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Archive 2014 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?

  
 
NYCPhotog
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


I've been wanting to do some nighttime sky photography for some time and I think I want to give it a go. I live at sea level to a max of 500ft above and don't have anything but a sturdy tripod. My gear is a D300s, 50 1.8d, 17-55 and 80-200. I want to be able to capture the sky like the shot linked below. Is it possible given my location and gear? I can get to a dark area that has little to no light pollution.

http://janaralyspeaking.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/mongolia-night-sky-tent-milkyway-thegeneralist1.jpg



Jul 08, 2014 at 07:00 PM
cwebster
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


How much light pollution is there in your sky? Can you see the Milky Way on a dark night with your naked eyes?

If you can't see the Milky Way with your eyes, you have too much light pollution to take that kind of photo. You need to look for somewhere where the night sky is darker. Where I live, I can see only about 20 or 30 1st and 2nd magnitude stars, so this is flat out for me, here.




Jul 09, 2014 at 12:56 AM
NYCPhotog
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


Unless I can see the above photo with the naked eye it's not possible? I've never seen the Milky Way though I've never attempted to when I've been to an area that was away from the city.


Jul 11, 2014 at 09:59 AM
cwebster
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


If you can't see it with your naked eye, it is too dim to shoot without an extended exposure that will lead to smearing because of the earth's rotation. Anything over about 15 seconds will show distinct star tracks, and will smear the milky way.

I reiterate my advice, if you can't see it with your naked eye, you aren't going to be able to shoot it without a tracking head to compensate for the earth's rotation.

<Chas>



Jul 11, 2014 at 11:23 AM
AdamParent
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


Depending on the level of light pollution, you might not be able to shoot it at all, even with tracking. Decent Milky Way shots require a very dark site well away from city lights and a night with no moon.

If you look up in the sky with even moderate light pollution, you may think the sky looks black, but an extended exposure (especially at high ISO) will reveal that the sky is anything but black. Its possible to completely blow out the sky.

You can get some very nice star trail shots with very long duration exposures. Given the length of the exposure required (can be up to several hours), you would want to combine multiple shots of shorter exposure taken in rapid succession.

BTW, I can see star trails in this image (not very long, but noticeable). That doesn't make it a bad shot IMO.

Diavolo, I just noticed you list New York City as your location. I think you would need to be at least an hours drive away (probably more) from the city to get something like this. Probably best just to try some night shots of the sky on a clear night in your area to get a feel for what you get with longer exposures (e.g. 5, 10, 15, 30 second exposures).

V/R
Adam



Jul 11, 2014 at 12:33 PM
boingyman
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


It is more than possible, but you have to remember what other aspects to keep in mind when shooting the milky way. A lot of it is preperation, location and basic understanding of limitations of gear and light pollution.

My advice is to do a quick google search, which probably has tons of tutorials from photogs that specialize in shooting the night sky. There's also sites/apps/programs that show light pollution, show exactly what time it will appear at your set location, moon phases, etc...



Jul 11, 2014 at 01:11 PM
BarryAllen
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


This site is a bit dated, but provides good data on tracking light pollution.

http://www.jshine.net/astronomy/dark_sky/



Jul 13, 2014 at 04:25 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


http://darksitefinder.com/index.html


Jul 16, 2014 at 08:35 PM
runamuck
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


The best viewing I had of the Milky Way was on a flight from Baltimore to Fort Benning. I got to see it from the navigator's dome of a C130 as we were going back to base after the Martin Luther King riots in Baltimore. My thanks to the flight crew and crew chief who allowed this Infantry PFC up front to talk with the crew and explain some of what was going on.

One of my favorite memories, and the Milky Way was visible to the naked eye. The Milky Way looked almost like a blanket of white.



Jul 16, 2014 at 09:48 PM
NYCPhotog
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


I have a moon phase and location app in my phone. I've done some tests, albeit right outside NYC, and I obviously get pollution. I can drive about an hour away where the light pollution is far dimmer but still may not be ideal. I need to get a star app so I can see the angle and location of the Milky Way also.


Jul 21, 2014 at 02:08 PM
Chris S.
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


Let's remember that the shot shown at the beginning of this post could not be made with a tracking rig, since it includes a stationary tent and landscape. Tracking rigs are for images of the spinning sky alone. (Of course, it could be done by compositing two images—but yuck.)

Like the others, I’ll repeat that you might as well not bother shooting unless you can see the Milky Way clearly with your eyes (though if coming out of a bright area, you might need to give your eyes a few minutes to dark-adapt). Ideally, you want a dark location, the moon in a dark phase, no clouds or just a few, and very clear air—not much moisture or dust in it. A night or two after a cold front (high pressure system) passes is often good for air quality. You also need to be there at a time when the Milky Way is above the horizon—a free program called Stellarium is my second favorite way to know when things will rise and set (my favorite way is to spend lots of time outside at night, which eventually teaches us to anticipate this without help).

