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Archive 2014 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?

  
 
oiseau0001
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


I'm looking at a D800/E with a manual focus only lens, and would love to get some perspective and experience on it. I'm in my 30s and, while I have used manual focus lenses, I didn't live in that era. However, when I do manual focus I find I enjoy the process far more than the compose-AF-ON-shutter process.

Where my concern lays is primarily in recognizing good focus. This is a pleasure on my old film rigs, with high magnification pentaprisms, and ground glass focusing screens. It has been more challenging on my digital rigs. In my research it seems that, while the D800/E does have a replaceable focus screen that these may not be easily available or installed. They may also involve compromises in metering and such.

I'd love to hear more about manual focus on the D800/E platform and any experiences with replacing the focus screen to make the body more friendly for this purpose.



Jun 13, 2014 at 05:28 PM
jhinkey
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


A lot depends on what lenses you are trying to use. If you are using a f/1.2 50mm or a f/2 200mm it will be hard to exactly nail the focus using the D800 viewfinder alone.
I have somewhat good luck with my D800 and the focus confirmation dot, but it's not always consistent or reliable. If you are focusing f/4 glass or slower you will have much better luck.

If you are looking to use all those 36MP (i.e., sharp images at 100% viewing) then the viewfinder will not be adequate.

I have had such problems with my D800 with my fast glass that I picked up a Sony A7R and can focus my fast glass very very easily with the EVF. But that's another story.

Others will chime in.



Jun 13, 2014 at 05:45 PM
chuhsi1
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


One option is focusing with live view. Turn on live view, magnify to maximum, then focus. It's really accurate. It's just an odd process.

I think if you're going to use the viewfinder, you have to get a real focusing screen.

I get by on my DF with just the green dot..it works, but it's not perfect when shooting at big apertures.



Jun 13, 2014 at 06:19 PM
cebseb
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


Here's a thread for you

D800E+Zeiss Otus Manual Focus Tips
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1270645/0#12104456

Cheers!



Jun 13, 2014 at 08:49 PM
Keith B.
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


I'm with jhinkey on the concept that the ease and accuracy of eye focus on the D800(E) is somewhat lens dependent: I have shots with the D800E(stock screen) and my Zeiss ZF 35/2 that have insanely high levels of detail, and not just one lucky shot either...it's repeatable. I also have an f/4 lens(Nikon 25-50/4 Ais zoom) with which it is difficult to see the focus.
I'm not with chuhsi1 who states that you need some kind of aftermarket screen. (See above)
I can report that manual focusing the D800 is generally not something that can be done quickly; you often have to slowly rack the focus back and forth several times while looking at some small detail in order to be sure.



Jun 13, 2014 at 09:18 PM
oiseau0001
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


This has been some great feedback. Thanks all!

Can you tell me more about your experiences with 3rd party focusing screens? I can see that the thread that cebsed linked had a few parts in it, but would love some more perspectives on it. For example, I find that manual focusing with my old Canon AE-1 is a pleasure. Can the D800/E be that good?

Edited on Jun 13, 2014 at 11:47 PM · View previous versions



Jun 13, 2014 at 09:27 PM
chuhsi1
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


I agree so let me correct myself. Just using my eyes to focus through the viewfinder, it is lens dependent. My zeiss 35mm is easier to focus at f2 than my 55mm nikon. I think it has to do more with the focal length than the lens in my case.

I can shoot outside at f8 all day long with manual focus, but shooting eyelash-sharp images at f1.4 is really hard for me with any sort of speed.

Keith B. wrote:
I'm with jhinkey on the concept that the ease and accuracy of eye focus on the D800(E) is somewhat lens dependent: I have shots with the D800E(stock screen) and my Zeiss ZF 35/2 that have insanely high levels of detail, and not just one lucky shot either...it's repeatable. I also have an f/4 lens(Nikon 25-50/4 Ais zoom) with which it is difficult to see the focus.
I'm not with chuhsi1 who states that you need some kind of aftermarket screen. (See above)
I can report that manual focusing the D800 is generally not something that can be done quickly; you often
...Show more



Jun 13, 2014 at 10:04 PM
Alan321
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


Perhaps stating the obvious, the bigger the details are in the viewfinder the easier they are to see and generally the easier they are to focus on. A sharper lens helps. A longer focal length helps. A shorter focus distance helps until you get so close that your own motion makes it hard to focus. VR helps, but is generally on AF lenses that have in turn generally poor manual focus characteristics. A decent focus ring on the lens helps - one that has a lot of travel for the focus distances you are shooting at (like the Zeiss 2/100 Makro at close-up to mid-range but definitely not like that lens at infinity). And of course a working viewfinder helps - it wasn't until I tried a second Zeiss lens and still had a lot of trouble focusing that I realised there was a fault with my D800E viewfinder. Naturally it proved to be an intermittent problem as if a part was physically loose inside. One new viewfinder later and things are much better.

