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Archive 2013 · Canon EOS 70D
  
 
WAYCOOL
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Canon EOS 70D


Better noise maybe but don't expect more DR, same old sensor tech. The 7DII with new sensor tech should be the one for more DR.


Jun 28, 2013 at 01:42 AM
arbitrage
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Canon EOS 70D


Pixel Perfect wrote:
No, Canon are on record as saying a 7D II is coming, but there is much discussion about what direction it should take. There was an interview earlier this year talking about this. I don't expect it this year however.

It will be interesting to see what features of the 7D are left out from the 70D. Will it get MA, unlike the 60D, will it get 8fps or stay with the usual 6fps of that segment. If it's basically a 7D with better sensor, digic V+, and things like wifi etc, then I have high hopes the 7D II
...Show more

It says 7fps on the leaked product sheet.

Based on this leaked product sheet being true (seems very legit to me), I would expect/hope that a 7DII would have this same 20.2MP sensor (unlikely Canon has 2 new APS-C sensors), improved AF and FPS between 8-10. If this sensor has no real improvements other than the 2MP jump then I will have no interest in a 7DII. Unless of course 7DII brings back APS-H



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:46 AM
arbitrage
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Canon EOS 70D


WAYCOOL wrote:
Better noise maybe but don't expect more DR, same old sensor tech. The 7DII with new sensor tech should be the one for more DR.


I seriously doubt Canon has another new APS-C sensor considering how long they've been recycling the last 18MP one. This 20.2MP sensor is likely the "new tech" one if there is really any new tech. It does have the new liveview AF tech on the sensor.



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:49 AM
jorkata
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Canon EOS 70D


Gunzorro wrote:
... if the new 20MP does for APS-C what the 6D did to improve the 5D2 IQ, that would be worthwhile imaging improvement!


That's what I'd expect.

The current 18mp sensor is quite noisy at ISO 6400 and it's hard to imagine that they can just push that to ISO 12800 without making some actual sensor improvements.
A 5D2-->6D type of improvement is most likely, IMO.
Still based on Canon's current CMOS tech, though, not on the awaited brand new tech.



Jun 28, 2013 at 02:18 AM
jorkata
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Canon EOS 70D


arbitrage wrote:
... I would expect/hope that a 7DII would have this same 20.2MP sensor (unlikely Canon has 2 new APS-C sensors) ...


This new 20mp sensor will definitely find its way in many other 1.6x models ... but not in the 7DII, IMO.


If this sensor has no real improvements other than the 2MP jump then I will have no interest in a 7DII.

Exactly.

The 70D is now spec'd like the original 7D (more or less).
So, a 7DII with the same 20mp sensor but a few extra AF points and frames per second would be pretty much DOA.
The only way I can see the 7DII standing out is if it has a better sensor than the 70D (and soon the other 1.6x cameras).
Either one made on a new tech - or one that is larger than 1.6x.



Jun 28, 2013 at 02:33 AM
arbitrage
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Canon EOS 70D


jorkata wrote:
This new 20mp sensor will definitely find its way in many other 1.6x models ... but not in the 7DII, IMO.


Exactly.

The 70D is now spec'd like the original 7D (more or less).
So, a 7DII with the same 20mp sensor but a few extra AF points and frames per second would be pretty much DOA.
The only way I can see the 7DII standing out is if it has a better sensor than the 70D (and soon the other 1.6x cameras).
Either one made on a new tech - or one that is larger than 1.6x.


I still think the 7DII could stand out from the 70D even if they shared the same sensor. In the same ways that the 7D has stood out from all the other crop cameras since 2009. If the 7DII gets a new AF system or 5D3 AF (if that is even possible on the crop sensor) and gets FPS somewhere between 8-10 then it would still stand out from the 70D. Also it would likely have a better construction, weather sealing, AFMA, CF card slot etc.



Jun 28, 2013 at 02:59 AM
Pixel Perfect
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Canon EOS 70D


arbitrage wrote:
It says 7fps on the leaked product sheet.