New Jersey’s Great Swamp, about an hour from Manhattan, might work—I once shot a comet there without difficulty. And Ringwood, NJ—also about an hour from Manhattan—has some dark skies. If you don’t mind some additional driving, a bit under 5 hours away from you is Cherry Springs State Park in Pennsylvania. This area is about 2,000 feet higher than sea level, and is known for very dark skies. The park personnel and local residents are friendly people who actively welcome photographers and other observers of the night sky. The park hosts star parties monthly during the warm months. See here: http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/stateparks/findapark/cherrysprings/cherrysprings-darkskies/

Some years before Cherry Springs became known for dark skies, I was driving through there just after a cold front had passed, and saw the Milky Way very vividly even with my eyes adapted to driving with my car’s bright beams. I pulled off the road, shut off my lights, and gave my eyes a few minutes to dark-adapt. What I saw wows me to this day. It looked as if one could walk across the Milky Way like a bridge—it was that solid and bright. I didn’t have a camera that evening, and have since photographed the Milky Way many times—usually from much higher elevations. And while I’ve found conditions for perfectly acceptable Milky Way images, I’ve never seen it nearly so clearly at that night in Pennsylvania. So you may have to drive a half-day from home—perhaps not so terribly far?--to make a Milky Way picture that matches your vision.

Your gear may limit you a bit—I shoot night skies with the D700 and 14-24mm f/2.8. At 14mm, 20-second shutter-open time, f/2.8, ISO 3200, I find the sweet spot. The D700 produces better results in low light than the D300s, and the 14mm wide angle on full frame shows a bigger chunk of sky than your 17-55mm f/2.8—while reducing the impression of star trails. You already have good gear—but this is one scenario where a bigger sensor and wider-angle lens could be make or break.

Good luck!

--Chris



Jul 29, 2014 at 03:06 AM
AdamParent
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


I just came across the following site about shooting the Milky Way in light polluted skies:
http://www.justinngphoto.com/2014/05/16/how-i-photograph-the-milky-way-from-light-polluted-skies-of-singapore/

I also just remembered some filters I've seen astrophotographers use that block light pollution. As I recall, they are pretty narrow band filters that block out most of man made light sources. I certainly don't remember the name of the filter, and I can't even remember how it was used. Its possible it was a filter that you place on a regular camera lens. It's also possible that it was a much smaller filter that you screw inside a telescope eyepiece which then projects an image onto your camera sensor. If it was the smaller eyepiece variant, then I'm not sure it would even be available in larger sizes that would be placed on the front of a camera lens. These filters are probably pretty pricey too.

I have a somewhat similar filter (made by Lumicon) that limits light pollution and is mainly meant for visual use with a telescope. This Lumicon filter, however, didn't block nearly as much man made light as the filter I'm referring to above (and can't remember its name/designation/manufacturer).

One last point on the narrow band filter. I suspect it also blocked a fair amount of the light you really do want to capture, necessitating the use of a tracking mount and multiple long exposures.

Bottom line, you can capture the Milky Way in a heavily light polluted area, but there are some caveats.

V/R
Adam



Aug 01, 2014 at 03:12 AM
jforkner
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


Diavolo wrote:
I've been wanting to do some nighttime sky photography for some time and I think I want to give it a go. I live at sea level to a max of 500ft above and don't have anything but a sturdy tripod. My gear is a D300s, 50 1.8d, 17-55 and 80-200. I want to be able to capture the sky like the shot linked below. Is it possible given my location and gear? I can get to a dark area that has little to no light pollution.


You should be fine with the gear you have. The best test is to pick a dark night (no moon), a dark site, and just try it---see what you get. I'd recommend using your widest lens (the 17-55) for the Milky Way. Shoot RAW and start out with the aperture wide open & ISO 3200 for about 20 sec.---adjust from there. Since your lens is about 26mm equiv., you'll likely start getting noticeable star trails with shutter speeds greater than 20 sec. So adjust your ISO to compensate if underexposed.

Trial & error is a great teacher.

Jack




Aug 01, 2014 at 08:28 AM
leftcoastlefty
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Is this shot possible at sea level without a tracking rig?


Jack nailed it. Just go try it. You have nothing to lose except some time and gas.

Your target photo was shot in Mongolia at about 6600 feet. Mongolia is dark and the air is thinner and clearer (in general) at 6000 feet.

http://thegeneralist.me/2013/08/23/photography-night-sky-mongolia/

I’m skeptical that you can find adequately dark skies anywhere around NYC.



Aug 27, 2014 at 01:05 AM





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