I use the Nikon 1.2x viewfinder magnifier and it helps me a lot, but it restricts full-screen vision from one eye position. Then again, so does wearing my eyeglasses, so it doesn't matter that much.

A better focus screen can indeed improve the situation if it is matched to the maximum aperture of the lens/TC combination that you are using. Otherwise it can make things worse in multiple ways. I'd be concerned about using a third-party focus screen for the following reasons...

1. They won't be user-changeable like the Canon focus screens, and I think they need to be.

2. Whatever focus screen works at bright maximum apertures is usually unsuitable at darker maximum apertures, and vice versa. e.g. they may go very dark in the microprism and split prism focus aids; they can go disproportionately dark in darker areas of the image; they may totally obscure DOF by accentuating defocus. This matters to me because my lens collection includes a variety of maximum apertures from f/1.2 to f/6.3.

3. When the maximum aperture does not suit the focus screen the focus screen will alter the image going to the matrix metering system in the pentaprism and may interfere with both exposure and AF - and not consistently. The errors will differ according to the scene brightness especially where the AF sensors would be looking.
(I know that the viewfinder image is not actually seen by the AF sensors but the matrix metering affects exposure and the colour sensing can affect AF tracking in AF-C and/or face recognition in AF-S).


Unfortunately, I think the standard focus screen restricts focus to an equivalent of f/2 or f/2.8 DOF. It just won't reveal a DOF as narrow as that of an f/1.4 lens at maximum aperture and therefore an element of guesswork is involved. It's not an issue with f/2.8 lenses and not bad at f/2.


Some or even most of the non-Nikon lenses require the focus ring be turned the Canon way instead of the opposite Nikon way. That might mess with you quick reaction manual focusing or else your SWM manual focus tweaking of AF results.


Using the live view is difficult on the D800E because it throws away two out of three lines even when zoomed in. That might be clever for video work but it's a crappy choice for still photography (especially handheld) and as the years roll by it is quite evident that Nikon has no intention of fixing it with a firmware update.

An alternative might be to use an attachable HDMI monitor, preferably with its own focus aid whereby it flashes high-contrast (i.e. sharp) edge transitions. However, it involves using a tripod too.

Yet another option is to use a Zacuto Z-Finder Pro. It is an LCD viewing hood, a large eye cup and a lens with dioptre adjustment that attaches to the back of the camera and becomes the defacto viewfinder. It lets you focus on the LCD while you are using live view mode and that lets you better judge focus. It works even when you zoom the LV image and like the normal viewfinder it lets you use your head to support the camera and reduce motion. You cannot do that if you hold the camera at arms length to look at the LCD without the Zacuto. The downsides are the cost, the extra bulk, and the extra power consumption needed to run live view. If power consumption is too much of a problem then you can add more cost by using the optional battery/grip and fill it with rechargeable AA cells.


If you want to play with manual focus then do it before your eyes go wonky in your 40's or 50's. They'll never get any better and they'll probably get a lot worse than they are now.

- Alan



Jun 14, 2014 at 09:10 AM
Chris Dees
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


For my eyes the D800E is not usable with MF lenses. I had a large collection of great MF lenses (30+) and sold them almost all after I got the D800E. I was not able to nail the focus in more than 80% of the time. I got 1.2x magnifier, tried the green dot and live view, but nothing worked for me.


Jun 14, 2014 at 01:30 PM
Picture This!
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


I used the D800e with leica, zeiss and nikon manual focus lenses for about a year. In short, I wasn't thrilled with the experience. The sloppy live doesn't help either. T The Sony A7r with its evf, focus peaking and live view that's actually usable is a much much better experience for MF shooters IMO.


Jun 14, 2014 at 02:59 PM
oiseau0001
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · D800/E - Manual Focus Lens Experiences?


Thanks for all the feedback folks! I'll take anything I can get.


Jun 14, 2014 at 03:12 PM





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