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Archive 2013 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless
  
 
wkhc168
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p.77 #1 · p.77 #1 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


I have a first generation Metabones EF to E mount adaptor I got when they first came out. It worked with all my Canon lenses with the Nex7. Any ideas if it would work the the A7r? I only need aperture control and not AF.


lostinjapan wrote:
I just tested the camera with the 21mm Distagon, the 17mm TSE and the 135mm APO-Sonnar. The camera focused perfectly at infinity with all three lenses. The Metabones III seems quite well built and it works very well. The few quick test shots I took, processed in Iridient and examined in CS6 look very good. Later this afternoon I am going to go out and take some more more real shots. The ones I just took were out my back window. Nothing exciting, but I wanted to test the camera. Also I found it is definitely best to trigger the
...Show more



Nov 17, 2013 at 02:44 PM
serhan_
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p.77 #2 · p.77 #2 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


He just received them:

Sony A7 and A7r in the house..review in progress!

michaelwatkins wrote:
Speaking of demo units, I'm surprised Steve Huff hasn't got his mitts on a review unit since returning home.



Nov 17, 2013 at 07:08 PM
tsdevine
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p.77 #3 · p.77 #3 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless



No I'm pretty sure you need the version III. I think the first iteration is really built for the APS-C sensor in NEX cameras.

wkhc168 wrote:
I have a first generation Metabones EF to E mount adaptor I got when they first came out. It worked with all my Canon lenses with the Nex7. Any ideas if it would work the the A7r? I only need aperture control and not AF.



Nov 17, 2013 at 07:21 PM
frozenbc
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p.77 #4 · p.77 #4 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


As another Vancouverite, I'm also dying to hear what outlet you're dealing with. Vistek is also saying end of November for me as well (a7r).


Nov 17, 2013 at 07:59 PM
theophilus
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p.77 #5 · p.77 #5 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


I don't think the US is the dominant market for mirrorless cameras. I live in a major city and have never seen anyone shooting with any u4/3, or a NEX better than a C-3. A couple Nikon V1's. I know they are out there but its got to be 95% DSLR.

I'm bummed that I'll get my A7 the day I get back from Zion and Bryce Canyon. Last hurrah for the NEX-7.



Nov 17, 2013 at 10:54 PM
Tariq Gibran
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p.77 #6 · p.77 #6 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


_julian_ wrote:
I just tested the camera with the 21mm Distagon, the 17mm TSE and the 135mm APO-Sonnar. The camera focused perfectly at infinity with all three lenses. The Metabones III seems quite well built and it works very well. The few quick test shots I took, processed in Iridient and examined in CS6 look very good. Later this afternoon I am going to go out and take some more more real shots. The ones I just took were out my back window. Nothing exciting, but I wanted to test the camera. Also I found it is definitely best to trigger the
...Show more


I'd love to see what the Zeiss 135 APO looks like on the A7r body. I'm frightened it will completely dominate it.


I went out and shot today with the 17mm TSE and 35mm 1.4 Distagon ZE. Both worked very very well, I will put up a couple of shots later. Tomorrow after work I will take the 135 Sonnar out and take a few shots.

Ryan



Sounds Great!. Get a shot of the body with the lens mounted too if you get a chance (with a cell phone). I'm really hoping the ergonomics of the A7/r will be OK for the larger lenses.



It works pretty well, IF the you have the grip. Without the grip it is really unbalanced and hard to hold, at least for me. Though the 135mm handles much better attached to the 5d3, the A7 is a little small for it, imho.

Ryan


This sounds like the exact same issue folks have with those micro cell phones!
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-os4hIpUcfYQ/T0xyEviygHI/AAAAAAAACRs/HZgHRIFZQxw/s1600/phone.jpg



Nov 17, 2013 at 11:10 PM
Emacs
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p.77 #7 · p.77 #7 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera:


  1. They are too large. Larger than my Pentax k-m was. Sure, the depth is less with sony, but IMO it's width and height that really matter
  2. I hate fixed EVF. I got used to swivel EVF on my nex-5n, where it increases stability angled to 45-90 degree: having face behind the camera increases torque due to larger distance to a center of weight. Plus, I dont have nose issues . Immediately remembered my slr days: absolutely unneeded, unjustified limitation. Hard to shoot lower positions, which was often a breeze with tilted EVF - with fixed EVF they will always be unstable and thus provoking bad portraiture style, shooting from the top.
  3. Lack of touch screen. I extensively use it with 5n. Big minus, making awkward positions even more undesirable. Nasty.
  4. I dislike its design. It feels a bit awkward.
  5. EC wheel is too tight to the extent of not being usable. I also wonder about fixed correction values. Who really needs them to be fixed? In the digital age we have quite unforgiving sensors and thus should correct value based on histogram/zebra, so won't see them anyway.
  6. IMO they sacrificed usability for the retro look. Big minus.
  7. startup time. It is really too long
  8. Lag on a7r is too long

