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Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replac...
  
 
amacal1
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Maybe for the best.

I see that I can get a QNAP TS-212-E for $128 from newegg (after discount).

It seems like an awesome unit. USB 3.0, gigabit Ethernet, good backup software that supports synchronization of some kind, etc.

http://www.qnap.com/useng/index.php?lang=en-us&sn=862&c=355&sc=688&t=696&n=20423

I've seen some reviews where people are praising it's fast transfer speeds. So, this may be the one. The discount code from newegg is only temporary so I may have to pull the trigger faster than I expected. They also have a discount on WD Red drives today, so I can pick those up for about the same price as their blue and green models.



Feb 27, 2014 at 05:27 PM
amacal1
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


No further thoughts, anyone? I'm thinking I better pull the trigger tonight if I'm going to get the QNAP.


Feb 28, 2014 at 12:42 AM
Ho1972
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Go for it.

EDIT: my recommendation is based solely on the hardware. I'm using GoodSync for the backup chores since it's what I'm used to. The QNAP web interface looks slick and functional, but I've made no real use of it. I think if it had any major flaws the reviews would say so.



Feb 28, 2014 at 01:06 AM
mhayes5254
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Should do what you want. Just make sure you back it up.


Feb 28, 2014 at 03:53 AM
amacal1
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Well, actually, since I posted that message, the QNAP TS-212-E dropped to $119 and the TS-212-P dropped to $129.

So, I just bought the P model.

Thanks for all the help, everyone!



Feb 28, 2014 at 03:59 AM
15Bit
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Late to this party i see, but i would say i agree with Bob and Bifurcator - offline single drives, or plugged into your router via USB. One thing about that last though: Don't be tempted to set up your router-connected drive for external access (i.e. from outside home) as the router manufacturers seem to have difficulty programming this without adding serious security problems.

I think it is worth remembering what a backup is - it is a duplicate of your data to which you can return in the event of primary data loss or corruption. Some things follow logically from this:

1. RAID is not a backup. RAID is an uptime solution which can also offer performance benefits.
2. Backups should ideally be of the "snapshot" variety. i.e. write once and not touch it again. This is important, as most backup systems that folk implement here involve over-writing old data with updated new data. This protects against a catastrophic primary disk loss or "oops" moments when you delete a folder - events that you notice. But it doesn't protect against data loss that you don't know about or don't notice - if you accidentally overwrite a file on your primary disk without realising, it will over time propagate to your backups and then the original data is lost. Same for quiet data corruption.
3. More copies are better, and at least one should be offsite.

Personally i build my own linux-based disk arrays rather than buying commercial ones. I wouldn't recommend this to the non-geek though. I'm also now a fan of the ZFS filesystem, but again this is probably not for the non-geek.



Feb 28, 2014 at 06:20 AM
Alan321
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


My first drobo died - well, more like went in and out of a coma - and having two redundant drives in it was of no use whatsoever.

Your data is not fully protected unless you initiate multiple backups to multiple devices and ensure that they are not all on line at the same time and not all in the same place at the same time. Furthermore, as some data faults will not be evident straight away it is important to keep some of the older backups as well as the recent backups.

You need a mix of historical/inremental backups and full backups. Incremental backups are much quicker to do but if the index system that ties it together gets corrupted then it is probably completely broken and unusable for data recovery.

It is perfectly legitimate to allow for two or three simultaneous faults when deciding on a backup strategy - especially if you are as unlucky as I have been over the decades.

In hindsight it was very fortunate that the main drive was not backing up to your one and only backup as it began to fail.


15bit mentioned the ZFS file system. Unfortunately it is not available for Windows. I was using it on an SSD in my Macbook Pro until the SSD died. At least I can be sure that the data was ok, but I can never get at it

- Alan



Mar 02, 2014 at 03:16 PM
15Bit
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Alan321 wrote:
15bit mentioned the ZFS file system. Unfortunately it is not available for Windows. I was using it on an SSD in my Macbook Pro until the SSD died. At least I can be sure that the data was ok, but I can never get at it

Actually it wouldn't be ok - all the ZFS redundancy magic requires at least 2 drives.

ZFS also has an annoying feature that if your host computer dies you can't just pull the drives and plug them into another to get your data. I don't really understand the reasoning behind this design decision, but you have to "export" the array (z-pool) before you unplug them and move them. Without that "export" the array won't start on a new computer.



