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Archive 2017 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon

  
 
redisburning
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p.17 #1 · p.17 #1 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


I still think Canon has the better plan. Well, I'm assuming because theyre next 50 is supposed to be an upmarket f1.8.

If they keep the speed down AND have a real budget to work with their lens could be ballpark with the Zeiss and be considerably less expensive. Nikon 58/1.4 is then 2/3rd faster but much more and IQ goes handily to the Canon. with today's high ISO, maybe f1.8 offers enough isolation.

if Im a Zeiss engineer Im laughing my ass off at this Nikon though.



Oct 17, 2013 at 07:28 PM
Jabberwockt
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p.17 #2 · p.17 #2 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Nikon is going to sell a ton of these, most photographers wont even consider anything without AF, it easily passed the "sharp enough" bar and is native. Plus the rendering from the samples seem quote gorgeous: more gentle than the otus without as much microcontrast, but still holding a good amount of detail while the OOF is a bit lush/dreamy...wedding photographers will love it.


Oct 17, 2013 at 10:59 PM
zhangyue
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p.17 #3 · p.17 #3 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Andy, I agree. The more I look the sample, the more I feel it is like leica R, not critical sharp, but sharp enough and in focus plain not much SA, DOF is very smooth. It is lovely. If we consider ZA 50 and canon 50 both around $1600, the price looks not that bad as well.
As I said, I am sure people can get gorgeous portraits from this lens. With more and more sample show up, people might get tempting.



Oct 17, 2013 at 11:28 PM
AhamB
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p.17 #4 · p.17 #4 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


^Perhaps it will have a role like the 50L has for Canon -- the expensive 50 for those who like that FL for portraits.


Oct 18, 2013 at 02:28 AM
wayne seltzer
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p.17 #5 · p.17 #5 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Comparing the mtf with my 24/1.4G and even the 35/1.4G , it is not as sharp in the center by a fair bit. This seems dissappointing. It performs more evenly across the frame and looks to have very close tangential and sagital lines indicating smooth bokeh.
The new zeiss otus should easily outperform this lens wide open, which it should considering the difference in price.



Oct 18, 2013 at 02:59 AM
carstenw
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p.17 #6 · p.17 #6 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


I am guessing that this lens is more optimized for coma and look.


Oct 18, 2013 at 06:59 AM
carstenw
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p.17 #7 · p.17 #7 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


redisburning wrote:
I still think Canon has the better plan. Well, I'm assuming because theyre next 50 is supposed to be an upmarket f1.8.

If they keep the speed down AND have a real budget to work with their lens could be ballpark with the Zeiss and be considerably less expensive. Nikon 58/1.4 is then 2/3rd faster but much more and IQ goes handily to the Canon. with today's high ISO, maybe f1.8 offers enough isolation.

if Im a Zeiss engineer Im laughing my ass off at this Nikon though.


You *assume* that Canon has something better up their sleeve, and then laugh at Nikon? What do you call that?



Oct 18, 2013 at 07:03 AM
Lotusm50
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p.17 #8 · p.17 #8 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


carstenw wrote:
You *assume* that Canon has something better up their sleeve, and then laugh at Nikon? What do you call that?



I agree. I not sure why a Zeiss engineer would be laughing their ass off. If, from what we know, not a good as the Otus in absolute terms, the Zeiss engineer might marvel at how Nikon was able to produce something that good, with AF, for only about 2/5ths the price of the their vaunted Otus.




Oct 18, 2013 at 12:14 PM
Mescalamba
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p.17 #9 · p.17 #9 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


How?

Probably cause Nikon has bit less strickt manufacturing tolerances and Zeiss and Nikon lenses are made quite different way. Plus that tiny bit of performance Zeiss will have over Nikon is backed up by huge difference exactly in that manufacturing and tolerances. Plus glass price. Plus research and development etc.

Only thing in which these two are comparable is that they are both fast normal prime lens. Everything else is very very diferent.

And, it should have been f1.2 lens (Nikkor one).



Oct 18, 2013 at 12:31 PM
Lotusm50
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p.17 #10 · p.17 #10 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Well, I agree that it would have been advisable for Nikon to make the lens a f1.2. It would have distinguished it more in the market, but also would have made it more expensive.

I would suggest that the way they are made is irrelevant to the user, and what matters is how it performs for them. "The proof of the pudding is in the eating", as they say, not in the making.

One does need to ask the question whether the "huge difference" in manufacturing, tolerances, R&D, etc., and the huge additional cost that comes with it is worth the "tiny bit of performance" that is gained. For some users it will be, and for others it will not be.




Oct 18, 2013 at 02:07 PM
wiseguy010
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p.17 #11 · p.17 #11 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


The new Otus-line seems very attractive, but a little bit too expensive for me.

However, since 2 months I have a Nikon D800 and had some time shooting with it. In my opinion the current ZF.2 lens lineup is more than capable in handling the 36 MP's of this camera. I am not sure about higher MP's, but for now I can't imagine I will ever need that (as a more or less serious hobby photographer).



Oct 18, 2013 at 03:44 PM
AhamB
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p.17 #12 · p.17 #12 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Lotusm50 wrote:
Well, I agree that it would have been advisable for Nikon to make the lens a f1.2.


That may be a difficult task with the narrow throat size of the F mount (due to size restriction of the rear lens element). They managed it with the 50/1.2 Ai-S and the Noct-Nikkor, but those are manual lenses.



Oct 18, 2013 at 04:34 PM
Mescalamba
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p.17 #13 · p.17 #13 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Yea so AF lens somehow make throat size smaller?

