Home · Register · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username  

  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  New Feature: SMS Notification alert
  New Feature: Buy & Sell Watchlist
  

FM Forums | Leica & Alternative Gear | Join Upload & Sell

1      
2
       end
  

Archive 2013 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?

  
 
darrellc
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


I sold my 5D2 + L kit after landing on an OM-D after churning thru all the mirrorless options - didn't feel I was giving up a lot on IQ. Then I bought an RX1 - way better than the OM-D and 5D2. So now I have a D800 + 28/50/85 primes.

So consider you're comparing a new, albeit APS-C, sensor to a 5 yr old sensor.

You might consider your decision between which new camera to buy, rather than comparing one specific new camera to your existing one. That perspective may yield the same decision, maybe not...



May 30, 2013 at 01:16 PM
wfrank
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


Thing is, in Canon land, that the 5D3 does not improve sensor performance in any significant way.

On topic I stick with FF (5D2) while enjoying having a small alternative in a NEX. The NEX is a very capable and above all small alternative but lacks speed and handling. Somebody mentioned 35/1.4 look. It was about the Canon 35L and in my case it is OVF/MF through a fast matte and CY 35/1.4 - but results arent far apart. Files like that dont appear in crop land.

Perhaps Fuji alternatives are better but I cant reproduce the look from lenses such as the CY 50/1.4 or 85/1.4 either.



May 30, 2013 at 02:56 PM
hauxon
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


I'm a long time 5D2 + ZE shooter (and 1DsII before that). I shoot landscape mostly and would appreciate lightweight gear for hiking. I did try m43 but felt it was too hard to use in low light and for night shots. Probably a little better now with the OMD but I did never feel at home with the system. I've been thinking a lot if the X-system is what I need.

Few weeks ago a friend loaned me his X-E1, 18-55/2.8-4 and 35/1.4 lenses for a Paris trip. I generally liked it and the lenses but it failed in places I've not heard much about, it didn't feel responsive. I for example usually take 3-4 shots in a row when shooting people and then quickly review the shots for look and focus and delete all but one or two. This is simply not possible with the X-E1. You will need to wait for the camera to finish writing the files to the SD card, takes 5-20 seconds and just kills the "moment" and if you realize no shot is good the people you were shooting have started doing something else while you were waiting for the camera. Another example. I decided it would be fun letting people jump in the images to spicen up my Paris street images. Well I gave up, the camera was unable to lock focus on a (moving) subject during broad daylight standing 3-4 meters away. I haven't had to wait like that since I had the Canon 300D back in 2005 and every DSLR camera I can think of would have executed the jump scene with ease.

Besides that the X-E1 performed admirably. I shot some sunsets that came out great and felt it was easier to use for that kind of shots than the m43 camera I had. But after the trip I did appreciate my 5DII more and would rather have a little bit heavier bag on my shoulder next time. ...also found out the the gorillapod is next to useless.

Hrannar



May 30, 2013 at 03:41 PM
zhangyue
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


I agree with both above post. FF DSLR with OVF shooting experience (and lens performance for 24/35/50/85 1.4 look) is/can not replaced by anything so far.

Even Leica M9 is not good for certain type of things. So I no longer put high hope for FF mirrorless camera unless there is sea change in technology while give me the same OVF feeling with EVF. meaning lag, color, DR etc...

I am not even talk about AF or anything like that. On the contrary, there is a lot more potential to reduce FF DSLR size with the success story of D600 and 6D.

If all you need to do is take something never move, and don't care DOF, there are really tons of choice available now. But if you want a good photography tool for pretty much anything you can think of to cover all the need. DSLR can't be replaced for foresee future. I thought MILC can replace it, but now I don't and at least it won't do it for me.





May 30, 2013 at 03:55 PM
Karel Geertsem
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


Thank you all for your thoughtful replies. You have helped me quite a lot in my thought process.

Yup, I like the 5D2 too, the ZE's even more so... but ... oh, that difference is SO small. I love the build quality of the ZE's versus all the wonder plastic lenses out there, but now there's Fuji... And remember, I have compared a zoom (ZOOM) to the arguably some of the very best primes out there.

