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Archive 2014 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.

  
 
dhphoto
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


I think I'm pretty good with the LR5 controls, I can sharpen pretty well and use the clarity slider (with the others) to get very near the results I want.

But I still can't manage the equivalent of a final crisp up with a de-haze ps action - a nice little unsharp mask to get a little grip on the finished file, my results always look a tad flat, whatever I do.

Does anyone have any clever tricks? I still find myself having to go into PS to achieve this last little 5% and perhaps there's a control I could use better.

Thoughts and ideas gratefully accepted and yes I do want to use LR, I love it.



Nov 24, 2014 at 01:10 PM
dlabrecque
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Sometimes moving the contrast level creates some marginal improvement, but you may have to look outside of Lightroom for a more dedicated haze limiter. If anyone's got a better method, I wouldn't learning about it myself.


Nov 24, 2014 at 01:30 PM
OntheRez
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Plugins are often helpful. I've had some luck with Topaz' Affects though the whole package gets wonky on me sometimes - particularly the deNoise program. Also onOne Perfect Effects plugin has been useful, but now I'm increasingly using DXO v.10 from within Lr for difficult images. It has some rather nice tools. I'm sure you know that in Ps there are all sorts of voodoo and black art that can help the haze problem, but it takes blood, soul, and time to learn a lot of those.

Robert



Nov 24, 2014 at 02:17 PM
Jman13
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


I've found this to work well for me to punch up an image: pull highlights and push shadows with their sliders to flatten the file a bit and save highlights, THEN use the contrast slider to increase the overall image contrast. Because you've pushed and pulled the extremes, they won't clip and go too bright and dark, but you will add much needed contrast to the midtones. Clarity, of course, is a more local contrast. In images that are already very flat, simply dropping the black point can help quite a bit.


Nov 24, 2014 at 02:23 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


dhphoto wrote:
I think I'm pretty good with the LR5 controls, I can sharpen pretty well and use the clarity slider (with the others) to get very near the results I want.

But I still can't manage the equivalent of a final crisp up with a de-haze ps action - a nice little unsharp mask to get a little grip on the finished file, my results always look a tad flat, whatever I do.

Does anyone have any clever tricks? I still find myself having to go into PS to achieve this last little 5% and perhaps there's a control I could use better.

Thoughts
...Show more

Clarity slider. Perhaps reduce the saturation of the blue channel a bit. Steepen the luminosity curve.



Nov 24, 2014 at 03:39 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Not an LR user, but I find the issue of haze to be a cast that you have over your image. While Dan points out the reduction in blue, this doesn't fully address the impact the haze is having on other colors, so they may still be a little "dirty" with the blue.

Double check the critical WB of your true neutrals (shadow, mid and high) ... correcting by some form of hue adjustment, which will also effect the non-blue's just a tad. Subtle, but that last 5% you are talking about may be found in the remaining cast that is stealing that little bit of your contrast/clarity in the other colors.

Personally, this was for me the most important reason I committed to PS instead of LR (former versions anyway) because of the Color Balance layer ability to address and fine tune shadow/mid/high independently that was in PS, but not LR (not sure @ current versions).



Nov 24, 2014 at 04:31 PM
dhphoto
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Thanks for the replies. I've tried the clarity slider a lot and that's not doing it. I will try reducing the blue channel a tad


Nov 24, 2014 at 05:44 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


RustyBug wrote:
Not an LR user, but I find the issue of haze to be a cast that you have over your image. While Dan points out the reduction in blue, this doesn't fully address the impact the haze is having on other colors, so they may still be a little "dirty" with the blue.

Double check the critical WB of your true neutrals (shadow, mid and high) ... correcting by some form of hue adjustment, which will also effect the non-blue's just a tad. Subtle, but that last 5% you are talking about may be found in the remaining cast that
...Show more

When an image is hazy... the image is hazy. :-) It is hard go make a thing look like something other than what it is, or at least to do so perfectly.

