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Archive 2014 · Leica X Vario

  
 
c4change
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Leica X Vario


The specs of this camera looks awful on paper. There's a plethora of negative comments about this camera on the internet. But then I wonder how many of those people actually own/use this camera. IMHO this little cam deserves much more love. It's a respectable, no-nonsense, practical solution to street/travel photography.

Update:

An image thread of the X Vario is created as requested. Here's the link:
https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1287347/0#12274814









Edited on Apr 15, 2014 at 04:45 PM · View previous versions



Apr 10, 2014 at 06:05 PM
FlyPenFly
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Leica X Vario


Everything I've read about the "slow" lens attached to this camera by people who have used it seem very positive.


Apr 10, 2014 at 06:52 PM
millsart
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Leica X Vario


c4change wrote:
The specs of this camera looks awful on paper. There's a plethora of negative comments about this camera on the internet. But then I wonder how many of those people actually own/use this camera. IMHO this little cam deserves much more love. It's a respectable, no-nonsense, practical solution to street/travel photography.




Its got a nice solid build, and if you don't need speed, the lens is good, so it certainly can produce some nice images, but given the price tag, I don't think I would think of it as a remotely "practical" camera, unless your among those who travel 1st class.

Something like a Fuji XM1 with the quite good for the money 18-55 OSS, or an Olympus EM10 w/ a 12-30 zoom and a 25/1.8, or a A6000, or a Ricoh GR etc etc all seem far more practical in terms of being far more affordable while having quite decent IQ and a travel friendly size.

I suppose Leica and Practical are perhaps something of oxymorons though, and why I'm sure Fuji, Olympus, Sony etc sell likely several thousand camera for every one that Leica sells.

Again, I'm not saying its a bad camera, its actually pretty cool overall, just have to keep its limitations in mind, but the price is a big issue for myself and I'd imagine most people.

If it was $699, I'd totally buy one though.


As it stands, its like a 2 seat sports car. Pricey, can't do too much with it, so it sure can't be your only car, but if you've got the money, and a 3 car garage, would be nice to have



Apr 10, 2014 at 07:05 PM
c4change
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Leica X Vario


I've tried the Fuji and Ricoh. They are in a different category (and I didn't mean price). I have yet to see something from those manufactures to come up with a color palette that is as true to life as Leica, under all lighting situations (especially artificial light).

To some extent I agree with your 3 car garage analogy though. Another way to look at the price tag is how much it would cost for an M plus a Leica 28mm, 35mm, 50mm, and 70mm. Then the price tag is not that bad. Sure with X vario you don't get the large aperture, but for stopped down shots you are getting the versatility without (much, if any) optical compromise. Yeah I wished it'd be cheaper. But I am not complaining given its build and performance.



Apr 10, 2014 at 07:29 PM
Taylor Sherman
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Leica X Vario


I can't see anyone buying an M9 or M and a four-lens kit where all their lenses are that slow. You actually have to try really hard and find some old, old lenses to make that happen. There's almost certainly going to be at least one lens in that person's collection that is reasonably fast (even if f/2.8) and that immediately makes the analogy to the X-Vario broken.

I don't even get how you can think of the X-Vario being a 2-seat sports car. It's more like a Jetta wagon with a Bentley label on it at a BMW price. The camera makes no sense to me at all.




Apr 10, 2014 at 07:52 PM
c4change
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Leica X Vario


I never thought I'd pick up that jetta wagon, not by reading its specs and judging by the price tag. Well that jetta has some surprises up its sleeve.


Apr 10, 2014 at 09:53 PM
FlyPenFly
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Leica X Vario


I think of it more of an E30 M3. WRX/EVO fan boys will scoff at it because you can get so much more for so much less but they're missing the point.


Apr 10, 2014 at 10:10 PM
tomtofa
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Leica X Vario


No EVF included, and it only takes a fairly obsolete one. Lens has a fair amount of distortion, though it's corrected pretty well. I was hoping it would be the rebirth of the D2; if it included a viewfinder maybe it would have been . . .


Apr 10, 2014 at 10:11 PM
galenapass
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Leica X Vario


I'd have to see some side-by-side tests before I would be convinced about this camera. I'll admit, it does look intriguing.


Apr 10, 2014 at 10:48 PM
millsart
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Leica X Vario


c4change wrote:
I've tried the Fuji and Ricoh. They are in a different category (and I didn't mean price). I have yet to see something from those manufactures to come up with a color palette that is as true to life as Leica, under all lighting situations (especially artificial light).



Are you talking JPEG or RAW (or should I say .DNG) when it comes to color ?

Unless I'm mistaken, the new X is still using the old X2 APS-C sensor, and having owned the X1 and X2, I can't say I was really ever thrilled with the color those cameras put out, and my M9 wasn't really even usable for jpegs. M240 does look like Leica has made progress though.

