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Archive 2013 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro

  
 
Michael Gordon
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


I have told by my Olympus photo group that magnification is the sole determinant of
shutter speed required in macrophotoography. Also that focal length effects the
shutter speed required with the rule of thumb of 1/FL for non-macro applications is valid as it reflects the larger magnificaion resulting in using longer FL lenses.
On the other hand to me it seems to me that using a longer macro lens with the attendant longer working distance that any displacment of the cam by shake will result in a larger movement of the image on the sensor and thus more blur. I have seen one estimate that minimum shutter speed is about 1/FL * (1 +Mag) **2 as well. This is confusing to me and thought I should check here. Any comments appreciated.



Sep 19, 2013 at 06:52 PM
Julian Nell
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


If you are using flash, use the fastest compatible SS with your camera and flash setup, usually 1/200 or 1/250.

If you are not using flash, there are many knowledgable people that will help you.

Sorry for the simple response, I only really know about using flash.

Julian



Sep 19, 2013 at 08:15 PM
Tom Hicks
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


Tripod and use any shutter speed you like , 1sec 14 sec 25 min. problem solved . Just saying. One needs to learn to shoot macro in many different ways , not just hand holding and depending on the flash to stop movement .
You need to learn to use all your tools not just the hammer. what if you didn't have a hammer ? then what are you going to do .




Sep 19, 2013 at 09:30 PM
Dalantech
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


Link to an old thread at DP Review where Fred Vachss (if I remember correctly he is a retired electrical engineer) was taking a look at minimum shutter speeds for macro and flash durations for freezing motion. The 1/f rule breaks down at life size and higher magnification -motion blur actually becomes more of a problem when shooting macro.

One of the mistakes that a lot of people made back then was jumping all over the minimum flash duration values and claiming that the flash could freeze anything. The only problem is that you'll rarely, if ever, be shooting with a flash at minimum power. Some of the best "stop motion macro photographers" (like Fotoopa) use multiple flash guns set to minimum power so that they can get enough light to expose the scene, and at the same time keep their flash duration to a minimum.

Although I do agree with Tom, you also have to take into account any subject motion. It's difficult to get a shutter speed high enough to produce sharp images using natural light if the subject is moving -and when you do the light is usually so harsh that the resulting image doesn't look too good. The best bet is to learn how to shoot in a wide range of lighting conditions so that you can make the most out of what's available.



Sep 20, 2013 at 02:03 AM
Michael Gordon
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


Thank you. I am off tomorrow in search of the elusive Bronze Copper--I have never obtained a sataisfactory image of one..Will bring a tripod and a flash but seem to like the images better with fill flash only. My rig is not image stabilzed and it is a small critter, thus my question. It will not be cool, so likely will not cooperate with a pod but I always lug it just in case. Seems focal length is an issue though I don't fully understand the derivation. Appreciate the input thus far and any further elaboration.
Mike



Sep 20, 2013 at 12:51 PM
e6filmuser
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


There are two components of motion in photography: that of the cameras/lens and that of the subject (if the latter is not e.g. a building). (Dalentect mentioned this). The former can be eliminated by a tripod, where practical (wind can still move a large, long lens with a large hood). Unless the latter is an inanimate object it is likely to be the major contributor (locomotion of an insect and/or its substrate moved by a breeze, or the stem of a flower moved by even the least air movement.

So, with ambient light, you need a shutter speed to freeze any subject movement and (hand-held) to overcome any unsteady hands. Regarding the latter, I have sometimes reduced shutter speed to let the IS sort that out.

Not quite addressing the immediate issue, but maybe of interest: some experimentation with higher than minimal ISO showed that (manual operation, manual flash) I could use at least two shutter speeds higher than the specification for the camera stated for flash synchronisation without losing part of the frame. Check your gear for this before using it on a vital shoot!

Harold




Sep 21, 2013 at 03:08 AM
e6filmuser
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


Dalantech wrote:
[One of the mistakes that a lot of people made back then was jumping all over the minimum flash duration values and claiming that the flash could freeze anything. The only problem is that you'll rarely, if ever, be shooting with a flash at minimum power. Some of the best "stop motion macro photographers" (like Fotoopa) use multiple flash guns set to minimum power so that they can get enough light to expose the scene, and at the same time keep their flash duration to a minimum.


A thought-provoking idea, there. I have multiple legacy OM flash units (T-series), of which I usually use one or two.

I am not familar with current models of flash and their controls. My units are either full power of (some) half power on manual (which I mostly use). These will give long flash duration. Shorter duration is availabnle via camera or gun metering. I have only the latter available to me with my EP2. The way for me to get the shortest flash duration is to meter with the units close to the subject.

What gets overlooked is that metering takes time. If the flash is too close to the subject it will overexpose before the meter can turn it off. I suggest that any system using flash for macro should be checked for this effect.

Harold



Sep 21, 2013 at 03:23 AM
Michael Gordon
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


Hmmm, I have the T28 twin flash. On manual has GN (meters) of 9 or 22 (both flashes on) and listed flash duration is 1/1000 to 1/40,000. A bit more of a pain to use on non OM system w/o TTL metering but the ND filters that fit on the T32 can be used to improve flexibility.


Sep 24, 2013 at 06:15 PM
e6filmuser
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Question how to estimate minimum shutter speed to handhold macro


Michael Gordon wrote:
Hmmm, I have the T28 twin flash. On manual has GN (meters) of 9 or 22 (both flashes on) and listed flash duration is 1/1000 to 1/40,000. A bit more of a pain to use on non OM system w/o TTL metering but the ND filters that fit on the T32 can be used to improve flexibility.

You won't get those short duration flashes unless you have a T-series gun, such as a T32 or T20 to meter the lifht on the subject. They need not contribute any light (e.g. tilt the T32 upwards) prvided that the meter ey , in the O of Olympus, is towards the subject.

In response to your comment about ND filters on the Twin T 28, I have just found where I left two of mine!

Here is where I first used the twin T28, manually, for digital macro:

http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=124994#124994

Harold



Sep 25, 2013 at 01:17 AM





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