Haze has a whole range of effects on photographs:

- lower contrast
- less color saturation
- color shifts, often toward blue to not always quite that simple
- lessening of detail, particularly in low contrast areas
- softening of the light in shadows

There are several ways to deal with the issue of haze:

- Learn to love haze! I think that it often creates a much more interesting image that perfectly crystal clear light and atmosphere. In particular it can increase the sense of depth in some images through atmospheric recession. Shooting into the haze can create especially luminous light effects.

- Wait for different conditions. If you don't like haze, and that's what you have, and you don't want to shoot in it... you might need to come back later. If you can...

- Try to compensate in post by adjusting various parameters that affect the things listed above. You can reduce the appearance of atmospheric haze, but — in my view — you cannot really completely eliminate it, at least not in all cases.

Regarding "flatness" in the image, you might be able to improve this (or at least counteract it) by several means that are not about sharpening. For example, local curves adjustments to increase the dynamic range of certain key areas of the iimage can make things pop a bit more. (You can also do the opposite — soften the areas that are not primary, thus making the primary areas seem more vibrant by contrast.) It can sometimes be possible to do something similar with local saturation adjustments — either by slightly desaturating less central elements and/or by slightly increasing saturation in the primary areas of visual focus. Sometimes vignetting the image just a bit can make the center seem more vibrant.

Good luck.

Dan



Nov 24, 2014 at 08:06 PM
butchM
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


gdanmitchell wrote:
Clarity slider.


Ditto ... tweak contrast and possibly add an S-curve or maybe increase Blacks as needed. Just be careful not to crush shadow detail or add artifacts to contrasty edges.

Though the definition of "hazy" can mean many things to users ... what works well to add little punch for local contrast lost due to the digital capture process can be quite different from actual haze (moisture/smog content in the air) ... the latter may be more difficult to remove ...



Nov 24, 2014 at 08:11 PM
dhphoto
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


butchM wrote:
Ditto ... tweak contrast and possibly add an S-curve or maybe increase Blacks as needed. Just be careful not to crush shadow detail or add artifacts to contrasty edges.

Though the definition of "hazy" can mean many things to users ... what works well to add little punch for local contrast lost due to the digital capture process can be quite different from actual haze (moisture/smog content in the air) ... the latter may be more difficult to remove ...


Yes I'm using 'haze' in the 'not quite as crisp and contrasty as I'd like' context, this is not atmospheric haze as the shots are indoors!

I think it's caused by the lighting in the factory I'm in. I like the idea of trying the S curve, that's something I don't use much in LR



Nov 25, 2014 at 03:38 AM
Eyvind Ness
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Go buy DXO v10 and use it as a plugin to LR. DXO 10 has a "ClearView" slider that works really well for this sort of thing. Really Well.

http://www.dxo.com/intl/photography/photo-software/dxo-opticspro/features/clearview



Nov 25, 2014 at 04:36 AM
Jeff Donald
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


I use LR Curves on almost all my images. I can also highly recommend Topaz Clarity. They have 30 day free trials and archived webinars you can watch to see how to use it.

http://blog.topazlabs.com/software/clarity/

http://www.topazlabs.com/clarity



Nov 25, 2014 at 06:38 AM
dhphoto
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


I will have a look at DXO and Topaz, thanks very much guys


Nov 25, 2014 at 09:35 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


dhphoto wrote:
Yes I'm using 'haze' in the 'not quite as crisp and contrasty as I'd like' context, this is not atmospheric haze as the shots are indoors!

I think it's caused by the lighting in the factory I'm in.


Whether the cast is induced by natural atmospheric conditions or artificial lighting ... a cast is still a cast. Having a color cast (any color) will reduce your contrast and the host of other points that Dan mentioned. Rarely do you have haze without an accompanying color (variable) cast.

Correcting for the color cast (as much as possible) in low/mid/high tones is key ... regardless of the cause. Until you correct for the cast ... you're only amplifying / reducing it with your other (clarity, curves, sat/desat, etc.) adjustments. And, often times you may find that you have two different casts ... one in your key lighting, one in your fill/shadow.

Dan has also given good advice regarding push/pull strategy of different attributes to help induce a perceived difference (the rudimentary essence of contrast). This can work with / without a remaining cast, but if one mitigates the cast first, it's effects are generally more pronounced with less effort (which also means less artifacts).

