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Archive 2014 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View

  
 
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


This thread is opened to discuss some of the post processing techniques involved for the image I uploaded in "Landscape Photographer" forum. The thread I posted there is as following: https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1289290

I recognized that there were stream of concerns as to perhaps the wrong protocol I was following. Therefore I emailed the raw file to anyone who would like to participate to resolve the issues of coloring, banding, etc.

If any one would like to receive the raw file, I would be happy to send it to you. Just pm me your email address. The file size is about 40 Mb. And please post the image with some write-up of your post-processing protocol employed, in the quick reply box.

Thanks.

Kee




Originally posted in the Landscape Forum titled as




Apr 22, 2014 at 09:37 PM
gdanmitchell
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Kee Woo Rhee wrote:
I recognized that there were stream of concerns as to perhaps the wrong protocol I was following.


Two things:

1. No one has any notions about a "wrong protocol." It is more about the interpretation of the image, which many felt seemed (and seems) oddly very, very green or aqua. There is no right protocol, though there are a variety of ways that one could handle an image in post, depending on the nature of the original image and where you want to go with it.

2. It would help a great deal if you could, as others mentioned in the previous thread, simply post a jpg of the unprocessed raw image (the actual raw file is not needed) so that we can see what you started with. It doesn't even have to be large. The same size as the image you posted here will be fine.

Dan



Apr 22, 2014 at 10:18 PM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


gdanmitchell wrote:
Two things:

1. No one has any notions about a "wrong protocol." It is more about the interpretation of the image, which many felt seemed (and seems) oddly very, very green or aqua. There is no right protocol, though there are a variety of ways that one could handle an image in post, depending on the nature of the original image and where you want to go with it.

2. It would help a great deal if you could, as others mentioned in the previous thread, simply post a jpg of the unprocessed raw image (the actual raw file is not needed)
...Show more

I see your point, but I think it would be time to see what others' processed image look like. I have gotten most of the critic from other forum. I will send a raw file for anyone who would like to work with. Thanks.



Apr 22, 2014 at 10:28 PM
Slabshaft
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


In the spirit of helping out, I took a look at the RAW file. Kee can feel free to post the image that I pulled out of the file, but I don't have an easy way of posting it since I host my stuff publicly from Flickr. Anyway, here is my feedback and it should be useful for anyone dealing with really bad atmospheric haze:

1. The air is extremely hazy in the original. That's not your fault and you can't change it, but when the air get's hazy, I try to point the camera away from the sun more. The sun can amplify the haze, washing out the detail. I will sometimes shoot into haze, but only with the right light and usually with a super wide angle lens. This was shot at 70mm.
2. The white balance for the photo was set to -23 on the green/magenta slider which made it look too green. I changed the white balance to "Shade" to make the canyon look more brown.
3. It looks like the RAW picture was taken about 3 stops over exposed. It was exposed at 1/13 sec but probably would have been best at 1/60 or 1/120 sec. The canyon should be in shadow, but when you set the camera to "aperture priority", it doesn't know that you are pointing it at a shadow, so it exposes it as middle gray (RGB value of about 155,155,155). The the sky and everything else get's washed out. Take a look at this video:


4. For haze removal and contrast boosting, check out this video:


5. I used that method and also masked out the bluff in the foreground to keep it blended with the rest of the scene.

With all this said, there is a lesson to be learned. If one has to wrestle with a file, it's probably a sign that nature just wasn't giving us the light we wanted at that angle.



Apr 22, 2014 at 10:30 PM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Slabshaft wrote:
Kee can feel free to post the image that I pulled out of the file.


Thanks!





Processed by Slabshaft




Apr 22, 2014 at 10:40 PM
FarmerJohn
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Kee, I agree that the original looks very green. I assume you have a calibrated monitor? If not, that might help? I find it helps me out.

