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A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses
  
 
edwardkaraa
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


Indeed, Leica M cameras rely heavily on software corrections, but with lens profiles turned off, both the M9 and the M240 show some significant color cast with wide angles of 28mm and below. The M240 is actually worse than the M9 because it has no offset microlenses. So some minor red shift at the image long borders is quite reasonable and not a big issue. In my experience, the ZM 18 and 21 show similar color cast, but the ZM 25 shows almost none. I would expect my ZM lenses to work quite well on the 7r.


Oct 16, 2013 at 03:51 PM
snapsy
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


If the A7r has gapless micro lenses and the A7 doesn't that will mean the A7r will outperform the A7 in noise, at least at the image level. The 36MP Exmor in the D800 uses gapless lenses as well. I don't recall whether the D600 24MP Exmor does but I assume so since it has nearly identical noise performance vs the D800.


Oct 16, 2013 at 04:03 PM
douglasf13
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


edwardkaraa wrote:
Indeed, Leica M cameras rely heavily on software corrections, but with lens profiles turned off, both the M9 and the M240 show some significant color cast with wide angles of 28mm and below. The M240 is actually worse than the M9 because it has no offset microlenses. So some minor red shift at the image long borders is quite reasonable and not a big issue. In my experience, the ZM 18 and 21 show similar color cast, but the ZM 25 shows almost none. I would expect my ZM lenses to work quite well on the 7r.


The problem for me is that I usually wouldn't accept even minor red shift, and I'd have to fix it if there's a lot or a little, so it kind of doesn't matter, unless color shift is absent altogether.



Oct 16, 2013 at 04:04 PM
wfrank
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


Sculptormatic noted this link, no details but nevertheless promising


http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/sony_a7r_hands_on.shtml

quote:

For some photographers (myself included) putting Leica M mount lenses on the Sony A7R may be reason enough to break out a bottle of Veuve Cliquot champagne and celebrate. Using an M to E adapter (I have a Metabones), virtually every Leica M lenses that I own works well on the A7R. Some of the ultra-wide and very wides do vignette, so be aware of this. There is no software correction for this, because we're mixing and matching. With other systems where the lens and camera are from the same company there's a lot of magic that can be done in firmware.



Oct 16, 2013 at 04:06 PM
wfrank
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


I dont bother much about color/magenta cast, smearing is the uncorrectable issue.


Oct 16, 2013 at 04:08 PM
ISO1600
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


Color cast of any sort is unacceptable for me, I need files that can work without any editing. I don't spend thousands of dollars on gear to get files that require fixing. I'd like to think that is fairly easy to agree with.


Oct 16, 2013 at 04:17 PM
philber
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


CornerFix "cost" me about one minute per file, once I have decided that it is good enough to process, which, unfortunately is the case for only a small minority of the pics I take. It is a cost that doesn't seem too heavy for me, but others are free to feel otherwise.


Oct 16, 2013 at 04:38 PM
ulrikft2
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


philber wrote:
CornerFix "cost" me about one minute per file, once I have decided that it is good enough to process, which, unfortunately is the case for only a small minority of the pics I take. It is a cost that doesn't seem too heavy for me, but others are free to feel otherwise.


I agree, if I can use the CV 21/4 with moderate/heavy vignetting and some color cast, but with good resolution, this is a dream camera come true for me.

I'll most likely get this camera regardless. I suspect that my 35/1.2 will work well. Same goes for my contax-g 90/2.8. Those two lenses alone make for a great kit imo.



Oct 16, 2013 at 04:45 PM
philber
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


My guess is that my Contax G28 and/or Leica Elmar 24 will be fine, with or without CornerFix. And maybe even my ZM 18 with CornerFix, indicating performance worse than the 5N . That would be fantabulous!


Oct 16, 2013 at 04:51 PM
wfrank
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


philber wrote:
My guess is that my Contax G28 and/or Leica Elmar 24 will be fine, with or without CornerFix. And maybe even my ZM 18 with CornerFix, indicating performance worse than the 5N . That would be fantabulous!


Do I spot some hope here Philippe?



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:20 PM
 

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douglasf13
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


I expect just about all 28mm and wider M lenses, as well as many 35mm lenses, will have at least a little color shift.


Oct 16, 2013 at 05:22 PM
philber
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


Yes, indeed. 28mm is my favorite WA, and using my G 28 without CornerFix on FF would be a dream come true. And my Elmar 24 as well, although I use that FL a lot less.
What about you?



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:23 PM
serhan_
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


I am hopeful for my CV 12mm


Oct 16, 2013 at 05:24 PM
edwardkaraa
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses




douglasf13 wrote:
The problem for me is that I usually wouldn't accept even minor red shift, and I'd have to fix it if there's a lot or a little, so it kind of doesn't matter, unless color shift is absent altogether.


To be honest, I also feel the same, and that is why I sold the ZM 18. I know Cornerfix and the LR plug in are very easy to use but they need lens profiles at different apertures and distances, so they do require some prior work. The ZM 25 is currently my widest lens, and it rarely has any color issues, I would say less than 1% of the photos. However I heard it has more issues on the M240 unless a leica lens profile is selected for camera correction.

Therefore I do expect my lenses to work well on the 7r but of course I will wait to see real users experience before I commit.



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:26 PM
philber
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


douglasf13 wrote:
I expect just about all 28mm and wider M lenses, as well as many 35mm lenses, will have at least a little color shift.

I am more optimistic than you, Douglas. I expect all 35mm to be clean, maybe even all 28s, and quite a few wider lenses fine with CornerFix, down to the ZM 18.



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:26 PM
ISO1600
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


I don't use windows/mac, so LR and CornerFix isn't an option for me. I shoot jpg. I auto-backup to Google Photos on my Chromebook.
I realize I am in the minority here, but I prefer to get my shot "right" out of the camera, not spend time editing out ugly color casts.
I will most likely just use "big old SLR lenses" instead of tiny RF lenses for my wide angle purposes.... Still, here's to hoping that Voigtlander 35/1.4 will work beautifully on it



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:35 PM
carstenw
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


snapsy wrote:
If the A7r has gapless micro lenses and the A7 doesn't that will mean the A7r will outperform the A7 in noise, at least at the image level.


At the pixel level, not necessarily: the pixels are also smaller. It depends on which way the balance tips. At least The Camera Store's tests showed that the A7 had better noise performance.



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:37 PM
douglasf13
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


philber wrote:
I am more optimistic than you, Douglas. I expect all 35mm to be clean, maybe even all 28s, and quite a few wider lenses fine with CornerFix, down to the ZM 18.


Why? Even the ZM 35/2 and 35/2.8 have color shift on the NEX-5N, although it isn't extreme or anything, and we're talking about a much larger sensor. While I think the new micro lenses and lack of AA will help with smearing, I expect color shift to still be an issue. Leica still has major issues with color shift on the M9 and M240.



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:42 PM
snapsy
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


carstenw wrote:
At the pixel level, not necessarily: the pixels are also smaller. It depends on which way the balance tips. At least The Camera Store's tests showed that the A7 had better noise performance.


Pixel-level performance doesn't have much significance. I was speaking to noise at the image level.



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:44 PM
mcbroomf
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · A7/A7r - performance with WA RF lenses


Hmm .. somewhat unsettling

"My testing showed good results with M lenses starting at 35mm. Wider lenses are iffy. It very much depends on the lens' design.

Michael (Reichmann)"
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=83191.0



Oct 16, 2013 at 05:54 PM
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