Mar 02, 2014 at 03:55 PM
amacal1
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


I'm not quite giving up ok my drive (and data just yet). I'm still investigating the problem, since it appears to be mechanically sound.

I'm discovering some quirky problems with my drives that were in Windows 8 installations. I discovered that my drive couldn't be accessed in Ubuntu, so I thought that was further evidence of some type of fault/corruption. However, I now see that none of the dives that have been in any of my Windows 8 systems can be accessed in Ubuntu, and perhaps other Windows installations.



Mar 02, 2014 at 08:15 PM
Alan321
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Alan321 wrote:
15bit mentioned the ZFS file system. Unfortunately it is not available for Windows. I was using it on an SSD in my Macbook Pro until the SSD died. At least I can be sure that the data was ok, but I can never get at it

15Bit wrote:
Actually it wouldn't be ok - all the ZFS redundancy magic requires at least 2 drives.

ZFS also has an annoying feature that if your host computer dies you can't just pull the drives and plug them into another to get your data. I don't really understand the reasoning behind this design decision, but you have to "export" the array (z-pool) before you unplug them and move them. Without that "export" the array won't start on a new computer.


Thanks for that info. My comment was based on the existence of a ZFS utility on the Mac that would tell me whether or not ZFS had detected any unintended data changes based on its built-in data validation feature. Even with a single drive that is a useful capability. It had told me that the data was ok but of course that ceased to mean anything when the drive became totally inaccessible.




Mar 03, 2014 at 01:13 AM
 

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Alan321
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


amacal1 wrote:
I'm not quite giving up ok my drive (and data just yet). I'm still investigating the problem, since it appears to be mechanically sound.

I'm discovering some quirky problems with my drives that were in Windows 8 installations. I discovered that my drive couldn't be accessed in Ubuntu, so I thought that was further evidence of some type of fault/corruption. However, I now see that none of the dives that have been in any of my Windows 8 systems can be accessed in Ubuntu, and perhaps other Windows installations.



Perhaps it used a partition system that is incompatible with Ubuntu.



Mar 03, 2014 at 01:16 AM
Bifurcator
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Alan321 wrote:
15bit mentioned the ZFS file system. Unfortunately it is not available for Windows. I was using it on an SSD in my Macbook Pro until the SSD died. At least I can be sure that the data was ok, but I can never get at it

15Bit wrote:
Actually it wouldn't be ok - all the ZFS redundancy magic requires at least 2 drives.


Whuuuut? Why would you want ZFS on Windows or OS X? It's niche is NAS. Specifically in home rolled (DIY) systems and is one of the reasons people build their own instead of going with something from Buffalo or whoever. When you build your own NAS or iSCSI system you want a free, well supported, small, tight, and very stable environment and that's for sure not Windows or really even OS X.

That would be like wanting to put an emergency generator for an apartment building in your car just so you can be assured your radio play won't be interrupted. :-/




Mar 03, 2014 at 01:53 AM
15Bit
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Actually i should qualify that comment slightly - ZFS redundancy magic requires 2 copies. So you can do it on one disk if you are happy to lose half the capacity (and possibly half the speed too), but few people take that option i think.

BIF - ZFS isn't really a NAS-niche file system. It is a fully functioned Enterprise filesystem and has more than a "niche" there. Indeed it leads the way for next gen FS's: Linux has a similar native FS in development (BTRFS) and Microsoft now has ReFS. Neither are so mature as ZFS though. You could argue that such filesystems are less applicable at the desktop/home level (indeed MS does as ReFS is Server edition only), but with increasing drive sizes the bit-rot problem becomes an issue even there.



Mar 03, 2014 at 06:09 AM
Paul Mo
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Although it doesn't address the issue of an offsite backup, you could build your own computer for less than a commercial NAS and populate it with disks in RAID 10.

Data storage and back ups become increasingly expensive as we store more data.

This mobo ( http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4727#ov ) has 8 headers but with a dedicated RAID card (from LSI for example) and you'd be flying.



Mar 03, 2014 at 07:53 AM
aubsxc
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Bifurcator wrote:
Whuuuut? Why would you want ZFS on Windows or OS X? It's niche is NAS. Specifically in home rolled (DIY) systems and is one of the reasons people build their own instead of going with something from Buffalo or whoever. When you build your own NAS or iSCSI system you want a free, well supported, small, tight, and very stable environment and that's for sure not Windows or really even OS X.