In terms of finding the neutral WB, the trick I learned from fellow critiquer RustyBug is to try to get the R/G/B values in a 'neutral' area within 5% of each other.
In LR this is easy for me to check because the values are shown next to the histogram in the upper right. Of course then you can tweak it to suit your artistic taste or memory of how it was at the time.
Getting a 'correct white balance' is still something I struggle with, and this image would be a tough one because there aren't any obvious neutral gray areas to choose from in the reds of the canyon.

I think Slabshaft's version is pretty good, and doesn't have the obvious green/grid-banding issues of the original. Certainly if you want to change it to be slightly more green for your artistic purposes, up to you.



Apr 22, 2014 at 11:35 PM
RustyBug
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Would like to see the raw saved as a smaller jpg.

This is from the posted jpg after several iterations. Certainly not where I really wanted to try and take it but this is challenging to say the least.

The post sunset lighting is going to be uber-soft and uber-blue with the illumination coming from the sky, meanwhile intersecting with the warm radial lighting in certain places (giving us our purple mountain majesty, if you will).

But, while the color, contrast and exposure are all issues, I'm most concerned about the appearance of the checkerboard overlay @ where that came from. It almost reminds me of a cross type filter on your lens that the longer exposure and uber-soft light diffracted around. If not some physical reason for the checkerboard (more faint in yours, but still there) or an explanation from your PP, I'd be really concerned about a problem with the camera or lens.

Anyway, I took a stab at it ... not really happy with the granularity @ how I fared (working off posted jpg), but it is what it is (for now). I now see the rework from the raw ... nice job @ the save.







Apr 23, 2014 at 12:06 AM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


RustyBug, I will send you raw file to work with. PM me your email. Thanks.

PS: raw file was sent to you.



Apr 23, 2014 at 06:01 AM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Since some people prefer the original file in .jpg format, I am uploading the file here.
I am uploading two files, 7017 & 7018. Their expose times were, 1/25 & 1/13 respectively. In case 1/13 is over exposed then you can try 1/25 exposed file.
Enjoy your processing.
Thanks,







Exposure: 1/25 sec







Exposure: 1/13 sec




Apr 23, 2014 at 10:51 AM
ben egbert
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


My shot at the darker jpg. I use a lot of actions and LAB which I won't go into here because it would be hard to duplicate. Rather I will provide and overview and show my interpretation. My color vision is suspect so I don't pretend I have that part right.

I started with a noise reduction. The RAW may need less but the jpg needed it and I think I resolved the banding issue.

I used a action which applied the RGB image in overlay mode, this added some contrast and was faded to about 10%. I next went to LAB and did some work which is far to complex to explain here. I did not think I could get far with my other methods. I sharpened, and cropped to eliminate the main flare and then ran Topaz Photo Pop.

I tried some color correction by finding a neutral grey and selecting it with the grey eyedropper in curves. I liked that so left it although I have no idea if its correct.











Apr 23, 2014 at 01:07 PM
river rover
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Here's my go with the raw file.





Edit: Hmmm still too green in the shadows. I'll revisit.

http://www.laughingtotemphoto.com/img/s4/v62/p436218459-5.jpg

Gutted my original starting point with a cooler WB and building up the reds, instead started with a WB of 8300 and drew some blue into the shadows to account for Rayleigh Scattering. Instead of using the clarity LR I did the old fashioned low percent/ high radius unsharp Mask to increase a bit of micro contrast.

Edited on Apr 23, 2014 at 05:11 PM · View previous versions



Apr 23, 2014 at 02:47 PM
CheechzeppLn
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


My humble submission, hope you like it Kee. Here is what I did step by step.


