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Archive 2013 · What is so special about Canon White?

  
 
photomedic4321
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · What is so special about Canon White?


Comig over to the Canon camp from the dark side, I had plenty of good lenses over there buut no I think the longest thing I have is the 70-200? Why is Canon Long lenses sooooo much more the Nikons. Help?



Dec 31, 2013 at 01:48 AM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · What is so special about Canon White?


if your talking about the 'big whites' (ie the fast lenses from 300 to 800) then most of them are newer than the nikon equivalent .
canons prices used to be slightly under the nikon versions (probably cos the nikons were newer ) i think , but when the mk2 canons came out it was a real shock when people saw the price increases .

but the lenses are soo dam good , they are probably the very best you will get in any of those focal lengths so they can command the price .

its not all the canon whites that are more expensive than the nikon version though . the nikon 800/5.6 is newer than the canon 800 and is quite a bit more than the canon .



Dec 31, 2013 at 02:09 AM
oiseau0001
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · What is so special about Canon White?


When you say "sooooo much more the Nikons" are you referring to the quantity of long glass on the Canon side, or are you referring to the cost? Looking at current, higher end models, I see:

Nikon:

800 f/5.6 - $17889
600 f/5 - $10299
500 f/4 - $8579
80-400 f/4.5-5.6 VR - $2699
80-400 f/4.5 5.6 - $1849
200-400 f/4 - $6999
400 f/2.8 - $9549
300 f/2.8 - $5899

Canon:

200-400 f/4 - $11799
400 f/2.8 - $11499
400 f/4 DO - $6499
600 f/4 - $12999
500 f/4 - $10499
800 f/5.6 - $13999
300 f/2.8 - $7299
100-400 f/4.5-5.6 - $1699


Fairly comparable prices save for the 800s... I'm omitting tons of white glass on the Canon side.




Dec 31, 2013 at 02:11 AM
ggreene
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · What is so special about Canon White?


You will not get a lot of sympathy because your 400/2.8 is $11499 instead of $9500.


Dec 31, 2013 at 08:42 AM
brian_sp
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · What is so special about Canon White?


oiseau0001 wrote:
When you say "sooooo much more the Nikons" are you referring to the quantity of long glass on the Canon side, or are you referring to the cost? Looking at current, higher end models, I see:

Nikon:

800 f/5.6 - $17889
600 f/5 - $10299
500 f/4 - $8579
80-400 f/4.5-5.6 VR - $2699
80-400 f/4.5 5.6 - $1849
200-400 f/4 - $6999
400 f/2.8 - $9549
300 f/2.8 - $5899

Canon:

200-400 f/4 - $11799
400 f/2.8 - $11499
400 f/4 DO - $6499
600 f/4 - $12999
500 f/4 - $10499
800 f/5.6 - $13999
300 f/2.8 - $7299
100-400 f/4.5-5.6 - $1699

Fairly comparable prices save for the 800s... I'm omitting tons of white glass on
...Show more

Huh??
most of your canons on the list are $2000 more than the comparable nikon, that's your idea of fairly comparable?



Dec 31, 2013 at 09:10 AM
Ian.Dobinson
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · What is so special about Canon White?


brian_sp wrote:
Huh??
most of your canons on the list are $2000 more than the comparable nikon, that's your idea of fairly comparable?


but most are of newer vintage . so its not totally fair to say its a direct comparison price wise . if nikon brought a new version of any of those then you would see a much closer price (the nikon may squeeze above )

like i said before , before canon released the 300-400-500&600 L mk2's the comparable nikon lens was priced a little higher . but most of those were of a later vintage than the canon ver 1 lenses



Dec 31, 2013 at 09:35 AM
photomedic4321
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · What is so special about Canon White?


Okay, since I do agree with Brian that 2000.00 is quite a bit of difference in cost between lenses (and we won't even talk about the 200-400), what is the difference between the Mark i and Mark II lenses that would cause such an amazing increase.

Also, a question for Ian. What do you mean the lenses are so dam good. What is better about them over the Nikon equivalent? Really not trying to start a flame war, I just right now have split system with a lot of replication and I am trying to figure out which way I am going to go. I really like some aspects of both and I really have some good glass on both sides but have really been finding lately that I miss having my long glass and the only way to get that back would be to commit to one side or the other.

Thanks for all the help gang.



Dec 31, 2013 at 11:53 AM
jcolwell
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · What is so special about Canon White?


The Mk II super-teles at 400mm, 500mm, and 600mm have significantly reduced weight, see the attached table, hacked from Lensd$db.

The Mk II super-teles also have more capable onboard computers, with optimized interaction with newer Canon cameras (e.g. 1DX and 5DIII), and with Mk III Extenders. The IQ is reputed to also be improved, but my EF 500/4L IS (Mk I) is so darned sharp that it would have to be a small change.

As far as relative prices go, don't let it bother you. If you think they're too expensive, don't buy them.






Edited on Dec 31, 2013 at 12:20 PM · View previous versions



Dec 31, 2013 at 12:16 PM
surf monkey
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · What is so special about Canon White?


I believe the new Canons incorporate titanium in their construction making them quite a bit lighter than the old version or Nikon equivalents.
They also include a second Fluorite element which is probably the most expensive material used on these types of lenses, which accounts for the improved image quality, especially with extenders.