That would be like wanting to put an emergency generator for an apartment building in your car just so you can be assured your radio play won't be
...Show more

ZFS is the Solaris file system. It is designed for enterprise use with virtually unlimited scalability, and has built-in features like data integrity with end to end checksums, self healing, on-disk encryption, and efficient deduplication and compression. ZFS is NOT a niche NAS product, nor was it developed to be such.



Mar 03, 2014 at 01:52 PM
Bifurcator
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


It's not native to any OS commonly used - it's a niche product!

Because it's not native to OS X or Windows there is no OS support for it.

Because our OS's don't incorporate ZFS it's NOT USEFUL for system direct storage devices!

One NEEDS to use it with Linux (preferably BSD) and the only sane way to make use of that is as NAS where the drive(s) are running under an OS which supports it.

For you and I I'm sorry but ZFS is a niche product good ONLY for NAS and such. Unless you're running Linux or are on one of Sun's boxes you just simply can NOT say otherwise.






Mar 03, 2014 at 02:58 PM
aubsxc
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


Bifurcator wrote:
It's not native to any OS commonly used - it's a niche product!

Because it's not native to OS X or Windows there is no OS support for it.

Because our OS's don't incorporate ZFS it's NOT USEFUL for system direct storage devices!

One NEEDS to use it with Linux (preferably BSD) and the only sane way to make use of that is as NAS where the drive(s) are running under an OS which supports it.

For you and I I'm sorry but ZFS is a niche product good ONLY for NAS and such. Unless you're running Linux or are on one of
...Show more


I think you are confusing ZFS with FreeNAS. They are not the same thing. FreeNAS uses the FreeBSD OS and implements an open source version of ZFS. Other operating systems that use ZFS can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZFS#Platforms


Second, BSD is NOT Linux, it is Unix. Again, big difference.

ZFS is designed to be run in an enterprise environment, from workstations to massive server systems hosting data and virtual machines. I use Solaris at home on a self-built box to run commercial finite element software and Matlab, and FreeNAS to serve data and VMs. Just because ZFS is not natively implemented on OsX or Windows does not make it a niche product. It is arguably the most advanced file system on the planet today and is used by corporations, educational institutions and individuals, and its use extends far beyond simple home built NAS boxes.


Whuuuut? Why would you want ZFS on Windows or OS X? It's niche is NAS. Specifically in home rolled (DIY) systems and is one of the reasons people build their own instead of going with something from Buffalo or whoever.

People have used ZFS in user-friendly NAS operating systems because of the advanced features that ZFS offers. ZFS was not designed for the DIY NAS market, it was designed to provide secure and efficient hardware controller independent data storage on Unix workstations and servers.



Mar 03, 2014 at 03:23 PM
alvit
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


I keep it very simple
Image Backup ALL my C drive on D drive every night with Acronis True Image plus a second copy on an external Disk just in case, this external enclosure uses a 2 HDD alternatively.
I experienced some crashes in the past but in around an hour, it depends the amount of data, you are back in business . Plus once a month, True Image makes me a perfect Clone disk



Mar 07, 2014 at 10:19 PM
mhayes5254
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


At present, my files can fit easily on a single 3 TB drive and I keep 2 fully independent backups, one off-site. I would only use RAID of my data size exceeds the capacity of a single drive.

The benefit of the single drive is I can simply plug it into any other computer and get back the information. Proprietary solutions always have the complication that you need access to the propietary hardware to get back your info. If you have data on something like DROBO, you loose everything if the box itself fails. You need a second full backup of the array in order to have a real backup. I suppose you could buy a second DROBO or equivalent. What non-proprietary options are available for backups that span more than one volume? Do things like Acronis backup to multiple volumes? I am currently using Apple time machine, which I beleive can write to only a single logical volume.



Mar 09, 2014 at 02:42 PM
15Bit
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · Internal HDD failed, Please recommend NAS unit for replacement


mhayes5254 wrote:
What non-proprietary options are available for backups that span more than one volume?


Software RAID. Unlike the proprietary NAS boxes, a software RAID array can usually be unplugged, moved to another PC running the same OS and it will fire up again.



Mar 09, 2014 at 04:02 PM
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