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Scammers in our Midst
  
 
tottsbrut
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p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · Scammers in our Midst


aspirebooth wrote:
No its not. You think it is but its not. It's the worst thing you can accept as it has all the assurances taken off. All you gain is saving 2.9%.

The buyer loads their funds into the account via a credit card.

They send you paypal gift.

They call their credit card stating the charge was unauthorized.

The second they do that you are out the money and the merchandise. Paypal will not do a single thing to help you.


So how can we sell to someone with no feedback, safely? What about regular Paypal, get the payment, then transfer the payment to your bank account, and when it has transferred successfully send the merchandise? I wish I was more of a crook so I could figure these slimeballs out. I have someone wanting my D700 but I'm leery.



Mar 10, 2014 at 08:53 PM
shelbystripes
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p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · Scammers in our Midst


Weasel_Loader wrote:
Anytime I submit an offer to a seller, my price is total including paypal and shipping fees. I simply cannot understand why sellers try to hook people with a low price and then ask for 3% AND shipping. Like other have stated, just add those fees into your price folks!

This should just be the rule. I don't think the site owner even needs to police it that much; just declare this is the rule, and before long I'm pretty sure people will be posting in threads and going, "Your posted price has to include fees. Stop asking for extra for fees." Not saying that'll stop it entirely, but it would still make it happen less often.



Mar 10, 2014 at 09:12 PM
tottsbrut
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p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · Scammers in our Midst


Okay... so I just edited a B/S posting where I'm selling three items (D700 and 2 lenses), and said "Price is shipped".... is that what you guys are saying it should say?


Mar 11, 2014 at 01:02 AM
Weasel_Loader
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p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · Scammers in our Midst


tottsbrut wrote:
Okay... so I just edited a B/S posting where I'm selling three items (D700 and 2 lenses), and said "Price is shipped".... is that what you guys are saying it should say?


Almost there. To avoid confusion, I would just say Price includes shipping and Paypal fees. I would also include the type of shipping you intend to use as well (USPS Priority, Fed Ex, UPS).



Mar 11, 2014 at 05:25 AM
shworl
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p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · Scammers in our Midst


If you accept regular PayPal and ship with an insured delivery confirmation, you should be protected both ways. Claiming the goods were never received is a standard scammer practice. I always ship with an insured delivery confirmation even if I am returning an item or sending it in for repair. It costs a few dollars (maybe $5 or $10) more but is well worth it.


Mar 13, 2014 at 12:00 AM
bkool
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p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · Scammers in our Midst


Good to know all these.


Mar 13, 2014 at 01:04 AM
mogud
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p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · Scammers in our Midst


aspirebooth wrote:
I tell you why. The companies that sell the items don't make consumers Pay the fees. Most consumer refuse to pay the fees as truly merchant fees are a part of doing business. Granted Paypal is ripping people off at 2.9%+ when standard merchant accounts are in the 1.8% range. Either way it would be hard to find buyers that are willing to pay the fees as you say since you'll be pricing your equipment higher than the next person.


From your response it would appear that you haven't purchased a new car lately. Added fees are a way of life in the automotive world.


Edited on Mar 13, 2014 at 06:28 PM · View previous versions



Mar 13, 2014 at 02:00 PM
mrgetalife
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p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · Scammers in our Midst


To be honest. Unless your sale is through E-bay.
Paypal will not lift a finger to help you. They'll throw you the line. This is not done via an approved store. Sales outside of XYZ are not protected by our policy. I know. I had a problem with a non-ebay sale with a store using an individual person's account.

Tips to using paypal.

#1 Get a checking account JUST for paypal. Make sure it has very little money in it. In case they get hacked which my god they will be at some point in time..

#2 When you get any cash into it. Immediately withdraw it. Its exactly what scammers do. You should do the same. When you withdraw all your money paypal can't take it back. Bank's won't let them withdraw without permission. They can only freeze what's with them. And if they have nothing to freeze.

