Home · Register · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username  

FM Forum Rules
Nature & Wildlife Posting Guidelines
  

FM Forums | Nature & Wildlife | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       end
  

Archive 2014 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800

  
 
bipock
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


I'm sure this has been discussed here, but searches here and on the Canon forum are drawing blanks. Please feel free to link a thread if this has been covered.

I'm looking to pick up one of these lenses for waterfowl season and for shooting my local black bears. Current setup is a 1Dx with 24-70 and 70-200. At this time, my intent for rounding out my kit is based on Canon releasing a 7d2 and updated 100-400. If this does not happen, I'll likely go 1D4 and have to figure out the midrange lens.

I've read extensively about each and looked at samples. Seems there are pros and cons for each lens, ranging from weight to cost to MFD. For my uses, the lens will be used at local NWRs where reach needs can range from significant to not so much needed - more often than not, somewhere in between but closer to needed. My alltime favorite combo was the 1D4 with a 500 and 1.4x, but it required being able to work close, which is something that hasn't worked the last year or so where I go due to poor management by the NWR staff.

Weight is somewhat of a push as I shoot from a tripod/gimbal most of the time.


All that said, for my uses, what would you get?

Edit: Forgot to mention that I spent last year shooting the d7100 and 200-400 with 1.4 attached. Worked OK until I got to about ISO 800, then the files quickly feel apart. I'm not adverse to a crop camera but I prefer not go there (assuming the 7D2 isn't the crop body we all expect it to be).



Jul 07, 2014 at 07:53 AM
Thang
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Given you have used the 500 w tc before and it was your favorite but not close enough then the next logical option is the new 600 is ii. Works very well at 840 w tc. Weighs the same as the old 500 but w IQ better than 800mm by some reviews...


Jul 08, 2014 at 07:23 PM
KClarke
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


My vote is for the 600 II for birding.
Also, since you have the IDX ...pickup the 1.4 and 2.0 III extenders also to give you the extra reach when needed.




Jul 10, 2014 at 11:22 AM
bipock
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


I picked up a used and very clean 500 and 1D4 and 1.4xIII to hold me over for a little while. We'll see, but I still think the 600II is in my very near future. I'm really waiting to see if Canon updates the 100-400 in September as rumors are suggesting (and have been for many years). That would certainly push me to a 100-400/600 combo.

Glad to have a 1D4 back in the fold though.



Jul 11, 2014 at 07:41 AM
jamesdak
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Hmm, I have been working with an old manual focus 800/5.6 for years for birding and find it to work very well. But I just stepped into the "modern" world with a AF 600/4. Give me a couple of weeks and I can give you my in field observations with both lens. Pretty sure right now the 800 is gonna go to sale but no real decision until I have some time with the new lens.


Jul 22, 2014 at 08:53 PM
hnilsson
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


KClarke wrote:
My vote is for the 600 II for birding.
Also, since you have the IDX ...pickup the 1.4 and 2.0 III extenders also to give you the extra reach when needed.



This.



Jul 22, 2014 at 08:59 PM
Doug Maclean
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


BIF. 300 f4 or 2,8. Doug M


Jul 22, 2014 at 09:00 PM
blitzn
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


I started with7D and the 500 v1, then upgraded to 1Dmkiv and 600mk2. Couldn't be happier. I also carry the 5Dmk3 and 100-400 for when I need MFD and/or fast handheld response. I don't think you can go wrong with either the 500 or 600, but he 500 was just too short for me. YMMV....


Jul 22, 2014 at 09:16 PM
danob
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


On a1DX an 800mm f5.6 would be my choice I find the weight similar to my 500mm f4 when the foot is replaced. And the 4 stop IS fast focus and superb IQ which IMHO is superior than 600 with TC


Jul 23, 2014 at 05:20 AM
Tim Kuhn
Offline
• • • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


I have been shooting with the 800 for almost 4 years now, the IQ is unsurpassed. I shoot it hand held or from a monopod. I'll let my results speak for themselves. I also have/use the 500 mk2, that combo makes the 600 almost irrelevant IMO. Of course what works for one person does not necessarily work for another, many who have tried the 800 can't produce high quality images. I would strongly suggest renting so you can judge from your own experience

Tim



Jul 23, 2014 at 07:27 AM
acjd
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Tim Kuhn wrote:
many who have tried the 800 can't produce high quality images.


Do you know why that is? Is it lack of long lens technique or something else?

I ask because I never heard that before.




Jul 23, 2014 at 09:02 AM
xterra07
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


1DX with 600mm II with 1.4x and 2.0x
The reach is always an issue, unless you have the technique with blinds etc down very well, which most people don't, so the reach is what matters. Then you can go bare or with a teleconverter, 1.4x to get some tracking ability, or 2.0x when there isn't much motion.
Sometimes you just can't get close enough.

