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Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access
  
 
roboticspro
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Good Afternoon!,

Although this post is primarily for Tim (Timballic), I've had a few inquiries about getting into this lens to make adjustments for infinity and re-lube of the helical. The following images should be pretty clear with regards to the steps needed to get the ID plate off, down to the infinity stop adjustment. If you need actual access to the helical, remove the stop, and unscrew the front lens-group; pretty easy...

Happy Sunday,

Edd





























Nov 10, 2013 at 06:09 PM
roboticspro
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


And...



























Nov 10, 2013 at 06:10 PM
roboticspro
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


And finally...



























Nov 10, 2013 at 06:12 PM
timballic
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Thanks Edd, I'll open mine shortly.
If anyone wants to know why I need to get inside, it's because the filter thread rotates with the focus ring and the original focus-helicoid grease used by Canon is too thin, so that whenever I change a grad ND filter position I often turn the focus ring too. I'm intending replacing the grease with something about a couple of grades heavier/thicker.



Nov 11, 2013 at 04:14 PM
timballic
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


OK I'm in, it doesn't seem that you can disengage the helicoid all the way, at least from the front. Do you need to release the four screws in the rear housing for that, or is it best to leave them and just regrease the threads that are exposed?

Front, helicoid revealed. This is as far as it would unscrew, even with the limiter removed.

Rear, with mount removed.

Edited on Nov 11, 2013 at 06:55 PM · View previous versions



Nov 11, 2013 at 05:30 PM
timballic
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


I removed the four screws, but that just removes the tilt shift mount, revealing the rear of the aperture ring assembly. I'll leave it there as it looks more complicated to get out the whole helicoid mechanism and I don't want to have any re-alignment to do.

I removed the oil from the surface before replacing the tilt shift "shroud".



Nov 11, 2013 at 06:54 PM
timballic
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Rear re-assembled and back to the front.

Edd, your: "If you need actual access to the helical, remove the stop, and unscrew the front lens-group; pretty easy..."
Isn't proving to be so easy after all!

Do I need to remove the inner retaining ring with the two little holes, with a special tool? (at nearly 9 o'clock and 3 o'clock)




Nov 11, 2013 at 07:18 PM
roboticspro
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Hi Tim,

I didn't have to remove that retainer on mine, after the focus stop was removed, the entire front section unscrewed. Mine may have been missing an internal stop cam/screw, or this marks a third variation on this lens (shift mechanism differs between the orange & green lettered versions). Sorry about the confusion, as this is a surprise for me also. If you can't get them apart, I would add the layer of higher viscosity grease in small layers, where you can get at the exposed helical, and work it in from there...

Edd



Nov 11, 2013 at 11:34 PM
timballic
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


I tried removing the aperture connection pin, (it has a slot in the end), as it appeared to act as a pretty effective stop to the front screwing out all the way, when it comes to the closed inner end of the guides. However it made no difference when removed. Seen here on front left of rear lens assembly. (Tilt/shift mechanism removed.)



With free oil removed.
You can see slotted end of aperture link here, which enable it to be screwed out.

There are four large slot headed screws down the two holes visible on each side of the lens. I have no idea what they do. Without foreknowledge I don't want to disturb them.


Of course I could get another, earlier version of the lens (orange lettering) and do the re-lube on that, as the helicoid apparently screws straight out, once the side stop is removed.

Edd, have you found any/much variation between versions? Mine is a late version. ( Green lettering, Ser. No. 21823, and rear original mount date code for March 1990)



Nov 12, 2013 at 08:46 AM
roboticspro
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Tim,

I have the green lettered version, same as you currently own. I sold my original "orange" version a few years ago, which I purchased back in the 70's. From what you have shown, there is no way that the helical could be removed completely with that version. The eight that I have converted from FD to EOS (with my original milling re-do, and later with the superb EdMika brass kit), needed only the adjustment of the infinity stop. I am pretty sure that one of them had debris lodged into the helical, and I did manage to remove the lens group, flush it with naphtha, and re-lube the assembly. I do not remember whether it was green or orange detailed. In any case, I am sorry if this has caused you grief, seriously, as I hoped it would help, not for you to waste your time, and I apologize for that . At this point I could only suggest that you pack your grease of choice into the area of the helical that you do have access to, and work it into the threads manually.

Regards,

Edd



Nov 12, 2013 at 10:02 PM
 

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timballic
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Thanks again Edd, no grief, I'd already decided to go in and your pics helped, I'd never have worked out the name ring being glued, I've only known screw in ones!
I'm going to do as you suggest and work in thicker grease from the area of the helicoid I do have access to.



Nov 13, 2013 at 07:29 AM
roboticspro
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Tim,

Good to hear that...I use flux-paste brushes for getting high-vis grease in confined areas. Be careful with any of them not to get a loose bristle/hair into the works; not fun trying to get them back out...

