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Gitzo Tripod failed again!
  
 
unclemikey
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p.6 #1 · p.6 #1 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!




sjms wrote:
the biggest issue with composites are the adhesives used and temperature. metal can take a lot more "abuse" in building. temperatures, types of adhesives, interference fitting, riveting and such.


No doubt about what you are indicating. However, I'll put up with whatever for the weight difference when lugging one around.



Dec 29, 2013 at 09:55 PM
sjms
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p.6 #2 · p.6 #2 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


DGC1 wrote:
Mine is an old 1410 if memory serves that I bought 11 years ago and has never given me a problem.


a g1410 was/is a solid performer

Specifications of Gitzo Series 4 Aluminum Systematic Tripod - 3 Section G1410:

attachment: 3/8'' screw attachment type
bubble spirit level (no.): 1 number
center column: no center column
closed length: 29.92 in
leg angles: 24. 55
leg sections: 3 number
load capacity: 35.27 lbs
material: aluminum
maximum height: 64.57 in
minimum height: 7.48 in
series: 4
weight: 8.38 lbs

with those specs for its time it was quite the beast.








Edited on Dec 31, 2013 at 03:28 PM · View previous versions



Dec 29, 2013 at 09:59 PM
sjms
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p.6 #3 · p.6 #3 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


unclemikey wrote:
No doubt about what you are indicating. However, I'll put up with whatever for the weight difference when lugging one around.


as most of us would. no need to bother in a studio environment.



Dec 29, 2013 at 11:15 PM
unclemikey
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p.6 #4 · p.6 #4 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!




sjms wrote:
a g1410 was/is a solid performer


Was this leg set CF or aluminum?



Dec 30, 2013 at 12:37 AM
DGC1
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p.6 #5 · p.6 #5 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


Aluminum.


Dec 30, 2013 at 12:46 AM
unclemikey
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p.6 #6 · p.6 #6 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!




sjms wrote:
as most of us would. no need to bother in a studio environment.


Quite. I have my Manfrotto and my Linhoff on casters. The Linhoff is as old as I am. Probably weighs about 100 lbs or more. I bought it from NYU when I graduated in 64. The school of photography sold off all equipment over 10 years old. I paid the school $25 for it.



Dec 30, 2013 at 02:07 AM
sjms
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p.6 #7 · p.6 #7 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


gee, I went there in '84. that was round 2 though.


Dec 30, 2013 at 02:10 AM
CPWarner
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p.6 #8 · p.6 #8 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


15Bit wrote:
For what it is worth, it doesn't look like corrosion to me. The white dust looks more like a paint layer between the outer coating and metal. The flaking-off of the paint layer would be expected with the deformation of the underlying metal substrate. Also the crack propagation looks like a brittle fracture through the metal, not a failure due to corrosion eating away the metal. The edges on the crack don't look fresh, so it may have been around a while before the failure was noticed. I would need to stick it in my (work) electron microscope for a
...Show more

Magnesium Oxide is white ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnesium_oxide ). I have worked on the corrosion of magnesium alloys for a long time and that is what corrosion of magnesium alloys looks like, particularly under paint. I have seen that many times. You are right in that an elemental scan in the SEM would confirm that rather than making it opinions. As to the fracture, I agree that it would require microscope evaluation to determine if it is brittle or ductile fracture, or fatigue fracture. It is nearly impossible with the image shown to determine the nature of the crack. Most magnesium alloys have fairly limited ductility due to their crystal structure. So, I am not sure how much ductility one could expect to see.

I was wondering if corrosion between the carbon fiber tube and magnesium lug placed the magnesium under a enough stress that it cracked it. I have seen that happen in other industrial corrosion situations. If you get a crevice attack, the expansion of the material from the metallic state to oxide can generate a surprising level of stress.

-Cliff



Jan 02, 2014 at 10:22 PM
sjms
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p.6 #9 · p.6 #9 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


I deal with many different types of corrosion daily too. but that is just an exercise in over analysis. it showed signs of substantial corrosion under the paint. a tripod is a device that is subjected to multi axis loading and is usually top loaded by the weight of what is carrying, handling and environment. the area was weakened and mechanically worked. in the end it failed.


Jan 02, 2014 at 10:40 PM
John Skinner
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p.6 #10 · p.6 #10 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


I have had this happen with TWO of Gitzo models.

The first was a CF just over 5 years old and the joint that tightens just gave way under load. I thought...' just a fluke '. So I bought into them again.

3 years, 5 months in, the same breakage as shown by the Op. Of course not being a paper-hoarder, 3 years is a long time to keep paperwork. I took the loss without being able to prove purchase date and left them FOR GOOD.

Yes it's a PITA to lug a 055 series Manfrotto around.... But it's notgoing to same route as those others, I can guarantee that. I've thrown everything you should never throw at 3 legs and it's like the day I bought it..