Some Xtrans issues aside, I don't really see how one 16.2 meg APS-C camera with CMOS, in the case of the Ricoh, is all that different than another APS-C 16.2meg CMOS sensor in the X. If it was CCD then yeah, but they could likely be the same sensor even



Apr 10, 2014 at 10:58 PM
rico
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Leica X Vario


X Vario has no custom leather, so X2 remains the real player. As Lana Del Rey would say, "Take that body downtown".
http://us.leica-camera.com/assets/gallery/8139.jpg



Apr 10, 2014 at 11:30 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Leica X Vario


Everything's overpriced if you have no desire for it.

But a camera that makes you want to go out and shoot is worth every penny, no matter what the cost.

And from what I've seen in this forum, none of us are above making gear choices others would find questionable in their value.



Apr 11, 2014 at 01:06 AM
Spyro P.
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Leica X Vario


c4change wrote:
There's a plethora of negative comments about this camera on the internet. But then I wonder how many of those people actually own/use this camera.


Not saying this is the case with this camera, I don't know this camera, but don't expect too many people to openly admit that they just dropped $2k+ on a mediocre product.

Just human nature



Apr 11, 2014 at 01:49 AM
Jon Tainton
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Leica X Vario


c4change wrote:
The specs of this camera looks awful on paper. There's a plethora of negative comments about this camera on the internet. But then I wonder how many of those people actually own/use this camera. IMHO this little cam deserves much more love. It's a respectable, no-nonsense, practical solution to street/travel photography.


+1

The optics and manual focus implementation of the XV 'fly by wire' zoom lens makes the XV imo. But the camera does need an external VF (the Olympus) and lens hood for peace of mind. BTW as a piece of engineering the lens hood would get my vote for quality design and also my vote too, for sticker shock ...



Apr 11, 2014 at 03:43 AM
jojomon11
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Leica X Vario


Im gonna pick one up once it's at 2k


Apr 11, 2014 at 08:29 PM
c4change
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Leica X Vario


Well said.

freaklikeme wrote:
Everything's overpriced if you have no desire for it.

But a camera that makes you want to go out and shoot is worth every penny, no matter what the cost.

And from what I've seen in this forum, none of us are above making gear choices others would find questionable in their value.




Apr 11, 2014 at 09:03 PM
justruss
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Leica X Vario


I think the review on LL had it right: Fine camera as far as output (pretty clean files, pretty sharp lens, pretty nice colors), but more of a luxury item (he compared it to watches, where the $1,000 model may not keep time any better than the $10 model) than a utility item.

So it's in line, IQ-wise, with everything from a Canon M, to a Ricoh GR, to a Sony A6000 (OK, I bet the Sony beats it in IQ), but it's built more finely, and people pay more for the design, name, and perceived (which may be real) build quality.

For me, cameras are a utility. And I only care about build quality in terms of how something holds up, not whether it feels "premium" or cheap. So I'm not in the market. And to me it is wildly, wildly overpriced because I have no interest in the luxury aspect of the product.

What I have yet to see, though, is anything demonstrating that the IQ is what demands the price Leica is asking for this. To me it competes with cameras in the $400 to $800 range in that sense.

The photo here is fine, but, to me, it doesn't demonstrate any special optical/imaging qualities.



Apr 12, 2014 at 03:02 AM
c4change
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Leica X Vario


I agree this photo does not show the potential for this camera. Among the small cameras I personally have used X-100, X-Pro1, GR, NEX5/6, EOS-M, G15. While these offer very economical solutions with acceptable IQ, and they may even win hands down in certain areas, ISO, for example, my experience is that the X vario is a better camera. I have done some side to side test between an X vario, a D3, and a XE1, under artificial lighting. The fuji failed miserably. While the D3 came very close to duplicating the true color, that is, after tweaking the RAW files up and down, it's still not as good as the X vario. I don't think I saved the side to side shots. But go rent one and try it out for yourself. If I have time I may do another side to side. For me, that reason alone is enough to justify the extra cost: true colors.






Apr 12, 2014 at 08:24 AM
jojomon11
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Leica X Vario


Start a X vario image thread c4change


Apr 12, 2014 at 08:48 AM
galenapass
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Leica X Vario


c4change wrote:
I agree this photo does not show the potential for this camera. Among the small cameras I personally have used X-100, X-Pro1, GR, NEX5/6, EOS-M, G15. While these offer very economical solutions with acceptable IQ, and they may even win hands down in certain areas, ISO, for example, my experience is that the X vario is a better camera. I have done some side to side test between an X vario, a D3, and a XE1, under artificial lighting. The fuji failed miserably. While the D3 came very close to duplicating the true color, that is, after tweaking the RAW
...Show more

I see so many comments on these forums about "true" colors, or better skin tone. Some people like X brand vs.Y brand and the ability of X brand to produce this desired output justifies it over Y. Then in another thread you will see the exact same argument, but backward. Now Y brand is superior. I'd consider buying one of these cameras if what you say is true but this argument is so soft and nebulous, it would be more convincing to post your comparisons and links to raw files so people could check for themselves. I am not saying this to be contentious, but I am curious. You have to admit, from an objective standpoint, either the Vario is superior or you are not processing files correctly. It's just hard to tell with no data.



Apr 12, 2014 at 09:27 AM
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