Regards,

Edd



Nov 14, 2013 at 09:44 AM
timballic
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Here's the link to one of my first (and most extreme) shots with the lens. Early 9th Century (pre-Viking) High Cross at Irton, Cumbria, UK. The cross is nearly 10' (3m) tall and this is from about 6" from the base, (couldn't get any lower without digging a hole in the graveyard!)
I'd gone on a flat (very windy) dull day, to play with my new lens.

Sadly I fluffed critical focus in the centre region, between the two carved panels, as the lens was so close to the cross, it needed more than the 8 full tilt for the plane of focus to be parallel to the cross from top to bottom.

As the burst of sunshine was so sudden and brief, I must have changed something in my excitement. User error, not the lenses fault as the shots in the dull were sharp top to bottom.

(The cross is slightly non-symmetrical, with a twist from top to bottom, which had me stumped for ages as I tried to get the framing perfect.)

http://www.flickr.com/photos/27297062@N02/10838140764/


Irton Cross, early 9th C by timballic, on Flickr



Nov 15, 2013 at 10:17 AM
roboticspro
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Tim,

As most would say, especially me, we can appreciate images that are posted here for what they are and represent, in spite of our original intents...

Cutting to the chase: Nice Shot!

Edd



Nov 16, 2013 at 05:43 PM
timballic
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Thanks Edd.


Nov 16, 2013 at 05:47 PM
timballic
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


I've been searching out different greases from ebay to try and stiffen up the focus ring, most are NLGI #2 and pathetically soft, unless you pay huge amounts for a large tub of specialist NLGI #3 or #4 grease.

So far the stickiest/stiffest I've found is "High Tack Silicone grease" (used by plumbers), but I'm a bit wary of using silicon near to glass.

Nothing else comes close, despite descriptions to the contrary (and I tried Cal's reel grease too)



Nov 26, 2013 at 02:24 PM
timballic
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


After a bit more reading up, I went ahead with the High Tack Silicon grease on the focus helicoid.

All done and put together again and the focus feels a lot better (stiffer) now. I have also glued a tall "D" section rubber ring around the aperture ring to help identify it by feel. I so often turned the focus ring by mistake when meaning to change F stop.



Nov 28, 2013 at 08:21 PM
roboticspro
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Tim,

Sounds like you worked out all the issues...good job!

Regards,

Edd



Nov 28, 2013 at 11:19 PM
timballic
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


Not sure which thread to add this to!

I am now in possession of 2 near-mint copies of the FD 35 TS, to compare and keep the best.

I obtained the second (slightly older) copy after not finding the first to be quite as sharp as I'd expected it to be. (This may of course be the result of using the EF adapter rather than the original FD breech lock mount...hopefully I don't need to also buy another EdMika adapter to see if they vary!)

What surprises me is that although they are both late "green lettering versions" with only 17 months between them, both manufactured in the Utsunomiya factory, the coatings are different.

To the eye the difference is very marked, the older has more blue, magenta and purple, and the newer more green and red, perhaps the rear of the lens shows the difference best.

Date info from here: http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80910
The codes are found on the rear of the breech lock mount, (if it hasn't worn off), both these were pristine

Lens Ser. No. 20*** Date code UC11** (Nov 1988)
Both pictures were taken one after the other in identical lighting. The inner "glow" from this one is predominantly purple. The lower lens has a green "glow". You can see the glow in the front shots above the sharp repeating light images. NB. I used 2 daylight temp. bulbs and these colours are close to what I was seeing.

Lens Ser. No. 21*** Date Code UE03** (Mar 1990)
You can see the Rubber ring/tyre I added to the Aperture ring here, to make it easy to change aperture without touching the focus whilst looking at the image on the screen. If I find the other lens to be the better performer, I'll swap the rings over.

NB. Be warned if you are dismantling one of these: The aperture click-stop ball-bearing is strongly spring loaded and shot over 3 feet when I dismantled the first time, it's so tiny, the only way I found it was with a strong ring magnet, where I'd already searched by eye without detecting it




Feb 04, 2014 at 04:44 PM
timballic
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Canon FD 35mm Tilt-Shift Internals Access


From several test series comparing the two lenses I can see that they are set up differently, neither could be said to be a poor copy.

At F2.8 the older copy is clearer, sharper more contrasty than the later, but by F5.6 - 11 the newer takes over as slightly sharper and clearer, then at F16 - 22 the older takes over again! (This seems to be across the frame, but I'll do more tests to verify that.)

(NB. From F3.5 - 16, and at 35mm, my Contax Vario-Sonnar 35 - 70mm, still lives up to its reputation by slightly bettering them both, in resolution and clarity/contrast!)

If the results were shown in graph form the sharpness of the older would be an almost flat graph, just falling off to diffraction from 16. The newer would be a dome shaped curve that rises above the line of the older between 5.6 - 11, but below at each end.

Whether this is a definite decision by Canon to set up the later lens differently, or just individual copy variation is impossible to say. (Perhaps when I've sold one, I'll look out for another, for another comparison?)

However, as I generally shoot landscapes at F11 - 16, (because of needing to focus lots of different heights), and prefer the clearer focussing at F2.8 of the older, I think I'll sell the newer and keep the older.



Feb 06, 2014 at 11:00 AM
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