, 2014 at 08:39 AM
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