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Archive 2013 · Feedback for Quote
  
 
edgately
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Feedback for Quote


I was recently contacted by a very large local university to use 2 of my images for a lobby wall display collage. 1 image will be printed 118"x37" and the other image 43"x74". It is a one time print usage license. I have used Cradoc fotoQuote to determine a target amount for the quote by selecting from the Prints.Wall Decor.Client/Public areas category. I then put a 40% discount on the quoted price to reflect local pricing for our non NYC/LA market.

The feedback I received from the client was that my quote was extremely high and have returned with a counter offer. Any other photogs on the forum have some useful feedback for me regarding the pricing of this usage? Feel free to reply here or PM me.

This is my first time quoting for this type of usage. All feedback is appreciated.



Oct 23, 2013 at 03:15 PM
leethecam
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Feedback for Quote


It would be useful to know what your discounted quote was and what their counter offer was.


Oct 23, 2013 at 03:25 PM
edgately
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Feedback for Quote


Using the designated fotoQuote usage category it had a maximum print size of 30x40... so I used the price graduations based on sq ft of print area and came up with $2425 and $2210 for usage. Discounted total with tax was $2968. Counter was $200 per image.

Is it possible the the fotoQuote was an actual print price and not usage? I was unable to find any further details on the category.



Oct 23, 2013 at 04:01 PM
tcphoto
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Feedback for Quote


I think that your calculation for such large prints is good and you adjusted your price based on your location. I think that the ball is in their court and they need to decide whether the images are that important to them. I would hold my ground and wait. BTW, did you limit the display time in your quote two-three years?


Oct 23, 2013 at 04:56 PM
leethecam
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Feedback for Quote


Their offer seems low - particularly if they are a large establishment.

As the size gets bigger I'd assume the rate of price increase would slope off (so double size would not be double cost) so have you allowed for this?

If your images have a unique quality then you have much more bargaining power, but I think at $200 per image they are undervaluing your work.

Of course it also depends on how long they are using for and the style they are displaying with would indicate their expectations better. If they are displaying in expensive frames then it would be silly to pay less for the actual art itself.



Oct 24, 2013 at 01:21 PM
Ho1972
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Feedback for Quote


Run away.


Oct 25, 2013 at 08:34 AM
edgately
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Feedback for Quote


Thank you for all the feedback. Just wanted to clarify that I will not be responsible for the physical printing of either image. This was one item I could not determine from the quoting program... is it specifying the product or the usage in the quote.


Oct 25, 2013 at 06:15 PM
Michael White
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Feedback for Quote


I would sent an invoice to them showing the full price as per fotoQuote and the amount of discount and your final price and the conditions for use. In this case to allow them torint and display two of your images for a designated time period at a designated location.

If they see that you already gave them a discount they might change their mind we shown the value of such work. Also note on invoice that this discount is limited to this transaction if completed within 30/60/90 days. So they don't come back later and you have to find it again and go through the lei ing procedure again. Or come back for more images several years down the road wanting the same deal,



Oct 26, 2013 at 03:23 AM
Michael White
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Feedback for Quote


I would sent an invoice to them showing the full price as per fotoQuote and the amount of discount and your final price and the conditions for use. In this case to allow them torint and display two of your images for a designated time period at a designated location.

If they see that you already gave them a discount they might change their mind we shown the value of such work. Also note on invoice that this discount is limited to this transaction if completed within 30/60/90 days. So they don't come back later and you have to find it again and go through the lei ing procedure again. Or come back for more images several years down the road wanting the same deal,



Oct 26, 2013 at 03:23 AM
Michael White
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Feedback for Quote


I would sent an invoice to them showing the full price as per fotoQuote and the amount of discount and your final price and the conditions for use. In this case to allow them torint and display two of your images for a designated time period at a designated location.

If they see that you already gave them a discount they might change their mind we shown the value of such work. Also note on invoice that this discount is limited to this transaction if completed within 30/60/90 days. So they don't come back later and you have to find it again and go through the lei ing procedure again. Or come back for more images several years down the road wanting the same deal,



Oct 26, 2013 at 03:23 AM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



lukeb
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Feedback for Quote


Ho1972 wrote:
Run away.


The purchasing agent is trying to low ball you.

Agree on sending them a written quote showing the discount. And also ALL the other terms of use.

Either they come back with a counter-offer or don't come back at all.



Oct 26, 2013 at 03:49 AM
edgately
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Feedback for Quote


Thanks Michael.

You may be aware of this... fotoQuote allows for the use of a discounted amount to be added. The quote I sent showed this discount and I explained this fully prior to receiving their counter.

There is no option for a time limit for display on this project. It is a perm architectural installation. The 2 images are part of multi piece collage.



Oct 26, 2013 at 04:15 AM
Micky Bill
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Feedback for Quote


Seems like there is 10x difference in what you want to charge and what they think it's worth. That will take some conversation to get an idea where they got their $200 from and where you got $2400.
I think the term "usage" may have spooked them.They probably have a budget for art display and wouldn;t think twice about paying a sculptor or watercolorist a reasonable amount to purchase a item. Just sell them the print and let them know there are limitations on the use of the image. Leave licensing to other clients.