Dec 31, 2013 at 12:18 PM
surf monkey
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · What is so special about Canon White?


If you want equivalent superteles to the Nikons, you can just buy the older versions for a lot less money.


Dec 31, 2013 at 12:21 PM
AGeoJO
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · What is so special about Canon White?


People can argue about the optical performance between the two. Is the Canon's better? I would say yes, but only very slightly. The current Nikon superteles are comparable to the Canon Mark I lenses, it seems. The Canon Mark I superteles are already excellent optically and it would be hard to improve on them. The big difference is in the handling. The Canon supertele Mk II lenses are quite a bit lighter, and easier to handle compared to those on the Nikon side. Somehow, it looks like Nikon mounted the tripod collar in reverse relative to the Canon way. Take a look at the 600mm from both and compare them. And the Nikon's way doesn't provide a nice balance when mounted on a gimbal head. I heard this directly from a few Nikon shooters. They are not too happy with the two-step lens hood either.


Dec 31, 2013 at 12:26 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · What is so special about Canon White?


AGeoJO wrote:
...They are not too happy with the two-step lens hood either.


I had double hoods on my Mamiya 645 A 200/2.8 APO (still have) and A 300/2.8 APO lenses. I agree that it's not a good soultion. OTOH, my Nikkor ED 500/4 P had a single, big hood, much like the Canon 500/4L IS that I now have.

My Canon EF 200/1.8L has a 'reversed' tripod mount, and it kind of sucks for balance. Of course, there isn't a lot of real estate on that particular lens for a 'normal' tripod mount.



Dec 31, 2013 at 12:32 PM
docsmiles17
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · What is so special about Canon White?


fmphoto wrote:
Comig over to the Canon camp from the dark side, I had plenty of good lenses over there buut no I think the longest thing I have is the 70-200? Why is Canon Long lenses sooooo much more the Nikons. Help?


Sounds like an invitation for Nikon and Canon corporate reps to come and debate.

Any takers?



Dec 31, 2013 at 01:27 PM
surf monkey
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · What is so special about Canon White?


Another thing to consider is the original MSRP.
The Canon 500 IS vI was 980,00 yen at release.
The Canon 500 IS vII was 1,080,000 yen at release.



Dec 31, 2013 at 02:06 PM
ggreene
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · What is so special about Canon White?


surf monkey wrote:
Another thing to consider is the original MSRP.
The Canon 500 IS vI was 980,00 yen at release.
The Canon 500 IS vII was 1,080,000 yen at release.


Wiki says the original 500 IS was released in 1999 at $5500. Doing a quick US inflation adjustment that puts it at $7700 for 2013. Man, that yen/dollar ratio is a killer.



Dec 31, 2013 at 04:27 PM
sirimiri
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · What is so special about Canon White?


We do recall in 2011 when the Canon 800mm went from $10,900 to $12,300 overnight, and then reached the high $13k range a mere 14 months later.

A nearly 25% price hike in less than 440 days! That made Canon U.S.A. look righteously strange.

If the March 2011 9.0 earthquake affected Canon's fluorite element costs, what about the Canadian prices?




Dec 31, 2013 at 05:12 PM
arbitrage
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · What is so special about Canon White?


If you want to buy less expensive Canon white glass then just contact this Canadian retailer. They have sold to lots of FM members including Fred himself. They can give you accurate estimates for duties and shipping. You will save a mint on the super-telephotos.

www.cameracanada.com

Current prices in CDN$:
300 II 6,598
400 II 10,299
500 II 8,599
600 II 10,899
800 10.989

The reason the Canon prices are higher is that they were released during a time when the the YEN had increased in value substantially over the USD. Nikon showed with the newer 800 VR that if they are to release new lenses then they will most likely equal or exceed the current Canon Mark II prices. This is not price gouging, this is simple economics. There are lots of "value" buys in used Canon Mark I IS lenses and in new or used Nikon VR lenses however, if you want the best (Canon mark IIs and Nikon 800VR) then you have to pay to play. But you can save by buying in Canada.



Dec 31, 2013 at 07:45 PM
surf monkey
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · What is so special about Canon White?


surf monkey wrote:
Another thing to consider is the original MSRP.
The Canon 500 IS vI was 980,00 yen at release.
The Canon 500 IS vII was 1,080,000 yen at release.

ggreene wrote:
Wiki says the original 500 IS was released in 1999 at $5500. Doing a quick US inflation adjustment that puts it at $7700 for 2013. Man, that yen/dollar ratio is a killer.

I pulled my numbers directly from the Canon Museum website.
If you haven't seen it before, this is a great resource for all this stuff: http://www.canon.com/camera-museum/
And here: http://www.canon.com/camera-museum/camera/lens/ef/super_telephoto.html

And yes, the US dollar used to buy a lot more than it does today.



Dec 31, 2013 at 10:34 PM
dolina
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · What is so special about Canon White?


Lens design age, weight, dimension, materials used and features dictate pricing.


Dec 31, 2013 at 11:39 PM
photomedic4321
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · What is so special about Canon White?


How would buying in Canada effect the warranty? Would I be able to have it serviced in the US?


Jan 01, 2014 at 12:46 AM
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