Given that either way paypal will screw you over is this a problem. Most of my tech sites I visit a lot of people started to use Amazon Payments. No real protection there either. But they don't freeze all your assets during a dispute.



Mar 13, 2014 at 05:32 PM
mogud
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p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · Scammers in our Midst


If you pay with a credit card through PayPal, your credit card company is the next best recourse against fraudulent transactions. In other words, do not pay for purchases with your confirmed PayPal bank account. Pay using your linked credit card. I would also recommend using American Express as the credit card


Mar 13, 2014 at 06:37 PM
ReneMurea
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p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · Scammers in our Midst


aspirebooth wrote:
No its not. You think it is but its not. It's the worst thing you can accept as it has all the assurances taken off. All you gain is saving 2.9%.

The buyer loads their funds into the account via a credit card.

They send you paypal gift.

They call their credit card stating the charge was unauthorized.

The second they do that you are out the money and the merchandise. Paypal will not do a single thing to help you.

You can send funds as a Paypal gift only if you use your bank account or your Paypal balance. Never from a credit card.


mrgetalife wrote:
#2 When you get any cash into it. Immediately withdraw it. Its exactly what scammers do. You should do the same. When you withdraw all your money paypal can't take it back.

It takes days for the money to show up in your bank account. Plenty of time for Paypal to reverse the charge. Unless you have a debit card linked with your Paypal account and only then you can withdraw the money from an ATM.



Mar 15, 2014 at 06:40 AM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



mdbrown9999
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p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · Scammers in our Midst


So, does anyone have any stories of scams beside the paypal gifting? Personally, I've have never purchased new camera equipment, it has all come from ebay/craigslist. I think the only bad experience was buying a lens from an ebay company that sold goods that were damaged in such a way that the retailer would not accept the shipment/object. I purchased a new nikon 80-200 f2.8 that was new in a damaged box. I felt the lens had a very soft focus. Contacted the company, but they never replied. Sold the lens on craigslist for what I paid for it.


Mar 15, 2014 at 11:12 AM
Danpbphoto
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p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · Scammers in our Midst


blitzn wrote:
Hmmm...i didn't realize this about PayPal gift. I just paid for a purchase this way today! This is good to know, thanks for pointing it out.



Fred has repeatedly warned FM'ers about using PP Gift!!!
Members have repeatedly warned about using PP gift!

There must be 25 posts on PP gift scams and other scams and why not to use it!

I think Fred better make a "sticky" about PP gift...
Dan



Mar 15, 2014 at 01:39 PM
ReneMurea
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p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · Scammers in our Midst


mdbrown9999 wrote:
So, does anyone have any stories of scams beside the paypal gifting? Personally, I've have never purchased new camera equipment, it has all come from ebay/craigslist. I think the only bad experience was buying a lens from an ebay company that sold goods that were damaged in such a way that the retailer would not accept the shipment/object. I purchased a new nikon 80-200 f2.8 that was new in a damaged box. I felt the lens had a very soft focus. Contacted the company, but they never replied. Sold the lens on craigslist for what I paid for it.

One of my friends paid using regular Paypal and instead of a video camera (happened years ago) he received a brick. No kidding, a nice brick. Eventually he got his money back from Paypal.
You're not safe as a seller either. The buyer could always claim s/he receiver a brick instead of whatever was supposed to be inside and then you're screwed, unless you can prove the right thing was in the package. When I don't feel comfortable with the buyer I always take pictures of the packaging process



Mar 15, 2014 at 04:38 PM
Tike71
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p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · Scammers in our Midst


ReneMurea wrote:
You can send funds as a Paypal gift only if you use your bank account or your Paypal balance. Never from a credit card.

Not true. You can use a credit card for Paypal gift (paypal will charge you 3% on top).