So, IMO these are not good cameras: too retro slrish with all respective limitations (which is silly at least). And the fact they work bad with leica lenses saves my money: there is nothing in them that worth their price for me.



Nov 18, 2013 at 12:29 AM
lostinjapan
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p.77 #8 · p.77 #8 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


The Metabones I will only partially work. It was designed for use with aps-c sized sensors. As a result you will get heavy vignetting,for sure and won't cover the entire frame. So sadly if you want to use it to its full potential you need to upgrade to the newest version, III. Version II won't work either.

Hope it helps.

Ryan



Nov 18, 2013 at 01:09 AM
RobCD
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p.77 #9 · p.77 #9 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Emacs wrote:
I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera:


  1. They are too large. Larger than my Pentax k-m was. Sure, the depth is less with sony, but IMO it's width and height that really matter
  2. I hate fixed EVF. I got used to swivel EVF on my nex-5n, where it increases stability angled to 45-90 degree: having face behind the camera increases torque due to larger distance to a center of weight. Plus, I dont have nose issues . Immediately remembered my slr days: absolutely unneeded, unjustified limitation. Hard to shoot lower positions, which was
  3. Lack of touch screen. I extensively use it with 5n. Big minus, making awkward positions even more undesirable. Nasty.
  4. I dislike its design. It feels a bit awkward.
  5. EC wheel is too tight to the extent of not being usable. I also wonder about fixed correction values. Who really needs them to be fixed? In the digital age we have quite unforgiving sensors and thus should correct value based on histogram/zebra, so won't see them anyway.
  6. IMO they sacrificed usability for the retro look. Big minus.
  7. startup time. It is really too long
  8. Lag on a7r is too long

So, IMO these are not good cameras: too retro slrish with all respective limitations (which is silly at least). And the fact they work bad with leica lenses saves my money: there is nothing in them that worth their price for me.
...Show more

It's really hard to please everyone so certainly some people will not like them. The good news is that so far from all of the many user reports, previews and reviews - you're the only one to say that it is a not a good camera. My guess is that your company in the not good camp will be limited but time will tell. (too large, swivel EVF and touch screen... seriously? ).



Nov 18, 2013 at 01:54 AM
naturephoto1
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p.77 #10 · p.77 #10 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Emacs wrote:
I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera:


  1. They are too large. Larger than my Pentax k-m was. Sure, the depth is less with sony, but IMO it's width and height that really matter
  2. I hate fixed EVF. I got used to swivel EVF on my nex-5n, where it increases stability angled to 45-90 degree: having face behind the camera increases torque due to larger distance to a center of weight. Plus, I dont have nose issues . Immediately remembered my slr days: absolutely unneeded, unjustified limitation. Hard to shoot lower positions, which was
  3. Lack of touch screen. I extensively use it with 5n. Big minus, making awkward positions even more undesirable. Nasty.
  4. I dislike its design. It feels a bit awkward.
  5. EC wheel is too tight to the extent of not being usable. I also wonder about fixed correction values. Who really needs them to be fixed? In the digital age we have quite unforgiving sensors and thus should correct value based on histogram/zebra, so won't see them anyway.
  6. IMO they sacrificed usability for the retro look. Big minus.
  7. startup time. It is really too long
  8. Lag on a7r is too long

So, IMO these are not good cameras: too retro slrish with all respective limitations (which is silly at least). And the fact they work bad with leica lenses saves my money: there is nothing in them that worth their price for me.
...Show more

If you don't like the camera, then don't buy it. That is all you have to do.