You can use adapted C/Y 85/1.2 on it if I remember right. Its most likely not cause they cant, just cause they dont want.. But yes, it would be expensive, 50/1.2 L isnt exactly cheap lens.



Oct 18, 2013 at 04:46 PM
fsiagian
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p.17 #14 · p.17 #14 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


From a different perspective, my eyes are not getting better. So, AF has become a must for me


Oct 18, 2013 at 04:59 PM
redisburning
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p.17 #15 · p.17 #15 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


carstenw wrote:
You *assume* that Canon has something better up their sleeve, and then laugh at Nikon? What do you call that?


snobbish, maybe?

I dont care. Who wants to make something to a price point? I've done that, it's depressing. And when I see a competitor release something that is a worse version of what I've got, I laugh.

What market does this lens have? I assume most people who live in the world where AF is convenient enough to trump ultimate quality will either get a zoom because it's so much more "convenient" or if they really want the bouquets they'll get the 85/1.4 because that is the lens to own. I think this leaves a small niche who can't afford the Zeiss.

FWIW if Nikon took out the useless to me AF motor and charged a few hundred less for ZF or Leica R build quality (dear lord please no Ai-S style lenses) I'd be looking very seriously at this lens.

edit/ps : I compared point light sources in sample pictures and the Zeiss easily bested the Nikon from what I saw but samples are not production lenses in identical circumstances I suppose.



Oct 18, 2013 at 06:46 PM
hiepphotog
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p.17 #16 · p.17 #16 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Mescalamba wrote:
Yea so AF lens somehow make throat size smaller?

You can use adapted C/Y 85/1.2 on it if I remember right. Its most likely not cause they cant, just cause they dont want.. But yes, it would be expensive, 50/1.2 L isnt exactly cheap lens.


David (Leitax) told me that it would not fit. Otherwise, I would have gone the Nikon F way with the D800. I think that's a hard limitation. Nikon might not go the f/1.2 route with this lens because they want to keep a decent WO IQ with supposedly really low vignette (though the samples don't support this). The thing that surprised me the most is the weight. It is much lighter than the ZA 50 but managed to have a better IQ. They both got the bad rap for being much more expensive than they should be.



Oct 18, 2013 at 08:03 PM
carstenw
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p.17 #17 · p.17 #17 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


redisburning wrote:
I dont care. Who wants to make something to a price point? I've done that, it's depressing. And when I see a competitor release something that is a worse version of what I've got, I laugh.


vs.

FWIW if Nikon took out the useless to me AF motor and charged a few hundred less for ZF or Leica R build quality (dear lord please no Ai-S style lenses) I'd be looking very seriously at this lens.

You are not very consistent. Is it interesting or not?

FWIW, I believe that the Zeiss is a tour de force, a showcase of technical skill, and a lens which hardly anyone else could make. Very sharp, right into the corners, from wide open, and with very strong optical properties all around. The rendering and the boke may be touch and go, from what I have seen so far. Amazing for portraits, technically impressive, but not all that pleasing boke, at least on occasion.

The Nikon is the opposite. They have a lens with very flat, very tight MTF curves, which promises beautiful boke, and low coma. Other optical properties are not as strong, and I doubt it will compete with the Zeiss for sharpness. But ultimately, it may be the more popular lens. And AF is very useful for many people, even if we are not interested.

To be honest, I would love to own both. And the Leica E60.



Oct 19, 2013 at 01:24 PM
carstenw
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p.17 #18 · p.17 #18 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Mescalamba wrote:
Yea so AF lens somehow make throat size smaller?


I guess the more relevant difference between this and the earlier lenses is that this one has the electrical contacts, which do take up a bit of room from inside the mount.



Oct 19, 2013 at 01:27 PM
redisburning
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p.17 #19 · p.17 #19 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


carstenw wrote:
You are not very consistent. Is it interesting or not?


It is interesting to me, on a personal level. If it were small and well built, I could see paying that kind of money assuming it wasn't like the ZM50 in practice.

I do not design lenses. Still, I have experience in creating products and know what it is like to see the baby fawn standing up for the first time attempts of others to match your talent and vision. I am putting myself in someone else's shoes.

Zeiss made a lens for the future, Nikon a lens for this generation of cameras. One side of me sees a nice lens whose optical formula would get me to shell out some cash if it werent for the haptics. The other sees a missed opportunity by a company who always seems to fall just short of the mark e.g. 14-24 filter issue, 70-200 extreme focus breathing, D600 oil, etc.



Oct 19, 2013 at 02:11 PM
carstenw
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p.17 #20 · p.17 #20 · Official: Zeiss Otus 55mm f/1.4 APO-Distagon


Well, "always seem to fall short of the mark" is only the case with extremely selective vision. The 14-24G is still an astounding zoom, only bettered at individual focal lengths by extreme primes, and never reached by another zoom. The Nikons had the best AF in the business until the 5DIII and 1D-X, and the Nikon flash system is still the best. There is lots to be proud of as a Nikon owner, but of course also as the owners of other brands.

The 58/1.4 has the flattest MTF curve I have seen in a long time, maybe ever for a lens of this focal length. They are not the sharpest, while clearly sharp enough for almost any purpose, but the flatness is astounding, and the closeness of the two curves to each other is also extraordinary, and it has a 9 rounded blade aperture. I am guessing that this lens will have amazingly beautiful boke, and may become another classic.

Let's see what comes before passing judgement.



Oct 19, 2013 at 02:22 PM
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