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Archive 2014 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS

  
 
datfish
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


***** UPDATE_NEWS FLASH*****

GOOD NEWS ....PHOTTIX HAVE COME BACK TO ME VIA EMAIL AND ARE ON THE CASE!!

A guy called Steve Peer (Phottix) has replied after I emailed OmegaBrands , the USA agent, with my results and issue. OmegaBrands sent it through to Phottix so "Thanks" to them....appreciated.

Steve helped me with a faulty Odin RX in 2012 so I'm very happy he is now in the Loop!!!

THANKS to all who helped... I Will Keep this thread updated with any progress




Aug 25, 2014 at 10:24 PM
datfish
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MaunaKea7007 wrote:
Have you tried the Mitros+ up on camera as a TTL fill -- with other units going off triggered by that Mitros? Your results show that it will emit the wrong power on *manual* in that configuration but be consistent in that [wrong]output. As I interpret what you found.



Just did and all appears fine when used as a SINGLE simple On Camera Flash in TTL, and utilising FEC for fill level.

(I could not meter when using in this way as it is " Live" and as such the gap between pre-flash and Flash is milliseconds BUT reviewing the Histograms it looks to deliver results consistent with the FEC settings selected AND importantly across the range from -3 to +3 and not just the lower half).

Note that this is unlike its behaviour when used in a similar way (with FEC) and controlled via Radio TTL for off camera use ( see link below ) which only delivers change across the lower half range.

http://www.canonrumors.com/forum/index.php?topic=22273.0

ALSO NOTE
1) The results when using the internal Mitros+ TX to control an OCF 580 exii are not "clean" when using FEC whereas the same flash and Odin RX when controlled by an external ODIN TCU are close to perfect.

IMPORTANT:
1. As my previous Tests have shown, the internal Mitros+TX works perfectly in controlling off camera 580 exii's etc, when mounted on Ext Odin Receivers , in either TTL or Manual modes via Radio TTL, just like the external Odin TCU....NO QUESTION!

2.This latest test shows ONLY that the FEC Function is irregular when used from the INTERNAL Miros+TX..


So to be absolutely clear in answer to your question ,if this was your setup:

a)Mitros + on camera in TTL and using FEC for power control of fill flash.
b) A number of other Canon Guns (or Vanilla Mitros? maybe) on External Odin RX's off camera set to TTL on flash, controlled in Manual mode ( or TTL without FEC) by the Mitros+ Internal TX.
PERFECT ...........ALL IS SWEET!

HOWEVER:
IF you were trying to use FEC to vary the output of the Off camera units as well , then you would get irregular and non linear results.

Again , as was shown in the other tests, the Internal Mitros+ TX/RX firmware is not quite perfect yet...close but not quite!.....

BUT THE EXTERNAL ODINS REMAIN SOLID IN ALL FUNCTIONS!


Sep 23, 2014 at 09:04 PM
MRomine
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


Just got word from a very reliable source that there is another firmware update coming soon for the Nikon Mitros + to solve it's poor recycle times. I hope this works, if it does this will make these the best radio controlled OCF flash units for Nikon. I have to keep telling myself to be patient.


Oct 22, 2014 at 09:16 AM
datfish
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
Just got word from a very reliable source that there is another firmware update coming soon for the Nikon Mitros + to solve it's poor recycle times.


That's fine for you Nikonians.......what about the rest of US in Canon land!

Seriously that's GOOD NEWS, if only that they are listening at least AND taking the feedback seriously. I have not prodded my contact again , but may just follow up over the next week for an update. Last time I checked ,all of the test results were still be worked over and repeated by the "tech heads".

And you are right...if they can fix via firmware ....the Odins will be the best choice around for those wanting to use older Canon or Nikon compatible TTL guns......and be a real "price suppressor" for those wanting to change over to or start with the 600 ex-RT setup.



Oct 22, 2014 at 05:42 PM
MRomine
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


datfish wrote:
That's fine for you Nikonians.......what about the rest of US in Canon land!


My source told me that Canon and Sony have already been updated, have you check their download page recently?



Oct 22, 2014 at 05:56 PM
datfish
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
My source told me that Canon and Sony have already been updated, have you check their download page recently?



Thanks Mark......I had not picked up on that news and YES a new version was posted on October 16.

