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Archive 2014 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe

  
 
dougfatheruk
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


I received an email from the European distributor last night advising that PCB were pulling out of Europe as the distribution agreement had ended. Thankfully, I only enquired and never pulled the trigger on this stuff. People long complained about the price of PCB in Europe and the sentence regarding cover costs for shipping both ways doesn't make for good reading IMHO.

For a company so dedicated to customer service it's a shame it doesn't extend to those outside of the US.

“In order to serve customers located outside of the U.S. and Canada, we pursued relationships with international companies, allowing them to serve as authorized international dealers. Unfortunately, these relationships have ended as this method of sales was not cost effective and, most importantly, kept us too detached from our customers, prohibiting us from offering the kind of customer support that we strive to provide. In addition we have have to inform you that from the 31st January 2014 that all future repairs will be handled directly by Paul C Buff inc in the USA with the customer required to pay shipping both ways. Complete details regarding foreign customer product repairs will be posted on the Paul C Buff, Inc. USA website after Jan 1, 2014.”



Jan 13, 2014 at 05:01 AM
cbbr
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


I can only tell you that from my own experience the customer service in the US is second to none. It also seems, to me, like a small operation and my guess is that operating in several countries with multiple sets of laws, languages, tariffs taxes and huge shipping costs was never a good idea in the first place. And with the complaints of price, I can't imagine that they sold much there anyway.


Jan 13, 2014 at 06:18 AM
dougfatheruk
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


Your opinion is echoed throughout the web, my concern is for friends and colleagues in Europe who have invested in PCB gear at inflated prices, where does that leave them now?

What about just purchasing replacement tubes?



Jan 13, 2014 at 07:27 AM
Herb
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


Distributors in Europe want to make money too and the cost of doing business in Europe is higher than the USA, I am not sure why people are amazed at the higher prices that are there.....everything costs more in Europe.




Jan 13, 2014 at 08:29 AM
dougfatheruk
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


We expect higher prices but the business model here clearly never worked.

If a factory wants to supply direct to customers, cutting out dealers and distributors in the US, going outside of the US seemed doomed to fail unless PCB wanted to give an adequate export price to even up the international market. That's how every other business does it.

Of course you pay a little more in Europe but not this much, and that wasn't really the point of my post, I was more worried about people who have invested in the PCB brand in Europe and who have basically been told to get lost.



Jan 13, 2014 at 09:07 AM
kdphotography
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


The largest attraction to Buff products is the price point partnered with good customer service. The European market is going to dwindle to nothing imo.

For those already vested with Buff products in Europe and having to pay for shipping "both ways" for service? You might as well buy a new studio strobe...



Jan 13, 2014 at 09:24 AM
cbbr
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


A few years ago when I rode a dual-sport motorcycle, we used an in helmet bike to bike com system made by Auto Com. They were made in Europe and the US distributer went out of business. A friend and I ordered full systems from a shop in England and ordered parts from it as well. It took a bit longer for things to get to us and the mailing expense was higher, but it all worked out fine and the radios were so good that it was worth the effort.

I suspect that those who have PCB equipment will do what we did - wait a bit longer and pay a bit more. It's not the end of the world (especially for you since you apparently are not affected...).



Jan 13, 2014 at 11:22 AM
cordellwillis
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


dougfatheruk wrote:
...people who have invested in the PCB brand in Europe and who have basically been told to get lost.


Is that a fact or perceived notion?

*** or cbbr might have thoughtful idea that doesn't stop those who are invested ***

cbbr wrote:
I suspect that those who have PCB equipment will do what we did - wait a bit longer and pay a bit more. It's not the end of the world (especially for you since you apparently are not affected...).




Jan 13, 2014 at 12:48 PM
Mark_L
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


I got this too and wasn't all that surprised. Distribution seemed to be poorly managed, I knew about new products before they did "I will have to ask for info to add it to the website" and postage prices were bizarre (£22 for a 51" plm?). In some cases the product ended up being close to 3x the US price. If you called them you got an answerphone, it felt like it was being run out of someone's front room or something.