Based on this leaked product sheet being true (seems very legit to me), I would expect/hope that a 7DII would have this same 20.2MP sensor (unlikely Canon has 2 new APS-C sensors), improved AF and FPS between 8-10. If this sensor has no real improvements other than the 2MP jump then I will have no interest in a 7DII. Unless of course 7DII brings back APS-H


Ok, so a 7D lite then.

As I said all eyes will be on the sensor. Is it the rumoured APS-C version with new tech that will part of the high MP FF, or is a nip and tuck with just digic V+ added?

I'd say 0.5 stops improvements across the board in DR, noise and shadow pushability as the minium acdeptable, but need to better in at least one of those. Now the last time we saw a new APS-C sensor from Canon it was of course the 18MP sensor, and indeed it was a big improvement on the 15MP sensor at least in noise, but that won't be enough this time round.



Jun 28, 2013 at 03:13 AM
Pixel Perfect
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Canon EOS 70D


jorkata wrote:
Exactly.

The 70D is now spec'd like the original 7D (more or less).
So, a 7DII with the same 20mp sensor but a few extra AF points and frames per second would be pretty much DOA.
The only way I can see the 7DII standing out is if it has a better sensor than the 70D (and soon the other 1.6x cameras).
Either one made on a new tech - or one that is larger than 1.6x.


My hope comes from the language used in that interview, where they said they did not just want it to be an update. It might be radically different.

My huge hope is for APS-H to live on and the 7D II become the real 1D IV replacement. Match it on speed, better AF, match it on noise, better it on DR. I can't see it becoming yet another FF camera and I can't see a different APS-C sensor to 70D. If they have new sensor tech, use it across the board like Sony and Nikon.

Maybe the 70D will surprise us (in a good way) and having this sensor in the 7D II will be fine.

Lot's of anxious waiting ahead to see if Canon has woken from it's sensor slumber. Although I should say the 1D X is veyr good, even if it has not made much improvement in DR, it's still got better DR, low noise and cleaner shadows than all the other Canon sensors. Combination of big pixels, and 16 channel readout and very low read noise.



Jun 28, 2013 at 03:19 AM
M Lucca
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Canon EOS 70D


Maybe we all be so lucky that canon would just shrink the 1dx into a small sized body and call it 7d2.

It's funny that folks are talking up the 7d2 despite the thread topic is for 70d.



Jun 28, 2013 at 06:54 AM
rodp
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Canon EOS 70D


as a current 60d owner the servo focus performance has tempted me towards a 7d upgrade but i have been able to resist this due to the sensor not being any better.

if this 70d has better focusing and a sensor with better shadow noise and/or iso performance i dare say ill be saving for it immediately.

microadjustment would be nice but isnt a deal breaker - i dont do many shallow fast prime shots.



Jun 28, 2013 at 07:18 AM
 

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johnctharp
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Canon EOS 70D


M Lucca wrote:
It's funny that folks are talking up the 7d2 despite the thread topic is for 70d.


I'll throw it for another loop- how about an EOS-M with this sensor? Autofocus has already improved with firmware, and Canon actually delivered on that promise (no one actually held their breath, did they?).

I'd like to see an EF-system mirrorless that's kitted out like a NEX6/7. Fast auto-focus, twin dials, articulating screen (at least folding), the world's best EVF, and maybe even a fast frame rate (there's no mirror, right?). Intelligent autofocus that could perhaps track a bird in flight, considering that they have the whole sensor to do it with?

And one last wish for this new sensor- none of the intentional video-moire BS they did with the 6D. I'm not bitter about this; I knew it going in. But my God(s) if a 20MP sensor can't make a clean 2MP video, you know the company is intentionally screwing with you.



Jun 28, 2013 at 10:42 AM
Camperjim
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Canon EOS 70D


I would call the 70D a major disappointment.