Cast correction is typically the first order of business for me ... unless I want to retain it for mood/ambiance/vibe or for some other aesthetic reasons. Otherwise, imo, cast steals clarity.





Nov 25, 2014 at 12:38 PM
dhphoto
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Pretty much everything I shoot is in mixed lighting so everything is a compromise.

This is one reason I find LR so good now I can correct several different colour temperatures in one RAW conversion



Nov 25, 2014 at 12:59 PM
Game Changer
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Try Perfectly Clear to remove haze...
It really works!



Nov 26, 2014 at 01:01 PM
DougVaughn
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


Interesting thread. I too struggle with getting the "pop" I want out of Lightroom. I feel like I'm taking the completely wrong approach, but I find that doing auto tone in PS then dialing it back to 50% - 80% helps the vast majority of my images. I know it's not really the right tool, but despite all the training I've read or watched, I can't find a better way that I can understand.

RustyBug mentions color cast, and I'm about 90% sure this is the root of most of my problems. I'm partially color blind and couldn't tell you what color was wrong to save my life. I can definitely see one image is better than another, or that an adjustment helped, but I can't look at an image and identify the problem well enough to know how to fix it.

Instead of Lightroom/PS for dummies, I need the book for color blind photographers.



Nov 26, 2014 at 01:29 PM
dhphoto
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


It must be extremely challenging trying to do this stuff if you are colour blind, you have my sympathy.

Being a tight-wad I have been trying to find a cost-free solution and to some extent I have.

The answer (for me anyway) lies in my workflow and the way I've been using a couple of the sliders. I now commence my RAW file processing by getting the WB right and then I go straight to the white and black sliders to top and tail the histogram, to set the white and black points.

I have found this is giving me the boost in contrast I was looking for without having to resort to the contrast slider for the whole image at all, I'm just affecting the whites and blacks and obtaining far more 'apparent' grip. I'm using the exposure slider much less too.

The fact I have processed and sold thousands of shots without doing this is quite embarrassing, although I did previously go into PS to obtain a similar result where needed.

It goes to show, it helps to properly learn the tools you already have!



Nov 26, 2014 at 01:47 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


DougVaughn wrote:
Instead of Lightroom/PS for dummies, I need the book for color blind photographers.


Read Dan Margulis ...

I simply find my (known or desired) neutrals and strive to put them such that R, G & B values are within 5 points of each other (shadows, mids & highs) ... thus very close to neutral (i.e. no cast). I'm not going by eye, but by math instead.

Once you've neutralized your neutrals ... you can always pull back or adjust to taste, but for maximum contrast (without even boosting contrast), I find cast removal is key.




Nov 26, 2014 at 02:44 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Want to 'de-haze' in LR5, suggestions please.


When it comes to color balance, this is really good advice. Folks often get hung up on so-called "accurate" color balance, but that is often not really what you want. (There are exceptions — for example, certain types of product photography.)

What you want is pleasing color balance.

I often am frustrated by the occasional discussions about supposed "accurate" color balance that suggest that people use color cards or gray cards and so forth to ensure that they end up with exactly the color balance of the original scene. The truth is that virtually everyone I know who makes beautiful photographs and prints (and this include some very talented and successful folks) "doesn't go there," instead preferring to work subjectively.

One of the techniques that is used a lot (and I often employ it, too) is to use a gray eyedropper tool (there's one in ACR, and there's a cool one on the curves adjustments in Photoshop). Click it on parts of the image that seem like they should be gray until you find one that give you a pleasing color balance. Feel free to fine tune the effect by adjusting opacity, etc.

You do need to develop a good sense of color, and that takes time and practice.

Dan

RustyBug wrote:
Read Dan Margulis ...

I simply find my (known or desired) neutrals and strive to put them such that R, G & B values are within 5 points of each other (shadows, mids & highs) ... thus very close to neutral (i.e. no cast). I'm not going by eye, but by math instead.

Once you've neutralized your neutrals ... you can always pull back or adjust to taste, but for maximum contrast (without even boosting contrast), I find cast removal is key.





Nov 27, 2014 at 11:52 AM
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