I think Lightroom 4.4 and Aperture 3.4.4 are quite up to the task of working with X-trans files (maybe Capture One 7.1 even more so but I don't like the program as a whole). I also bought the NIK suite. The sharpening alone is awesome, much better than in Lightroom/Aperture; thank you for the LR sharpening = 0 then NIK tip.
So far I only found one problem with moire, which is very well handled in-camera but not in LR/Aperture. No mushy foliage to my eyes.

Yeah... I happen to own a "stupid" 50 MP, but unfortunately it is in mint condition

The 5D2 is not a speed demon. I own only 2 autofocus lenses: an old Canon 20-35/3.5-<something> and a Tamron 28-75/2.8. Especially the Tamron isn't really fast either. Haven't used them in years. Focusing the ZE's with Live View and a Zacuto finder is 100% accurate, but, let's say: slow. In the film years ago I did shoot a wedding for friends though, with an EOS 300V (or maybe an 100) and the Tamron plus a now-sold 100/2. Nerve wrecking.

Not really sure if my work is "serious" enough for the 5D2, I'm an amateur.

Any idea why someone who sold their DSLR's did buy them back? Except for speed, weather sealed, some lenses (like T/S or really long), none if which I need (I might WANT a T/S though ).

Might need a better monitor to see the fine differences between 5D2 and X-E1 files though (maybe end of the year, right now I'm on an iMac). Prints will arrive after the weekend though.

The thinner DOF is definitely an issue. The announced 23/1.4 and/or the 56/1.2 might be the ticket though.

Have no polariser yet, will see if the EVF works well with it.

Bursts @ 6 fps with a Sandisk Extreme Pro seems to work reasonable? Have to try with jumping people and smashing the shutter though.

I agree, a DSLR is the most versatile tool right now, and yet I think for me the X-E1 is awfully close.

I guess the only thing holding me back in selling the 5D2 plus ZE's is the loss of money involved. The loss of money in a system hardly ever used (and it sees a lot less use lately) might be even bigger though. Is it worth keeping 2 systems, one "for the road" and one "for car access"?

Again, thank you all!











May 31, 2013 at 10:18 AM
Jeremy Reitman
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


For me, yes, I probably lost money. But my 5D2 was just sitting in a bag in the closet. Not my XPro-1 gets used all the time, just because it's more usable. No regrets at all here. Ready for fuji to get on with their roadmap and get some more of their lenses released. I don't love the 18mm lens, but right now it's the closest thing to a 35mm equivalent I can get right now.


May 31, 2013 at 10:25 AM
Dudewithoutape
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


I'm currently in a very similar situation; 5Dc, Nex 5N, CY Zeiss instead of your newer 5DII, Fuji X, ZEs. I have to agree with wfrank and others though. It's really hard to let go of that FF goodness and responsiveness that comes from a DSLR. These new MILCs just aren't there yet, IMHO (or at least in the ones I can afford).

Say what you will about the Sony sensors and their DR, there really is a special something in the 5Dc IQ still. For me, its the ease to change settings, image quality, and how quickly I can review pictures vs a much more modern (EVF is very nice, IMHO, with its ability to zoom in and have precise MF) and small sized body that can mount any lens.

Thanks for posting this thread and everyone who has/will post. I find the information and opinions very useful.



May 31, 2013 at 10:47 AM
cputeq
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


A couple of comments:

hauxon wrote:
.

Few weeks ago a friend loaned me his X-E1, 18-55/2.8-4 and 35/1.4 lenses for a Paris trip. I generally liked it and the lenses but it failed in places I've not heard much about, it didn't feel responsive. I for example usually take 3-4 shots in a row when shooting people and then quickly review the shots for look and focus and delete all but one or two. This is simply not possible with the X-E1. You will need to wait for the camera to finish writing the files to the SD card, takes 5-20 seconds and just kills
...Show more

A couple of things:

1) Make sure you're using a fast SD card. I use a 95MB/sec Sandisc. Also, if you're shooting RAW+JPEG, you'll have these slower shots.

