Home · Register · Search · View Winners · Software · Hosting · Software · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda, JimFox
Username   Password

FM Forum Rules
Landscape Posting Guidelines
  

FM Forums | Landscape Photographer | Join Upload & Sell

1      
2
       3       4       end
  

Sw Grand Vista
  
 
Nigel Turner
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Sw Grand Vista


Hi Mark,

As I said its no problem and I'm sorry that you feel that I'm being negative. But after all its a forum where you expect input from posting.

Good luck Mark and best wishes.
Nigel.




Apr 08, 2014 at 01:25 AM
gdanmitchell
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Sw Grand Vista


Nigel Turner wrote:
Why don't you just say what you think in easily read terms.


;-)



Apr 08, 2014 at 01:50 AM
Steve Perry
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Sw Grand Vista


Hey Mark -

Steering this back on topic...

Cool image - I have to say I like the 2nd rendition better, it really pops off my screen! Wish I was there when it happened - I love me a good T-Storm.




Apr 08, 2014 at 02:12 AM
dbehrens
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Sw Grand Vista


Steve Perry wrote:
Hey Mark -

Steering this back on topic...

Cool image - I have to say I like the 2nd rendition better, it really pops off my screen! Wish I was there when it happened - I love me a good T-Storm.



+1. Lovely pic but I prefer the 2nd pic with less saturation and contrast.
Dave



Apr 08, 2014 at 03:17 AM
Mark Metternich
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Sw Grand Vista


Well, if photography needs to try to only be "reality" then there are no vignettes in reality, there is no polarization to enhance sky contrast or eliminate glare on water surfaces, we certainly don't see in black and white, better throw away those Orton filters (they may be of the devil ) or breathing on your lens, better get rid of Fuji Velvia film, better quit printing on Fuji Flex super gloss, and ND filters darkening a sky for dramatic effect, well that is a sin, even worse is the horror of a long exposure! My 10 stop ND's better go out the door, as well as stopping down to get that 2 second water texture, or soft look on the waves, better utterly throw wide angle lenses away since they distort the way we see massively, better not clone out the cigarette butt, certainly better not have motion blur on a moving object, better use HDR software to avoid silhouettes in shadows, better not over or underexpose, better not create a sun star by photographing at f/16-22 when the sun is cutting into a horizon, better not use a strong S-Curve in Photoshop or use "Camera Landscape" as your base rendering in raw, and I could go on forever....

Nope, its all art.

And there will always be new breeds of photographers coming up that keep pushing optimization, creative rendering and so forth. As long as I am in this industry, so will I sometimes. Got to do what you love! No one is the rule maker as to what we are supposed to, or not supposed to do, or what photography is supposed to be.



Apr 08, 2014 at 03:37 AM
Mark Metternich
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Sw Grand Vista


Steve Perry wrote:
Hey Mark -

Steering this back on topic...

Cool image - I have to say I like the 2nd rendition better, it really pops off my screen! Wish I was there when it happened - I love me a good T-Storm.




Huge thanks Steve. The lightening nearby was awesome. I don't ever take clients into a dangerous situation, but we lucked out because it was passing by us to the north.

Yes, like I mentioned above I made this for 500px.com which has a white background, so I developed it on a white background in PS. When it came to converting it for a dark gray background here on Fred, I did a quick lazy job. So I too like the mellowed version. I think it looks better on the latter forum.



Apr 08, 2014 at 03:44 AM
Dustin Gent
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Sw Grand Vista


I have to say I like the photo. Style/processing is what sets everyone apart - and everyone has their own style. No doubt "the glow" seems to be the big trend right now - and rightfully so. When done right, results are really appealing.

As for Nigel, i checked out his work and he has very nice stuff as well. Personally, I like the more "natural" look, but it is all preference. Can't we all just get along



Apr 08, 2014 at 03:45 AM
Mark Metternich
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Sw Grand Vista


chez wrote:
Mark, I really like the composition but am having a hard time liking the image. My feeling is the post processing is too heavy handed here giving an HDR appearance to the image. If that is what you were after, then I guess you succeeded, but just not to my liking.

You wouldn't have a version which portrays the scene in a more natural way. I'd love to see it with less overall contrast and less saturation just to see as a comparison.

Harry



Hi Harry.

Sorry, there are no other renderings of the image. I may do a slight revision here and there but essentially the same.