According to the Phottix site new Version 1.07 for Canon is said to address a Battery issue (?) and the Recycle time/ Overheat protection system. It says nothing about the inaccuracies in FEC, or the minor anomalies/annoyances in its internal TTL TX/RX system as evidenced in the Tests described at the start of this thread.

THAT SAID ...you never know, it might be just another case of incomplete information on the site....time for some testing !....WATCH THIS SPACE!




Oct 22, 2014 at 06:38 PM
datfish
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


Following on....Re-tests done.............

The latest firmware may well have addressed some issues I was not impacted by, but it certainly has not addressed those I have been annoyed by

Version 1.07 for Canon has not addressed the following with respect to TTL control accuracy

1 Inconsistency of power setting changes across the power range.
2. increasing the Total Stop Change across the power range from 5.5 to 7.0 stops

The following issues remain when the Mitros+ is used as an off camera Flash

1. Little or no change occurs between 1/1 power and 1/2
2. From then on each power setting is in fact 1 stop higher than that selected via the TTL transmitter. ( 1/4 is in fact 1/2 etc).
3. The total stop variation across the range is only 5.5 stops where it should be 7 and the variation between one setting to another is too inconsistent relative to the native canon guns when triggered the same way.

Additional testing has also solved the FEC anomaly. In short I was wrong and the Mitros + FEC function does perform as expected in real "live" TTL flash situations. The testing environment was the problem......sort of.......it differs between the Canon and Phottix guns!

For Full explanation and revised test results see the following
http://flashhavoc.com/forum/index.php?topic=72.msg564#msg564

and the files attached to that thread.


I will still wait for firmware changes that address the remaining issues and keep this thread updated.

I will leave it to MRomine and others to keep us informed of improvements to the Nikon version from the latest round of firmware releases, particularly the recycle times and OH protect

Edited on Oct 26, 2014 at 02:37 AM · View previous versions



Oct 23, 2014 at 07:01 AM
datfish
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
Just got word from a very reliable source ..........................


BTW....is your "reliable source" the same as "my man inside"....a "Peer" to us both



Oct 23, 2014 at 07:42 AM
MRomine
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


datfish wrote:
BTW....is your "reliable source" the same as "my man inside"....a "Peer" to us both


Actually no, a guy by the name of James



Oct 23, 2014 at 07:49 AM
datfish
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
Actually no, a guy by the name of James


Good to hear!...... the spy pool is deep then!




Oct 23, 2014 at 07:55 AM
datfish
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
Just got word from a very reliable source ..........................


On a separate question Mark,

Have you been shooting with Quickflash enabled or disabled.

Why Do I ask?....Given that a lot of Nikon Guns have apparently burnt out, as evidenced on Dave Cheungs blog "Not So Ancient Chines Secrets" , and all/most of those impacted are wedding shooters , it raises some questions?

I have a theory that you Wedding shooters would , more than most, have Quickflash enabled for what you do. I think I would too if I needed to shoot that sort of event ...but only IF the flash had efficient OH protection. It would be a logical trade off. The choice being a)Get the shot with some flash at least ,or b) No shot because of recycle times.

Now here is the twist in the current Mitros+ for Nikon dilemna.....Enabling Quickflash would increase the risk of overheating and may well be a partial contributor to the burn outs, albeit only because the OH protection of the Nikon Mitros+ is suspect at this point.?
The strange thing is that you and some other wedding shooters have NOT burnt out flash guns despite using the mitros+ as heavily , but you and others have complained of very very poor recycle times.

My theory at the moment is that there seems to be a related, more serious a trade off which centres on QuickFlash.....
Enabled = HIGH Burnout risk
OR
Disabled = Crazy long recycle times but LOW burn out risk!

Hence my question.......do you have QuickFlash enabled with your Mitros+?

If you have it disabled then that might be a good tip for Mitros+ Nikon users to follow AT LEAST UNTIL the OH/Recycle time issues are resolved through firmware? ..... AT least that way they might still have a functioning Flash to try the new firmware out with...............when it eventually comes ![

If you have had it enabled ....My Theory is Dead!....and you and the others must be just Lucky!

Edited on Oct 26, 2014 at 10:39 PM · View previous versions



Oct 26, 2014 at 12:04 AM
MRomine
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


datfish wrote:
Have you been shooting with Quickflash enabled or disabled.


