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Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come wi...
  
 
Jeff Kott
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p.2 #1 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


uhoh7 wrote:
now in retrospect, who got their nex-7s earliest? sonystore, amazon, b&H, or .....?


My recollection is that Sonystore shipped a couple of days before B&H.



Sep 05, 2013 at 06:30 PM
theophilus
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p.2 #2 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


If these have some next-generation on-pixel phase detect AF then I'll dump my entire Canon and APS-C NEX system for this.

I'll have Zuiko 21/3.5, C/Y Zeiss 28/2.8, probably the 35/2.8 and 55/1.8 and then something in the 135-200 range.

Fill in after that with the FD 85mm 1.2



Sep 05, 2013 at 07:24 PM
freaklikeme
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p.2 #3 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


LightShow wrote:
I know it's very unlikely that the CV15 and current FF sensors will work well together, I expect that I won't be able to really use it till Organic sensors become common, till then Ill be very happy if my M 24/2.8 has minimal color shift.


Then cross your fingers that it has better performance than the VG900, because the 24 on that was not pretty. The vIII 28/2.8 faired only slightly better.



Sep 05, 2013 at 07:47 PM
LightShow
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p.2 #4 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


freaklikeme wrote:
Then cross your fingers that it has better performance than the VG900, because the 24 on that was not pretty. The vIII 28/2.8 faired only slightly better.

The compactness of the FE 35/2.8 gives me hope the sensor is more forgiving than the VG900, truth is if its as bad in the corners as my NEX-7 is, I'll be happy, if its better, I'll be giddy.



Sep 05, 2013 at 08:01 PM
sebboh
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p.2 #5 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


alwang wrote:
I actually don't even care if my CV15 works with FF: 15mm is just too wide for me for most applications. I like my CV15 as a compact 22mm equivalent.


+1

ulrikft2 wrote:
The more expensive Nex-FF + my CV 35/1.2 (please, please work.. PLEASE!), my Rokkor 58/1.2, contax 45/2, contax 90/2.8, FD 135/2.8 and some sort of a wide angle... Dream kit come true!


yeah, i have my lenses ready: rokkor MD 24/2.8, c/y 35/1.4, 40 cron, g45, jupiter-3, rokkor 58/1.2, and still undecided on short telephotos, maybe 75 summarit.

it'd be awfully nice if my g28 worked on it, but i'm certainly not expecting it to.




Sep 05, 2013 at 08:32 PM
naturephoto1
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p.2 #6 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


I am keeping my fingers crossed that the Zeiss 21mm ZM will play nicely with the new FF NEX. I expect that I will need something better than my Leica R 21mm f4 Super Angulon which drops off in sharpneess toward the edges.

Rich



Sep 05, 2013 at 08:37 PM
freaklikeme
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p.2 #7 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


LightShow wrote:
The compactness of the FE 35/2.8 gives me hope the sensor is more forgiving than the VG900, truth is if its as bad in the corners as my NEX-7 is, I'll be happy, if its better, I'll be giddy.


Let's just hope they're not relying heavily on software correction for good performance with the natives.



Sep 06, 2013 at 02:04 AM
MarcG19
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p.2 #8 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


Very interesting. Probably an enthusiast mirrorless (FF NEX 7, probably priced between the D600/6D and 5Dm3/D800), a low cost mirrorless (FF NEX 5, priced to undercut the D600/6D) and then a cheap pseudo-DSLR probably between the low cost mirrorless and the cost of the D600/6D. (Sony will have to compete on price with those, especially hard since those have been out for a year or so and Canikon's aggressively discounting).

Will be interesting to see how much traction this gets. Will also be interesting to see how fast/well they fill in their lens lineup.



Sep 06, 2013 at 03:15 AM
philip_pj
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p.2 #9 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


One is very likely to be the 'DSLR' model, if they want to move faster this will use an updated version of the 36Mp D800 sensor to attract and convert C/N types, provided the get the Z axis thing working well.

I think it's most likely that one of the other two will be an RX1 style camera, at least the rumoured $3000 suggest as much - look at the CZ lens specs so far released - very high end, very light.

Sony find themselves in the quite unfamiliar position of having something no one else is even close to developing - a truly compact FF ILC with fine native lenses and broadly acceptable legacy lens compatibility, and best of all from a business viewpoint their major competitors will not be at all eager to enter the fray quickly.

So I think it's unlikely that Sony sees a cheap NEX FF as a good idea - something to throw out the door to compete with C/N's decidedly underdone and very budget FF DSLRs...people might then think they are just a 'consumer electronic gadget maker', lol.

More likely is an option up approach, trading off some RRP for things like IBIS/AA-less/sensor resolution, and perhaps other functionality like sensor versions to accommodate M lenses...they would want you to know what are missing out on by getting the 'less expensive' model. Post release discounting will bring them all down in price after a little while anyway.




Sep 06, 2013 at 03:48 AM
freaklikeme
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p.2 #10 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


sebboh wrote:
+1

yeah, i have my lenses ready: rokkor MD 24/2.8, c/y 35/1.4, 40 cron, g45, jupiter-3, rokkor 58/1.2, and still undecided on short telephotos, maybe 75 summarit.

it'd be awfully nice if my g28 worked on it, but i'm certainly not expecting it to.



Aside from the pre-A Lux 35 (my please, please, please lens), the ones I'm most excited to shoot on a FF NEX are the FD 20-35L and 85L, the Rokkor 16 FE (which was purchased because of these rumors) and 50/1.4, the Minolta 17/4 and 100/4 Macro, and a handful of others I'm forgetting that I've never used on a FF of any kind.