I am mostly happy with it. By now I am sure you know that I sometimes like a little creative flare to my work and rendering and as the Nigel and I thing shows, my rendering approaches may not appeal to some. I am not sure why but Fred Miranda Landscape seems to have a little more of the stricter realism folks (and I'm not downing those - everyone see things differently and likes different stuff - IMO that variety is the spice of life, without it life would be boring). But, I don't get nearly the "that's not real" or "that's Photoshopped" type of comments anywhere else. But that is fine. I'll just keep doing what I do and love and let the chips fly where they may. But having said that, no comment or critique on the forum ever goes without serious consideration with me. I value it! I have grown leaps and bounds in my development over the years because of that critical feedback. Without it I would never have become a professional.

So, thank you for your feedback.


Edited on Apr 08, 2014 at 04:22 AM · View previous versions



Apr 08, 2014 at 04:13 AM
Sunny Sra
Offline
• • • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Sw Grand Vista


Mark,
Well thought out, well shot. You are absolutely right, everyone has their own style. Keep on rocking.



Apr 08, 2014 at 04:21 AM
Kee Woo Rhee
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Sw Grand Vista


Mark, It looks like that you became the target from Nigel Turner after he did it to me. Don't feel bad. I took his harsh and unreasonable comments not as annoyance but as an entertainment. Your previous two photos of the Coal Mine Canyon were very inspiring. I have changed my attitude about photography. Also I should mention in public that you kindly provided all the information how to get to the spot (literally the spot you took your clients) by providing google maps even with your hand drawn arrows! That was really nice of you. Your honest and sincere effort toward photography is really respected. I don't care how good images people produce. I care about the integrity and human nature! Keep up good work and be the most successful person.


Apr 08, 2014 at 04:53 AM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



Mark Metternich
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Sw Grand Vista


Kee Woo Rhee wrote:
Mark, It looks like that you became the target from Nigel Turner after he did it to me. Don't feel bad. I took his harsh and unreasonable comments not as annoyance but as an entertainment. Your previous two photos of the Coal Mine Canyon were very inspiring. I have changed my attitude about photography. Also I should mention in public that you kindly provided all the information how to get to the spot (literally the spot you took your clients) by providing google maps even with your hand drawn arrows! That was really nice of you. Your honest
...Show more


Thank you Kee.

I have nothing against him, I simply disagree. I have thick skin. I can have a healthy debate or even argument with people and still be great friends. In fact I usually love to debate. If all our friends agree with us, our life will be boring. Even though you will not know it by my profile, I have been here (had another user name before I used my real name) about 10 years now. So, by now I better know some wont like my image or my style. That is fine with me. It really is! If we try to please everyone we end up a mess and pleasing no one. I'm about 98-99% satisfied with my image and I think it looks better here: http://500px.com/photo/66087429?from=user



Apr 08, 2014 at 05:01 AM
matthewh133
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Sw Grand Vista


Nigel Turner wrote:
Hi Mark,

I understand what you are saying and I feel that that is where photographers and photography differs nowadays as it seems there is a wide gulf between us.

There are the more 'purist' photographers who manage to capture the light, as is on the 'very rare occasion' when its at it's absolute best and those that 'manufacture' it out of nowhere. I spend on average 20 weeks a year in the field, and have done so for the last 20 years and I can say that I rarely see anything like the dramatic skies and lighting conditions that are
...Show more

I see what you're saying, but I fail to see how they would fair without modern technology matters even in the slightest to anyone other than old fogees stuck in their old ways. I don't mean to sound harsh, but the fact is, we HAVE that technology now. It exists, and it's not going away. People need to get over the "back in my days" thought process because the new ways aren't going to magically disappear. Sure, maybe you don't like the look of modern processing, fair enough, but no need to go pushing your anti-software opinions on others.



Apr 08, 2014 at 06:57 AM
CW100
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Sw Grand Vista


I like it!


Apr 08, 2014 at 11:34 AM
voltaire
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Sw Grand Vista


I like how you took several hundred images to capture the moment. Keep on shooting. As far as post processing goes, we all differ and respect the photographer's interpretation.


Apr 08, 2014 at 11:55 AM
Justin Grimm
Online
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Sw Grand Vista


Man, its pretty unfortunate that people so often devolve your image threads into an endless debate, instead of giving constructive feedback. You offer a lot of processing tips and details about how to capture better shots, and usually get jumped on as if you are the only one manipulating your images to get the look you want. I'd be pissed.