Rich



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:09 AM
 

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davewolfs
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p.77 #11 · p.77 #11 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless




Emacs wrote:
I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera:


  1. They are too large. Larger than my Pentax k-m was. Sure, the depth is less with sony, but IMO it's width and height that really matter
  2. I hate fixed EVF. I got used to swivel EVF on my nex-5n, where it increases stability angled to 45-90 degree: having face behind the camera increases torque due to larger distance to a center of weight. Plus, I dont have nose issues . Immediately remembered my slr days: absolutely unneeded, unjustified limitation. Hard to shoot lower positions, which was
  3. Lack of touch screen. I extensively use it with 5n. Big minus, making awkward positions even more undesirable. Nasty.
  4. I dislike its design. It feels a bit awkward.
  5. EC wheel is too tight to the extent of not being usable. I also wonder about fixed correction values. Who really needs them to be fixed? In the digital age we have quite unforgiving sensors and thus should correct value based on histogram/zebra, so won't see them anyway.
  6. IMO they sacrificed usability for the retro look. Big minus.
  7. startup time. It is really too long
  8. Lag on a7r is too long

So, IMO these are not good cameras: too retro slrish with all respective limitations (which is silly at least). And the fact they work bad with leica lenses saves my money: there is nothing in them that worth their price for me.
...Show more

Lol. Are you mad bro?



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:17 AM
jcolwell
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p.77 #12 · p.77 #12 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Emacs wrote:
I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera:
...So, IMO these are not good cameras: too retro slrish with all respective limitations (which is silly at least). And the fact they work bad with leica lenses saves my money: there is nothing in them that worth their price for me.

davewolfs wrote:
Lol. Are you mad bro?


He might be mad, but that doesn't mean that he can't have a valid opinion.

P.S. I suspect that he's not mad, but he could be angry - with cause.



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:23 AM
cputeq
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p.77 #13 · p.77 #13 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Well, I can see disappointment at not having a touch screen -- they're very useful (along with minimum SS with AutoISO, to beat a dead horse)

I can also see swivel EVF being pretty useful to avoid nose smudges on the LCD, but for me at least, a minor point. That does have me wanting to check out the GX7, though.




Nov 18, 2013 at 02:27 AM
Jeff Kott
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p.77 #14 · p.77 #14 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


jcolwell wrote:
He might be mad, but that doesn't mean that he can't have a valid opinion.


Sure, he's got a valid opinion. My opinion is that he's totally missing the big picture here.

Somebody finally built a FF mirrorless camera for less than $7K. But what the hell, let's nit pick it to death and say it's not a good camera in spite of all the opinions and photos to the contrary.



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:37 AM
michaelwatkins
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p.77 #15 · p.77 #15 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Emacs wrote:
I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera: [...]


Reading your evaluation was a good reminder how personal cameras are to each of us. While I agreed with one point without reservation, my own experience was different.

Too large - This is the only criticism I simply don't get and can't agree with not that we must. The A7r feels small in hand, but not tiny, and given it can mount some large lenses (optionally), this to me feels like a good thing. It's about the same size as a Contax 139 or other small film SLRs; there's probably little they can do to shrink them further while incorporating an EVF (see next point). It's the smallest full frame interchangeable lens autofocus & adaptable lens camera in the world with the Leica a close second albeit manual focus only. Griping about size just seems silly in context whether one likes the size or not.

Fixed EVF - you may prefer an optional tilting EVF (not swivel), but many do not. Tastes differ, but probably a majority of A7/n buyers prefer the EVF be fixed. They might have preferred it be located on the left side, "rangefinder style", but that would make the camera significantly bigger in order to accommodate a decent sized tilt LCD. Speaking of the tilt LCD, this goes a long way to allowing shooting from "lower positions" but in the end, you can't have it all.

Touch screen - granted it would be nice. I wonder what the design consideration was here, or is it marketing "we gotta leave something for the A9!"

Usability - IMO they chose the best of all alternatives: integrated EVF, centre located, keeps noses of left eye and right eye dominant shooters away from the camera's rear LCD. Keep the camera small. Plus it's a familiar shape that many of us intuitively know how to deal with from long association. Retro? Nah, the camera felt functional in my hands, but only time and real world usage will tell for sure.

Startup - I didn't notice this myself and I swapped in and out my SDHC card at least half a dozen times over the course of an evening checking out the camera. It might not be DSLR fast startup, but it's probably not going to get in the way. Ask me in a few weeks if I still feel that way, I'll be honest.

Lag - dunno. I did not get a good sense of shutter lag or post exposure lag while I checked out the camera and I'm usually sensitive to this. I care about shutter lag and I care about shot to shot lag. One of my current cameras is a pain in the ass in the latter regard and I didn't get that sense from the A7r. Hopefully I did not miss this point.