600mm II is the weight of the old 500mm I, and 500mm II is lighter than before.
People handhold both, both get heavy fast, but that's an option besides tripod use.
1D IV versus 1D X, 1D X should track faster sometimes, some people prefer one over the other, but both are great, but I would pick 1D X with 600mm over a 1D IV with 500mm, sometimes. There isn't a clear advantage always to either setup, both are good.
I didn't enjoy 7D, the color are different, the sensor size becomes very obvious when your exposure is not perfect, at ISO 400 and higher, when you crop... I didn't enjoy that body at all.
I would rather use 1D IV with older 500mm than 7D with a newer lens.

and I would use the new 1.4x III and 2.0x III, while it's the AF speed not image quality that's advertised as being improved, I would just really prefer the IIIs.

800mm f/5.6 won't focus in lower light as well as f/4 lens would, sometimes it is too long, minimum focusing distance is a few feet further than shorter lenses, I have missed shots because birds were too close to focus on with 800mm. I would say it's a great lens but a lot more limited for variety than 600mm with teleconverters would be.

Here I was with a 300mm II with 2.0x on it, the birds were 20 feet up, I had to get close but then I was shooting up and pictures were weak (no keepers).
With 600mm II with 2.0x, and this is 100% crop, I was further, getting a keeper.

(1D X, 600mm II, 2.0x,tripod)
http://robertbody.com/images/500/2013-12-31-joaquin-osprey-1x_04117.jpg



Jul 23, 2014 at 10:21 AM
drobertfranz
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Tim Kuhn wrote:
I have been shooting with the 800 for almost 4 years now, the IQ is unsurpassed. I shoot it hand held or from a monopod. I'll let my results speak for themselves. I also have/use the 500 mk2, that combo makes the 600 almost irrelevant IMO. Of course what works for one person does not necessarily work for another, many who have tried the 800 can't produce high quality images. I would strongly suggest renting so you can judge from your own experience

Tim


I to have been shooting with the 800mm since 2010. I agree with Tim's assessment and strongly disagree who claim the 600mm F4 mkII with ithe 1.4x is optically superior to the bare 800mm.. Nonsense! Not in my tests. To me, at this time, a used 800mm is the biggest bargain out there in the world of supertelephotos.




Jul 23, 2014 at 05:27 PM
Ted ellis
Offline
• • • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Just to add a reply to this thread, the camera, the lens and the TC are only as good as the person pushing the button


Jul 23, 2014 at 05:33 PM
vadafallon
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


I am using a 70-200 f4 but i need something more.


Jul 23, 2014 at 06:02 PM
diverhank
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


I'm glad to see the comments regarding the 800mm. I'm in the market for getting a big one (graduating from a 400mm f/5.6L). Since I shoot with a full frame 5D3, 600mm is not cutting it based on my using the 400mm with a 1.4X (=560mm - way short for me) and I think focus speed suffers with an extender (?).

I'm leaning strongly towards getting an 800mm f/5.6.



Jul 23, 2014 at 06:13 PM
Tim Kuhn
Offline
• • • • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


acjd wrote:
Do you know why that is? Is it lack of long lens technique or something else?

I ask because I never heard that before.



My guess is technique. To temper the discussion somewhat, for some reason 600 vs 800 discussions quickly get out hand I often hear from people when they first pick up a 500 that they can't find the subject, can't shoot IFs and such. It is way more difficult to those things with an 800, it is 60% longer than the 500, so I think many just blame the lens when they can't produce with it.

Tim




Jul 24, 2014 at 10:41 AM
bipock
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Forgot all about this one.

Good comments, especially concerning the 800. I normally shoot my 500 with 1.4 on a 1D4, so I'm already used to the length and tracking. May have to consider it more closely.



Jul 24, 2014 at 03:48 PM
acjd
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Tim Kuhn wrote:

My guess is technique. To temper the discussion somewhat, for some reason 600 vs 800 discussions quickly get out hand I often hear from people when they first pick up a 500 that they can't find the subject, can't shoot IFs and such. It is way more difficult to those things with an 800, it is 60% longer than the 500, so I think many just blame the lens when they can't produce with it.

Tim



Not in interested in the 600 vs 800 debate. I have an 800. That is why I asked about technique. Using the 7D & 800 meant 1280mm equivalent. Pulling anything out of the sky at 1280mm thats moving takes time to learn. Learning to ensure the lens is rock steady (despite IS and higher shutter speeds) is part of technique.

Got it, Sounds like they don't take the time to learn

Thank you




Jul 24, 2014 at 03:48 PM
acjd
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Best birding lens - 500 vs. 600 vs. 800


Tim Kuhn wrote:

My guess is technique. To temper the discussion somewhat, for some reason 600 vs 800 discussions quickly get out hand I often hear from people when they first pick up a 500 that they can't find the subject, can't shoot IFs and such. It is way more difficult to those things with an 800, it is 60% longer than the 500, so I think many just blame the lens when they can't produce with it.

Tim



Not in interested in the 600 vs 800 debate. I have an 800. That is why I asked about technique. Using the 7D & 800 meant 1280mm equivalent. Pulling anything out of the sky at 1280mm thats moving takes time to learn. Learning to ensure the lens is rock steady (despite IS and higher shutter speeds) is part of technique.

Got it, Sounds like they don't take the time to learn

Thank you




Jul 24, 2014 at 03:48 PM
1
       2       end




FM Forums | Nature & Wildlife | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username       Or Reset password



This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.