Hopi Point Sunset w/ Colorado River by Lightbox Images by Charles Romano, on Flickr

First I processed two versions of the photo, one for the sky and one for the foreground. On both versions I set the white balance to shade like slabshaft did. I intend to use the sky with no exposure adjustments and raised exposure for the forground element (+.3 ev). Once I have both versions processed with my raw converter (RPP) I opened the darker version (sky with no ev adjustments) in photoshop and duplicated the layer on top of the brighter version. Now that I have both photos together i add a layer mask to the top layer. Next I activate the brush tool with an opacity value of about 63% and pixel width of about 300. I then set foreground color to black over white and start to brush the layers together on the layer mask. I brush most of the forground once over very close to the horizon. Next I brush the bottom 1/3 of the photo with the same opacity and the middle 1/3 with a opacity of 35% and pixel width of 100. After brushing the layers together i than merge the layers down into one.
Next I add a luminosity mask to keep the highlights in check while i fix the levels on both layers. Some minor contrast and saturation adjustments on both layers to cut the haze a bit. Than I merge them down again. Now its time for lens correction as the horizon line has some barrel distortion and needs to be straightened. Next I cropped the photo a lil bit so the empty spaces are removed that was caused by the lens correction tool. Finally I flatten the image. Some more minor adjustments with the shadow and highlight tool and add an unsharp mask to tighten everything up.

Thanks for sharing.

Charlie




Apr 23, 2014 at 02:49 PM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


Thank you all for participating for the processing the image of Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View.


Apr 23, 2014 at 10:46 PM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View



Here is the email I received from Sasha about the post processing of the image. I would like to share with all of you.

++++
Kee,
Here is your file, processed. I am sending it to you both in photoshop format, and in jpeg reduced and sharpened for web.
This is a challenging image to process, it was hazy, and sensor interpreted this light in a very weird way.
Here is the sequence of steps I used for the processing.

1. Open in Adobe Camera Raw, set white balance using river surface - since it was cloudy, it is very close to neutral gray.

2. Still in ACR: adjust levels, brightness, contrast, applied lens correction, reduced saturation on green and cyan.

3. Open file in Photoshop, sRGB, 16-bit color. Adjust saturation so that red is not too bright.

4. Transfer file from RGB to Lab color space. Add Curves adjustment layer, changed slope of the curve in channel a on 8 (top and bottom), in channel b on 10 (top and bottom). This simple procedure "separates" colors, bringing out everything that is hiding in between green and red in your image. So now the palette is wider, it includes blue and yellow, and red and green are better separated as well.

5. While still in Lab color space, duplicat layer, and in this new layer adjusted highlights and shadows on L channel only. I do it this way so I manipulate luminance only, but colors remain unaffected.

6. Convert back to RGB color space, and apply two layers with color filters with the masks, cool for the top, and warm for the bottom.

7. Now, I fix the lens flare on the left side, by cloning/grafting texture from surrounding areas. Not perfect, but did not want to spend too much time on it.

8. Crop the image to my liking, so that there is a line going from the bottom left corner, and river is at the lower right third. Cut off the top because it is distracting

9. Flatten all layers, save file in photoshop format.

10. Time to reduce it for the web: change resolution to 72 ppi, and size to 1000 pixels wide.

11. Duplicate layer, apply unsharp mask filter to the top layer only, with the following setting: amount 200%, radius 0.2, threshold 0. I apply this mask as many times as needed for the image to look sharp but not crisp, usually 2-3 times.

12. Now, I add a mask to the sharpened layer, and with a small soft brush (set to 10-12% transparency) lightly rub edges that seem to be a bit over-sharpened.

13. Now, final touches - with darken tool (shadows, 6%), I add extra contrast in some areas.

14. Convert image to 8 bit, save as jpeg.

Hope you like it,

Good luck,

Sasha.
++++




Edited by Sasha. Thanks!




Apr 24, 2014 at 10:38 AM
AuntiPode
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View





Apr 24, 2014 at 11:48 PM
Kee Woo Rhee
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Hopi Point Sunset with Colorado River View


AuntiPode wrote:



Hello AuntiPode,

Wonderful video. Interesting thing is he is using almost exact photo of mine from Grand Canyon. Thanks. ~Kee



Apr 25, 2014 at 07:50 PM





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