Oct 26, 2013 at 10:46 PM
edgately
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Feedback for Quote


They were not scared by usage and none of this scared them. They are a client who is used to paying $10-60 for stock photography and print it on a wall. Looking at several sites the image rights would allow for their usage. Additionally they are paying nothing for the other 6 images in the installation because the university already has an extensive stock library from which they work from. They are starting to stress the use of local artists and wanted to reach out to me for my image usage.

I still feel the fotoQuote program is quoting a completed Print itself and NOT the usage for them to create a print. They linked me to a photographer they work regularly with who sells completed prints at roughly the same price I quoted for usage.

Once again thank you all for your feedback and thoughts.



Oct 27, 2013 at 01:19 AM
FLSTCSAM
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Feedback for Quote


Ed,

To me this is a fine art sale. It has nothing to do with usage or licensing.

I would not let the client have the file and print the image. Printing is a discipline in it's own right.

Should you let the client have the printing done and it doesn't turn out the way they think it should you could easily find yourself in the middle of the blame game. Printer says it's the file, you say it's the printer and the client is getting more and more unhappy. You should control the quality of the image. Your name is on it.

Personally I would quote them a price that I am happy with and consistent with other fine art print sales I have made. The price would be for a completed print ready to hang. Done deal.

Other thoughts running through my feeble gray matter: I visited you site and you have some wonderful images.

If they are used to buying images for $50.00 any reasonable quote for these large images will seem outrageously high to them. If the sale is totally dependent on price you will have no chance on making a sale. If you can make it about quality, service and the uniqueness of your image you will have separated yourself from competing against Ikea, or Wallmart.

Providing a discount to a client because they don't want to pay the standard price for a product, or they are a small company doesn't really make sense. If you go into Tiffany's do you think they will approach you and say " you poor thing I can see our prices are much higher than you are used to, so we will give you a big discount"?

Good luck,

Sam




Oct 28, 2013 at 04:09 PM
Michael White
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Feedback for Quote


Ed the time limit is put in you lie inching agreement that you write up. PhotoByte has a really good lie ing builder as I recall. It is take this sentence add that one also scrap this one the you can tweak it if needed after you builde the agreement . It's a free download you request the DL leave your email and links will be sent to the email you gave them. It is the program that handle the business side if photography for mot studio, commercial and fine art studio. Iif used properly it will walk you through generation all the paperwork for the studio on each job even if one is portrait the next is fine art and the next is commercial. It has all your releases that can be custonmized for the shoot, it generates the checklist so you know you covered all the bases from packing the equipment the agreement for the second shooter either as a sub or in house all the model contracts all the data from the client ect ect I've never at least to the point in time learned to use everything it can do.


Oct 29, 2013 at 09:05 AM
RustyBug
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Feedback for Quote


FLSTCSAM wrote:
To me this is a fine art sale.

Late to the party ...

I saw a photograph for sale at the museum this weekend. Asking price was $2,400 iirc. In another part of the museum grounds was the annual photography competition. Suffice to say that the photo competition produced an array of superior images (imo) from local photographers to that of the one that was for sale (from a non-local photographer).

My only guess is that the photographer (whose name I didn't recognize) was considered to be "someone" in certain circles unknown to me. It certainly wasn't for the subject matter, nor the excellence of execution, knowledge of light, clarity of message, emotive invocation, nor any other attributes such as cost to produce that I could equate photographically to $$$ ... leaving it to be based on valuation associated to the person (sans any other rationale I could envision).

Value is a funny thing ... it is based on relative subjectivity. Navigating value isn't always a straightforward objective thing, even though there may be some objective components involved. "What the market will bear" is the essence of what will construe an agreement between buyer and seller. In order for a transaction to occur, the agreement must occur. Where on the sliding scale of value are both parties willing to land ... anybody's guess on any given day, time & place.

What it takes to add/subtract negotiated value to a given transaction ... well, that's an art form unto itself, to wit:

Micky Bill wrote:
That will take some conversation to get an idea where they got their $200 from and where you got $2400.


GL, HTH





Oct 29, 2013 at 03:39 PM
Littleguy
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Feedback for Quote


A little confusion on my part - hope you can help clear up.

"...2 of my images for a lobby wall display collage. 1 image will be printed 118"x37" and the other image 43"x74". It is a one time print usage license. I have used Cradoc fotoQuote to determine a target amount for the quote by selecting from the Prints.Wall Decor.Client/Public areas category. I then put a 40% discount on the quoted price to reflect local pricing for our non NYC/LA market."

The print size 118"x37" and 43"x74" is for the whole collage or the size of your image in the collage? If its just the size of your images - that's a large collage!

Sounds like they just want photos to use in a bigger collage - so it doesn't sound like a fine art sale.

If they want your photos printed large as a stand alone print - sure - it should be priced as fine art. If they just want your photo mixed in with a bunch of other local artists in a collage - I can see why they don't want to pay fine art prices...



Oct 31, 2013 at 03:55 PM
Caleb Williams
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Feedback for Quote


They sound like they are low-balling you to me. A school, not a large college by an means (6,000) recently licensed my image for $200 for one-time alumni magazine use; it was a 4" x 5".

I realize this is different uses, but it just seems really low.



Nov 01, 2013 at 04:24 AM





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