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:39 AM
jcolwell
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p.77 #16 · p.77 #16 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Jeff Kott wrote:
Sure, he's got a valid opinion. My opinion is that he's totally missing the big picture here.

Somebody finally built a FF mirrorless camera for less than $7K. But what the hell, let's nit pick it to death and say it's not a good camera in spite of all the opinions and photos to the contrary.


I'm on side. I'll probably buy one. Don't let the small stuff get you down.



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:41 AM
fungz0r
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p.77 #17 · p.77 #17 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Not sure what is up with people reporting start up time lag, I didn't experience any on the A7 and A7r I tested. Does it make a difference if you turn it off for 20 minutes and then boot it back up? From the 10 minutes or so I spent turning on and off the cameras I didn't find that it was exactly slow enough to be that big of a deal.

That said, I'm curious as to what the battery life is like while it's turned on and not shooting. I was quite fond of leaving my 5d2 on all day and take a couple shots here and there while traveling.



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:44 AM
Gary Clennan
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p.77 #18 · p.77 #18 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


Emacs wrote:
I tried a7 (r) in a shop and I must say I quite dislike this camera:


  1. They are too large. Larger than my Pentax k-m was. Sure, the depth is less with sony, but IMO it's width and height that really matter
  2. I hate fixed EVF. I got used to swivel EVF on my nex-5n, where it increases stability angled to 45-90 degree: having face behind the camera increases torque due to larger distance to a center of weight. Plus, I dont have nose issues . Immediately remembered my slr days: absolutely unneeded, unjustified limitation. Hard to shoot lower positions, which was
  3. Lack of touch screen. I extensively use it with 5n. Big minus, making awkward positions even more undesirable. Nasty.
  4. I dislike its design. It feels a bit awkward.
  5. EC wheel is too tight to the extent of not being usable. I also wonder about fixed correction values. Who really needs them to be fixed? In the digital age we have quite unforgiving sensors and thus should correct value based on histogram/zebra, so won't see them anyway.
  6. IMO they sacrificed usability for the retro look. Big minus.
  7. startup time. It is really too long
  8. Lag on a7r is too long

So, IMO these are not good cameras: too retro slrish with all respective limitations (which is silly at least). And the fact they work bad with leica lenses saves my money: there is nothing in them that worth their price for me.
...Show more

How dare you have a negative opinion about this camera! This camera is amazing - even though not many people own one yet…. Seriously though, it is nice to hear your opinion even if it contradicts the masses.



Nov 18, 2013 at 02:44 AM
fredmirandafan
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p.77 #19 · p.77 #19 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


frozenbc wrote:
As another Vancouverite, I'm also dying to hear what outlet you're dealing with. Vistek is also saying end of November for me as well (a7r).

I will get in touch with my Sony contact to see whether he minds me sharing the info here, I don't wanna jeopardize my relationships with them because I know for a fact the Sony team is reading this thread.

Hi guys, you know who you are, the lurkers



Nov 18, 2013 at 04:49 AM
kezeka
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p.77 #20 · p.77 #20 · Official: Sony A7 and A7R Fullframe Mirrorless


michaelwatkins wrote:
Reading your evaluation was a good reminder how personal cameras are to each of us. While I agreed with one point without reservation, my own experience was different.

Too large - This is the only criticism I simply don't get and can't agree with not that we must. The A7r feels small in hand, but not tiny, and given it can mount some large lenses (optionally), this to me feels like a good thing. It's about the same size as a Contax 139 or other small film SLRs; there's probably little they can do to shrink them further while incorporating
...Show more

I live in Texas and even there, there are plenty of reasons to not have a touch screen. In the summer I have so much sweat when I hike that I have to constantly wipe my hands off on my shirt in order to use my iPhone - which I guarantee has a better capacitive array than anything sony puts into its cameras. In the winter, I don't want to have to take my hands out of gloves to us my camera when it dips below 40 degrees (usually when I am traveling) or I just don't want to have to screw around hitting nonpalpable buttons on a flat surface. Just because everything is adding a pointless touchscreen (fridge, laptops, desktop monitors) doesn't mean cameras should. This is clearly being marketed as a prosumer good and should stick with traits that people in that camp value. Not providing for the fickle desires of whatever craptastic trend is dominating the public opinion at that second.



Nov 18, 2013 at 05:48 AM
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