On the unit that I was using yesterday it is: Enable

On the unit that my assistant was using: Disabled

I thought I had them both set to: Enable



Oct 26, 2014 at 09:00 AM
datfish
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
On the unit that I was using yesterday it is: Enable

On the unit that my assistant was using: Disabled

I thought I had them both set to: Enable


@#!)!....that sort of shoots my theory down
Hmmm...maybe not!..... but certainly doesn't prove it either!

If you have been using the one in the "enabled" state most, then it does prove that you are less hard on gear than the many that have burnt theirs out!

That's probably because of your experience and a more selective, patient approach to "getting the shot",.......as opposed to the "machine gun and strafing" methods of the less selective, impatient , newbie , and now "Burnt Out Mitros+ " Nikon shooters.

FYI

I have since tested the difference enabling QuickFlash makes to my Mitros+ for Canon and it underlines how big an impact it would have on OH risk, if shooting in rapid fire mode for an extended period. Note also my unit is with the latest firmware included updated OH protection. Without protection .....who knows!

Shooting Manual flash @ 1/8 power with my 5d3 I got the following:

@ 6fps
Disabled = 4 off before a miss and no discernible heat from flash lens
Enabled = 9 Off before a miss, and noticeably warm flash lens.

@ 3fps
Disabled = 9 off before a miss
Enabled = 21 Off before a miss




Edited on Oct 27, 2014 at 01:51 AM · View previous versions



Oct 26, 2014 at 08:01 PM
MRomine
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


datfish wrote:
If you have been using the one in the "enabled" state most, then it does prove that you are less hard on gear than the many that have burnt theirs out!


There are times at every wedding that I like to shoot fast when the action is happening but I can't because these things can't even remotely keep up with my SB900s.

datfish wrote:
That's probably because of your experience and a more a selective, patient approach to "getting the shot",.......as opposed to the "machine gun and strafing" methods of the less selective, impatient , newbie , and now "Burnt Out Mitros+ " Nikon shooters.


Well It is not unusual for me to shoot 3, 4 or perhaps 5 frames in a row fairly fast in single shot mode but depending on the distance, by either the third or forth shot I'm getting nothing out of the flash. What is also weird, when the Mitros + gets to the point where it is not putting out anything it also apparently stops sending a single to the off-cameras units for them the fire. Because I am generally firing 1-3 off-camera units and when the on-camrea unit does not fire none of the off-cmarea units will fire.

Edited on Oct 27, 2014 at 08:00 AM · View previous versions



Oct 26, 2014 at 08:32 PM
datfish
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
There times at every wedding that I like to shoot fast when the action is happening but I can't because these things can't even remotely keep up with my SB900s.


Yeah..as you have mentioned this before.... they arent even on par with the Mitros+ for canon which is weird!


MRomine wrote:
Well It is not unusual for me to shoot 3, 4 or perhaps 5 frames in a row family fast in single shot mode but depending on the distance by either the third or forth shot I'm getting nothing out of the flash. What is also weird, when the Mitros + gets to the point where it is not putting out anything it also is apparently stops sending a single to the off-cameras units for them the fire. Because I am generally firing 1-3 off-camera units and when the on-camrea unit does not fire none of the off-camrea units will
...Show more

5 shots in single shot mode should be a breeze ( dependent on power needed of course). You have seen my shot counts previously on FH so I won't repeat here, but should get greater than 5 from Mitros+ setting 1/4 or less ( which is really 1/2 or less) ...... and as for the "sending no signal to OCF units " when its own light is out of juice.....that's even worse!!.
I have not come across that issue but I will see what my unit does when used as tx on camera , with 580 ex ii's as OCF units .



Edited on Oct 26, 2014 at 10:37 PM · View previous versions



Oct 26, 2014 at 08:47 PM
datfish
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


MRomine wrote:
What is also weird, when the Mitros + gets to the point where it is not putting out anything it also is apparently stops sending a single to the off-cameras units for them the fire. Because I am generally firing 1-3 off-camera units and when the on-camrea unit does not fire none of the off-cmarea units will fire.