Gitzo = Tiffany's, you're just paying for a name.



Jan 11, 2014 at 10:38 PM
 

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Mike Letour
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p.6 #11 · p.6 #11 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


I just can't understand why Gitzo doesn't use stainless excusively at the high price points. It would be a little heavier, but not a lot, but the cost difference should not be great. Right?


Jan 15, 2014 at 12:22 AM
Focus Locus
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p.6 #12 · p.6 #12 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


Jeffrey wrote:
So, you're basing your decision on just one case?



Yup. Just one case. That's all it takes. "Cause I have just one $12K lens, just one $7K body, and most importantly, just one heart... that cannot endure an attack from watching those other ones tumble to the rocks and break into twos.

Speaking of ones into twos... on this thread alone, since post #1, post #'s 6, 15, 18, and 10 two posts above came along soon afterwards and reported several more incidents of failure on these high dollar, top of the line ($1K) Gitzo tripods. That's enough for me.

Many thanks to the OP for posting the images of how the leg socket cracked. That macro image offers at least one plausible reason why ENG broadcasters and cinema DP's don't use that style of stick construction to support their heavy rigs.



Jan 15, 2014 at 01:27 AM
sjms
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p.6 #13 · p.6 #13 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


Mike Letour wrote:
I just can't understand why Gitzo doesn't use stainless excusively at the high price points. It would be a little heavier, but not a lot, but the cost difference should not be great. Right?


They do make a stainless component tripod. Look at the ocean line. Then look at the price.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898082-REG/Gitzo_GT3542LOS_SERies_3_Carbon.html



Jan 15, 2014 at 01:58 AM
Mike Letour
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p.6 #14 · p.6 #14 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


It's almost insulting. If I drop $1K on a tripod, I would expect the materials to be the best (commonly) available.


Jan 15, 2014 at 06:07 AM
peter_n
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p.6 #15 · p.6 #15 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


Well as you can see the cost difference is considerable. The hardware is stainless on the Ocean line; there was one at the NY expo last fall and I asked the rep. I'm not so sure these tripods are selling that well, they seem to have reduced the number of models available. Also I don't believe they're impervious to salt, from memory the word Gitzo uses is salt "resistant". I think you're supposed to maintain them like a regular tripod so what's the point?

I think products like this are jewelry for people who think nothing of paying $2K+ for a flashy blue & gray tripod. Kind of like the digital Leica M bodies in concept. I have a Benro travel tripod that's been in the sea quite a bit and I use Salt-Away on it. I don't know if it's the Salt-Away or not but so far it's been fine. So far...



Jan 15, 2014 at 04:22 PM
sjms
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p.6 #16 · p.6 #16 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


nothing is "proof" over time. nature wins no matter what. so they are getting a little more careful with their wording. I would go out on a limb and say its (SS alloy which is undetermined) material salt resistance is considerably longer then current Mg alloy (which reqs paint as a first level of deterent) an use on their regular models even w/o scheduled maintenance program/practice in place by a fair margin.


Jan 15, 2014 at 04:31 PM
SHVv
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p.6 #17 · p.6 #17 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


sjms wrote:
They do make a stainless component tripod. Look at the ocean line. Then look at the price.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898082-REG/Gitzo_GT3542LOS_SERies_3_Carbon.html


"This Ocean tripod is designed for use in the most destructive conditions for tripods--salt water, dust, mud, sand. Made with 6x carbon fiber legs, all of the fittings are constructed from "precision-tooled aluminum" with a corrosion-resistant finish. "

I also thought it had SS fittings, not "precision-tooled aluminum".

Steve



Jan 15, 2014 at 09:37 PM
gopans
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p.6 #18 · p.6 #18 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


It's a common problem with Gitzo Tripods, i bet anyone wanting to buy Gitzo tripods would have to think twice.


Jan 15, 2014 at 11:21 PM
sjms
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p.6 #19 · p.6 #19 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


SHVv wrote:
"This Ocean tripod is designed for use in the most destructive conditions for tripods--salt water, dust, mud, sand. Made with 6x carbon fiber legs, all of the fittings are constructed from "precision-tooled aluminum" with a corrosion-resistant finish. "

I also thought it had SS fittings, not "precision-tooled aluminum".

Steve


True but anodized aluminum alloy still does a heck of a lot better then Mg alloy anything. The issues with these tripods has essentially been isolated to Mg alloy components



Jan 16, 2014 at 12:46 AM
SHVv
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p.6 #20 · p.6 #20 · Gitzo Tripod failed again!


"True but anodized aluminum alloy still does a heck of a lot better then Mg alloy anything."
******
Don't think Gitzo "precision-tooled" aluminum is worth 2x my RRS CNC machined aluminum. javascript:void(0);

Steve



Jan 16, 2014 at 02:31 AM
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