After 4 years, Canon should be able to do better than adding 2 mp to the resolution. That would be fine if the new sensor had greatly improved DR and very low noise at high ISO. I doubt that is the case. It seems Canon has just not placed any emphasis on improving the sensors. Instead they add bells and whistles to catch up with some cellphone technology; i.e., WiFi, touchscreen and in camera HDR. It seems that Canon is not doing much for the serious photographer. I certainly wish I did not own a bunch of Canon lenses. I have been looking forward to an improved APS-C camera for several years. Instead I am going to spend my money on a Epson 3880 and next year if Canon is still in the dust, I will go through the pain of selling off my Canon glass.



Jun 28, 2013 at 11:16 AM
Ed Swift
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Canon EOS 70D


This looks like it would probably do me, my main criteria of better noise & AF than my 40d not really being met fully by any of the more affordable cameras. Not had a chance to personally try a 1d3 though, but loosing reach with out extra pixels may be painful. even if i appreciate one can get large prints from it.

Hopefully there will be AFMA which would make it a serious contender for my next camera.

John, have you seen this page (found through CR), showing possible FF compacts? http://www.canon.fr/For_Home/Compare_Products/#



Jun 28, 2013 at 12:47 PM
cputeq
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Canon EOS 70D


?..but does it have MA?

Pessimist me says this is still the 18MP sensor, they just upres in camera



Jun 28, 2013 at 12:54 PM
MintMar
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Canon EOS 70D


M Lucca wrote:
Maybe we all be so lucky that canon would just shrink the 1dx into a small sized body and call it 7d2.


They shrunk it already, it's called 5D3...



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:03 PM
GC5
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · Canon EOS 70D


Camperjim wrote:
I would call the 70D a major disappointment.

After 4 years, Canon should be able to do better than adding 2 mp to the resolution. That would be fine if the new sensor had greatly improved DR and very low noise at high ISO. I doubt that is the case. It seems Canon has just not placed any emphasis on improving the sensors. Instead they add bells and whistles to catch up with some cellphone technology; i.e., WiFi, touchscreen and in camera HDR. It seems that Canon is not doing much for the serious photographer. I certainly wish I did not
...Show more

Couldn't wait for someone to come out and say the camera/sensor sucks before it has been released and any testing done...



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:09 PM
Joseph Garcin
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · Canon EOS 70D


GC5 wrote:
Couldn't wait for someone to come out and say the camera/sensor sucks before it has been released and any testing done...


It is amazing how unhappy some people really are. As if their life would suddenly be complete if they could push shadows 2 more stops. Buy a printer instead and maybe life will get a little better.



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:47 PM
gocolts
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · Canon EOS 70D


70D looks ok to me. Not enough to make me get one to replace my 7D though. I'll be interested to see how the new sensor does with noise performance. I find my wife's SL1 to be very similiar to the 7D in this regard, so I can only assume the 70D with (finally) an all-new sensor, should be able to exceed it by a notable amount.

As for a 7DII, all I'd ask for is at least a stop better ISO, dual memory card slots, and weather sealing. If they want me to pre-order it the day it's announced regardless of price, then include 10fps and AF at f/8....



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:49 PM
Camperjim
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · Canon EOS 70D


cputeq wrote:
?..but does it have MA?

Pessimist me says this is still the 18MP sensor, they just upres in camera

I wondered the same thing. What do you think Canon would do if the engineers could only come up with 19+ megapixels?



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:55 PM
Camperjim
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · Canon EOS 70D


gocolts wrote:
70D looks ok to me. Not enough to make me get one to replace my 7D though. I'll be interested to see how the new sensor does with noise performance. I find my wife's SL1 to be very similiar to the 7D in this regard, so I can only assume the 70D with (finally) an all-new sensor, should be able to exceed it by a notable amount.

As for a 7DII, all I'd ask for is at least a stop better ISO, dual memory card slots, and weather sealing. If they want me to pre-order it the day it's announced
...Show more
Why do you assume the "new" sensor has better noise performance? I think Canon stretched real hard to get in the ballpark of the 7100 resolution. They may have pushed their existing technology and actually now the noise performance may be worse.



Jun 28, 2013 at 01:59 PM
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