Sep 06, 2013 at 04:19 AM
 

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alba63
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p.2 #11 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


Right now, people use the Nex FF a little bit as a projection surface for their camera dreams. Common sense however tells me that - as usual - some things only will come reality. I'd think that the following is likely to happen:
1. Very good sensor, 28-34MP and large latitude
2. Lenses that always keep size and weight in mind, therefore not extremely fast, maybe f1,8 willbe the fast ones, the other ones f2,8 and F4 for the zooms.
3. I'd not expect old manual wide angle lenses to perform very well. My limited knowledge tells me that they'd have to have a more telecentric design in order to avoid border issues. Zeiss will probably build one or 2 later. For 50mm and upwards old manual lenses should not be a problem. I' prefer good Zeiss AF lenses however: 35mm, 55/1,8 and 85/1,8 seems like a perfect traditional trio to me. One that I would prefer to any APS camera any time, if the price stays reasonable.
4. I doubt the first Nex FF bodies will have IBIS, the partnership with Oly is too young for that - but I might be wrong on this one.
5. Z axis sensor shift AF may come in the SLR shaped Nex, but not in the small ones..
6. I hope that hybrid AF will perform a bit better than in the Nex-6.
7. It will probably have apps that can order the stuff that has run out in your fridge, and receive facebook messages :-)

Bernie



Sep 06, 2013 at 09:19 AM
naturephoto1
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p.2 #12 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


alba63 wrote:
Right now, people use the Nex FF a little bit as a projection surface for their camera dreams. Common sense however tells me that - as usual - some things only will come reality. I'd think that the following is likely to happen:
1. Very good sensor, 28-34MP and large latitude
2. Lenses that always keep size and weight in mind, therefore not extremely fast, maybe f1,8 willbe the fast ones, the other ones f2,8 and F4 for the zooms.
3. I'd not expect old manual wide angle lenses to perform very well. My limited knowledge tells me that they'd have to have
...Show more

Bernie,

Unless SARS got the initial rumors wrong, I believe the first FF E-mount camera is a NEX body and the most expensive of the 3 FF cameras reported to be released. If correct, I believe that they were able to get IBIS into the camera, but I may be wrong.

Rich



Sep 06, 2013 at 11:50 AM
alba63
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p.2 #13 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


naturephoto1 wrote:
Unless SARS got the initial rumors wrong, I believe the first FF E-mount camera is a NEX body and the most expensive of the 3 FF cameras reported to be released. If correct, I believe that they were able to get IBIS into the camera, but I may be wrong.


Well, I don't know much about the percentage of wrong rumors on SAR; I'd like Ibis but yet would be surprised...

What do you guys here know about the size of the lens mount and the FF image circle, cignetting etc.? My knowledge is not wide enough to really judge this. But I have read some people claim that the lens mount is too small really for FF and that it was made essentially with APS/c in mind.

Bernie



Sep 06, 2013 at 01:49 PM
naturephoto1
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p.2 #14 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


alba63 wrote:
Well, I don't know much about the percentage of wrong rumors on SAR; I'd like Ibis but yet would be surprised...

What do you guys here know about the size of the lens mount and the FF image circle, cignetting etc.? My knowledge is not wide enough to really judge this. But I have read some people claim that the lens mount is too small really for FF and that it was made essentially with APS/c in mind.

Bernie


Bernie,

To the best of my knowledge the E-Mount is large enough for a FF lens image circle, should work with almost all legacy lenses. Zeiss would not be working on new lens designs in the E-Mount size that had FF coverage if they would not cover the FF image circle. There may well be issues with very wide angle lenses that have rear elements very close to the sensor (unless this issue has been addressed by Sony) and some longer lenses may be longer than would have been possible with a larger mount diameter.

Rich



Sep 06, 2013 at 02:05 PM
douglasf13
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p.2 #15 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


The mount fits a FF sensor, but, due to its size, it limits Sony on how they can design native lenses, especially small lenses.


Sep 06, 2013 at 02:48 PM
alba63
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p.2 #16 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


douglasf13 wrote:
The mount fits a FF sensor, but, due to its size, it limits Sony on how they can design native lenses, especially small lenses.


Do telecentric designs have to be deeper than "normal" ones?



Sep 06, 2013 at 05:39 PM
douglasf13
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p.2 #17 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


alba63 wrote:
Do telecentric designs have to be deeper than "normal" ones?



See here and here.



Sep 06, 2013 at 05:43 PM
philip_pj
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p.2 #18 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


In one of the Sony interviews just after the RX1 release, this was put to the Sony engineer - he said yes FF will fit the E mount and we are looking into it..words to that effect. Said with a smile too.


Sep 06, 2013 at 09:33 PM
douglasf13
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p.2 #19 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


I don't think there's a question whether FF sensors will fit into e-mount. The VG900 is proof of that. The question is how it affects the design of the native lenses.


Sep 06, 2013 at 09:38 PM
artur5
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p.2 #20 · Sony Full Frame attack: (SR5) Three E-mount FF to come within 5 months!


The question is if they took care of making a sensor more tolerant to acute angles of incidence in order to allow relatively compact optic designs. It might be so, hopefully. That Sonnar FE 35/2.8 has an overall size more like a Biogon than to a Distagon, but who knows ?.


Sep 06, 2013 at 10:05 PM
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