Jan 13, 2014 at 12:57 PM
Gregg Heckler
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


There are 100's and 100's of U.S. based (and Asian) companies including mine that successfully sell their products we make here, in Europe; direct and through distribution. Either PCB couldn't manage the process or the European's didn't want to spend the extra money for what they were getting. There is no rocket science to it.

Edited on Jan 14, 2014 at 01:00 AM · View previous versions



Jan 13, 2014 at 05:58 PM
kenyee
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


Gregg Heckler wrote:
companies including mine that successfully sell their products we make here, in Europe; direct and through distribution


Out of curiosity, how did you handle channel conflicts and selling prices?
Did you just raise your direct costs to they were the same as distributor selling prices?



Jan 13, 2014 at 10:44 PM
Gregg Heckler
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


We have two divisions based in England that sell throughout Europe. One division only sells our products through distribution. Customers are very loyal to specific distributors. The second only sells direct for those customers that prefer that. The two can compete but not on price. Our Suggested List price is the same for both and we only deviate or discount for legitimate Meet-Comp situations. We also sell under different brand names although the distributor and end users know that we make it here in the U.S. Currency issues are fun but we manage it. The problem many companies have that sell direct is when they set a list price that is too low for a distributor to make any profit. Once you do that there is no incentive for them to stock and sell your product. So, the obvious reason PCB stuff is cheap here is that they sell direct and you're not paying a distributor or retailer's markup, and inexpensive materials. But now you need your own inventory and you have to handle any customer services issues yourself. You can't just walk into the store and return it or have them send it for repair. There are advantages to both for a manufacturer and the customer. But understand, the cost of inventory and shipping is still the same no matter who you buy it from. So the only way you can sell something of a similar type for lower than the competition is to make it cheaper, with cheaper parts, make less profit, and or take the distributor out. Then there is the issue of VAT or taxes in general and possibly import duties over there, and when you combine this with freight, it makes for an expensive AB800 in Europe with no support structure. It could just be that nobody wanted to pay that much for one unless they were getting more for their money.


Jan 14, 2014 at 01:36 AM
v1sag3
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


I am a PCB customer from Australia. We also have the same issue with European customers.
I feel very disappointed with their decision.
Not just we paid extra (compare to US price), now we have to pay costly shipping cost if we ever need repair.



Jan 18, 2014 at 06:50 PM
Gregg Heckler
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


"Not just we paid extra (compare to US price), now we have to pay costly shipping cost if we ever need repair."

Cheaper sometimes comes with a price.



Jan 18, 2014 at 10:17 PM
kenyee
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


Gregg Heckler wrote:
The two can compete but not on price. Our Suggested List price is the same for both and we only deviate or discount for legitimate Meet-Comp situations


So even direct sales have a MAP so they can only sell as for the same cost as the distributors? That sounds like what is more typical (e.g., you can buy direct from manufacturer but they have to sell at the MAP as well).
PCB stuff wasn't priced that way AFAIK. Their pricing was based on a purely direct model which is good for customers in the US, but less so for non-US customers for the obvious reasons but mainly that a distributor has to add another layer on top that non-US customers can never understand when they compare their costs w/ ours :P



Jan 19, 2014 at 08:37 PM
Gregg Heckler
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Paul C Buff pulls out of Europe


"Their pricing was based on a purely direct model which is good for customers in the US,"

My opinion is that I don't think the majority of the Europe market was willing to pay extra for what they were getting. The ones that wanted a cheaper product well, they just wanted a cheaper product. They already have plenty of quality choices but they come at a price.

If you put no value on distribution or they haven't proven their value then this may be the OK. Buying directly isn't always "good" for you. As an example I can go to B&H or any other local retailer and buy anything I want not just one manufacturer or one type of product. You can't do that at PCB. I can buy 5 different levels of quality and performance at B&H not just one. There are very few things in life you buy direct and that's for a reason.

If you believe your product is superior to the next guy or has better value then charge for it.



Jan 20, 2014 at 12:05 AM





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