Just checked using the Mitros on camera as TX but set in manual at 1/4 power , and a 580 exii as manual @ 1/64 power mounted on an Odin RX. Tried with both quickflash enabled and disabled @ 6 FPS. ( FYI I got 4 off before the Mitros missed)

SAME BEHAVIOUR, Once the Mitros+ light stopped firing so did the TTL signalling to the OCF Units?.....WTF ......Immediate reaction is "That needs to be fixed as well"!

Standing back though I can understand the logic.......sort of !.

Flash is shutting down either for OH or lack of charge, so its those two things that will take priority. If its OH then it will shut down ALL components so as not to generate any more heat. If its recharge then its prioritising recharge over all else. ?

I didn't say I agreed with the logic ...But I can understand it

Secondary Reaction......"That needs to be fixed as well"!


PS I wonder what the 600 Ex-RT does in the same circumstance?

With all this I still can't work out how so many Mitros+ Nikons have burnt out...HELL you can't even get yours to fire more than 4-5 shots in succession.... HARDLY BURN OUT TERRITORY!!



Oct 26, 2014 at 09:20 PM
ashton lamont
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


I returned my two Mitros+ for Canon flashguns so I cannot do any tests. Shame as I loved the concept but they were just hopeless in the then version. With one the heat protection was completely bricked - it might take overnight to recover, and with the other I couldn't rely on consistent exposure.

Anyway, if your oncam Mitros+ shuts down due to heat protection and will not fire the off-cam slaves, how about if you quickly switch the on-cam gun in its menu to trigger only n.b. so that its not expecting to output an actual flash. Does it trigger the slaves then or does it completely shut down I wonder.

The Mitros+ for Canon does not work with my Quantum Turbo 2x2's and thats a deal breaker really. AA battery packs can't hold a candle to the Quantums and my experience with a couple of Godox PB960's was appalling.

Pete



Oct 27, 2014 at 05:03 AM
datfish
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


ashton lamont wrote:
Anyway, if your oncam Mitros+ shuts down due to heat protection and will not fire the off-cam slaves, how about if you quickly switch the on-cam gun in its menu to trigger only n.b. so that its not expecting to output an actual flash. Does it trigger the slaves then or does it completely shut down I wonder.

Pete


Thanks Pete,

The Mitros+ doesn't exactly shut down, well not in the tests anyway, and not for extended periods. It just stops sending TTL signals to the off camera units until its capacitor charge recycles to the point where it can fire its light again, and then it restarts sending TTL signals....Weird!.
I don't think it has anything to do with OH protection when I think about it, just a problem with how it prioritises recharge over TTL triggering off camera units, when it is set with its own light active. I would think it smarter to have it the other way?

Yeah ..if you set it to trigger only and no light ....everything works fine with Off camera units being triggered without a miss ( unless of course due to the off camera units recycle times).

Have asked the question of Phottix but no reply as yet.

BTW Pete, did you have your units set to have QuickFlash enabled or Disabled?







Oct 27, 2014 at 05:28 AM
ashton lamont
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


Shame it seems it cannot continue to perform just as a trigger even if you kill its on-cam flash fire function by going into the menu. I was thinking that wish the off-cam guns on TTL at least you'd get something usable rather than nothing, especially as the on-cam gun is often used for fill rather than as a main light source.

I would have had quick flash enabled.

Pete



Oct 27, 2014 at 06:41 AM
datfish
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · PHOTTIX MITROS TEST RESULTS


ashton lamont wrote:
Shame it seems it cannot continue to perform just as a trigger even if you kill its on-cam flash fire function by going into the menu. I was thinking that wish the off-cam guns on TTL at least you'd get something usable rather than nothing, especially as the on-cam gun is often used for fill rather than as a main light source.

I would have had quick flash enabled.

Pete


Pete,

You misunderstood my last post.
If you "kill" the on cam Mitros's own light via its menu's it DOES simply work as a TX like the Odin TCU , regardless of whether the Off cam guns are set as TTL or Manual. ALL IS GOOD...no issues!

Its only when the on cam units light is enabled, and it runs out of juice after shooting rapid consecutive shots causing it to misfire , that it misbehaves and stops sending TTL signals to the Off cam units. Once recycled it starts sending again, as well as firing!.


Edited on Oct 27, 2014 at 07:42 PM · View previous versions



Oct 27, 2014 at 06:53 AM
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