Mar 15, 2014 at 05:33 PM
Tike71
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p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · Scammers in our Midst


mdbrown9999 wrote:
So, does anyone have any stories of scams beside the paypal gifting? Personally, I've have never purchased new camera equipment, it has all come from ebay/craigslist. I think the only bad experience was buying a lens from an ebay company that sold goods that were damaged in such a way that the retailer would not accept the shipment/object. I purchased a new nikon 80-200 f2.8 that was new in a damaged box. I felt the lens had a very soft focus. Contacted the company, but they never replied. Sold the lens on craigslist for what I paid for it.

Don't ship anything over $250 without a signature confirmation. You will lose seller protection if buyer claims non-receipt (even if tracking shows delivered).



Mar 15, 2014 at 05:41 PM
Danpbphoto
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p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · Scammers in our Midst


Here is the link from Fred concerning PayPal:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1055958/0?keyword=x#10036314
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #1 Paypal Gift - Please read


Do NOT use Paypal Gift.
Let me write it again: DO NOT use Papal Gift...

If you always used Paypal gift, things may start getting 3% more expensive but at least you will have peace of mind. Think of it as if you are paying 3% insurance for your item. If things go wrong you will get your money back!

Ultimately, this decision is yours and I will not enforce it. If you still decide to use Paypal gift, be aware of the risks. As I wrote in the "Disclosure, Rules & Guidelines":

My advice is to take the time to always check references first. Members should NEVER use "money order", "money owed payment", "Paypal Gift" or any other uninsured payment methods. Only use insured credit card and insured Paypal when dealing with new members with low number of posts and feedback. Be aware of transactions coming from a WTB (Want to buy) threads whenever the interested party conducts all communications through pm or email.

We try our best to keep the site as safe as possible, but be aware of the risks when buying items online and make sure to always protect yourself.
Fred



Thanks Fred!
Dan



Mar 15, 2014 at 06:51 PM
campy
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p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · Scammers in our Midst


I had someone try to scam me on ebay saying it was an unauthorized credit card payment, but because I shipped it to a paypal verified U.S. address paypal ate the money, but I don't think they would have if it wasn't an ebay sale. Since ebay owns paypal they can't have too many sellers getting screwed or they will lose the listings which is what they are all about.



Mar 16, 2014 at 10:00 AM
jcolwell
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p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · Scammers in our Midst


mrgetalife wrote:
#2 When you get any cash into it. Immediately withdraw it. Its exactly what scammers do. You should do the same. When you withdraw all your money paypal can't take it back.

ReneMurea wrote:
You can send funds as a Paypal gift only if you use your bank account or your Paypal balance. Never from a credit card.
It takes days for the money to show up in your bank account. Plenty of time for Paypal to reverse the charge. Unless you have a debit card linked with your Paypal account and only then you can withdraw the money from an ATM.


If they want to, PayPal can go after your account even after you have withdrawn the funds. If it's NSF, then your account will go into overdraft. If the seller can't convince PayPal that it was a legit sale, then you can't play games to avoid the refund - unless you start doing dubious things like opening an account in a bogus name (read, jail time).



Mar 16, 2014 at 12:57 PM
mdbrown9999
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p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · Scammers in our Midst


Yeah, I run across these people everyday on ebay. Member since yesterday and selling a lens for half of what it's worth. Surprisingly, one or two people will bid on it. Greed is a hell of a thing.


Mar 16, 2014 at 05:30 PM
eggcellent
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p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · Scammers in our Midst


tottsbrut wrote:
So how can we sell to someone with no feedback, safely? What about regular Paypal, get the payment, then transfer the payment to your bank account, and when it has transferred successfully send the merchandise? I wish I was more of a crook so I could figure these slimeballs out. I have someone wanting my D700 but I'm leery.


I require buyers provide Paypal confirm address and their phone number. I always provide delivery confirmation and require adult signature to sign for package upon delivery. These steps are necessary for Paypal seller protection. For local sale, i require to meet at local Starbuck Coffee shop and cash as form of payment.



Mar 17, 2014 at 01:29 AM
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