In any case, you already know I like this image since it was the background on my phone for a while Something does feel different about it though this time around. Almost like a silvery/grey tint to the highlights, which is what I'm guessing most people are giving you a hard time about. I dont mind that, but I do find the really dark patches on the left distracting, especially the far ridge. I think people (including myself) have a much higher standard from your work, because a lot of other people's images will pass by without a single comment from anyone instead of pointing out what looks off.

Anyways, see you down there in a month for food and drinks!



Apr 08, 2014 at 01:00 PM
gnbuzz
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · Sw Grand Vista


Mark, I've really been diggin' on your work, so that's the point of view I'm coming from in this post

I have to respectfully disagree with Justin and others, and even you, for feeling like the non-critique discussion being any sort of negative. Most artists would kill for the type of conversation your work provokes (facilitates?). Being ogled and then forgotten would be the worst.

As Justin points out, you do appear to be ganged up on for your techniques, but I think that's because you are willing to engage.

Coming from a writing and journalism background, I also always find the purist/realism vs. next gen/processed discussion to be instructive. One of the Web niches I once started was about high-school girl athletes. Once I told a room of photojournalists that I removed large, obvious blemishes from faces in my images, and got hammered! My point was, the girls not only would not look at my photos otherwise, they'd never let me photograph them again. If your "art" is never viewed, is it really art?

There is a certain camp that advocates making your images "pop" and their techniques usually revolve around contrast and saturation. When I started following your work, Mark, and those of the photographers you named earlier in this thread, the blending approaches started to win me over. Your guys' work is soft and serene, and gives me a good feeling. I'm not totally over to where you guys are, but I'm migrating, and introducing some of it has, in my opinion, strengthened my work.

That all said, this isn't one of my favorite pieces of your work. I think what Justin says about the silvery/gray tint, which I'm taking as the "glow" you applied, is the crux of what "bothers" me. It gives the image a slightly over-processed feel. I even feel the connection between the bolt of lightning and the resulting glow in the scene. I don't dislike this piece, I simply don't think it is as pleasing as others that have knocked my socks off.

Glenn



Apr 08, 2014 at 02:49 PM
gdanmitchell
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · Sw Grand Vista


gnbuzz wrote:
Coming from a writing and journalism background, I also always find the purist/realism vs. next gen/processed discussion to be instructive.


What I enjoy about your comment, taken as a whole, is that it suggests that the "real versus processed" extreme points of view are unrealistic and perhaps even distracting. Virtually no photography lies at either extreme—no one goes as far with "processing" as is possible and no one is completely realistic.

One of the reasons the issue is so interesting and so open to discussion and differences of opinion is that ultimately it comes down to subjective matters of taste and preference. That question—how we respond to images and why—is one of the most important subjects in photography or any other art, whether you produce it or enjoy experiencing it.

Dan


Edited on Apr 08, 2014 at 03:37 PM · View previous versions



Apr 08, 2014 at 02:55 PM
andyjaggy82
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · Sw Grand Vista


I personally prefer more natural looking images, For example I much prefer Nigel's images in his portfolio than Mark's images. Sorry Mark though Mark does have some images I really do dig.

I'm not against processing, and of course I do quite a bit of it myself in my own work. But I do like to stay true to the scene, and would be embarrassed if someone who was there when I took a shot looked at my image and knew it wasn't what we saw.

I think mostly I am just tired of all the Marc Adamus clones and everyone applying massive amounts of orton and glow and haze to every shot. I think we also need to remember that processing styles come and go, there is a good chance some of us might look back in 10 years and wonder why in the world we felt the need to make every image we shot look like it was from Lord of the Rings or some magical place where the atmosphere is constantly heavy with mist and glow.

Edit: But honestly whatever, I'm glad that everyone has different styles, it would be a pretty boring photography climate if everyone was the same.

Edited on Apr 08, 2014 at 03:04 PM · View previous versions



Apr 08, 2014 at 02:59 PM
CarlG
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · Sw Grand Vista


How 'bout them Yankees!!

(LOVE the image, Mark)



Apr 08, 2014 at 03:02 PM
Gary Clennan
Online
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · Sw Grand Vista


Mark Metternich wrote:
Nope, its all art.






Apr 08, 2014 at 03:50 PM
1      
2
       3       4       end




FM Forums | Landscape Photographer | Join Upload & Sell

1      
2
       3       4       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username   Password    Reset password