2) If focus is tied to shutter, then you'll experience this "lag". Because to fire off the next shot, the camera attempts to focus again, and since it's using CDAF, it still needs to "rack" a bit to focus, unlike a DSLR.

To shoot like you wanted, you would want to untie focus from the shutter. Fuji X-E1 doesn't do this like I would prefer it, but still workable. Set camera to MF mode, use AE/AF lock as "single-touch" focus, then fire off shots using shutter release. Granted not as fast as DSLR but probably better response than what you describe.

Well I gave up, the camera was unable to lock focus on a (moving) subject during broad daylight standing 3-4 meters away. I haven't had to wait like that since I had the Canon 300D back in 2005 and every DSLR camera I can think of would have executed the jump scene with ease.

A couple of more things :

1) XE1 seems to respond better with a larger AF box - if you are using the smallest AF box, try using a larger box.

2) Make sure lens and camera firmwares are up to date.

I do agree though, grabbing moving targets can be difficult. Make sure you are in AF-S, which to me works better than AF-C. (same deal with OMD, which focuses faster than XE1 - moving targets are just annoying)




May 31, 2013 at 11:09 AM
dakel
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


I have the 5D2 with 17/4 T/S, 24/1.4, 24-105/4, 70-200/4, 100/2 and X-Pro1 with primes (18,35,60). I am keeping both systems - the 5D2 for landscapes and my daughters ballet, son's martial arts. X-Pro1 for everything else.

Yes the IQ is similar, but the X cameras cannot do everything the 5D2 can e.g. wide angle with shift; focussing in low light with fast moving people.

Evaluate your needs, not IQ.



May 31, 2013 at 11:23 AM
Jman13
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


The Fuji cameras are not responsive cameras. They work just fine for most shooting, but have some hitches that really prevent them from being great all-rounders. That said, I absolutely love shooting with my X-E1. It's just a fun camera to use, and the image quality I'm getting is awesome (I have the 14/2.8, 35/1.4 and 60/2.4). Still, when I'm shooting something that is a 'must have' shot, especially with people, I grab my OM-D.


May 31, 2013 at 11:31 AM
zhangyue
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


This topic has to be limit to personal preference, depend on what you do and what is important to you. As some merit of DSLR is really significant to some people but not others.

I owned NEX-7 about 6 month, and like it, but feel it can't be my main camera and give it to my father, but he just love it so much and it meets all his travel need. Now I am waiting NEX-7N for my traveling body.

So, only you will know if you can live fine without DSLR.



May 31, 2013 at 12:19 PM
CarlG
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


ceder wrote:
...it is you as a photographer that creates good images, and most often, it is not the resolution that sells images (pixel peepers seldom buy huge prints, they just pixel peep to feel good about their purchase, then move on to buy the latest and greatest, or the oldest and coolest).


+1

Ain't that the truth!!



May 31, 2013 at 12:45 PM
itai195
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


The Fuji cameras simply don't function similar to DSLRs, so expecting to grab one and use it like a DSLR is a recipe for disappointment. If you want to be able to quickly pump the shutter for a sequence of shots, the Fujis in general are pretty poor for that. Even once you figure out how to avoid refocusing each shot, they're still not as responsive as many other cameras. That said, I think the X100s is pretty responsive, so that bodes well for Fuji's future.

Short of shooting kids running around or sports, the AF even on the X-E1 meets my needs. I don't ever find myself waiting for the camera to write files to a card, and I'm not even using 95MB/s cards. You can buy the 45MB/s Sandisk extreme cards for a song these days, and they work just fine. It's shot-to-shot time, startup time, and just interface responsiveness in general where I think Fuji can make some improvements. Heck, just make the cameras not refocus between shots when I hold the shutter down halfway and I'll be happier.



May 31, 2013 at 12:52 PM
hauxon
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


Well I had a fast card, it would probably be faster shooting jpegs rather than raw.

As always you need to learn to work around the limitations of your system and they be non-significant for some and disastrous for others. I see a Fuji X camera in my bag some day but it won't replace my DSLR unless I change.



May 31, 2013 at 09:07 PM
philip_pj
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · Love Fuji X, sell 5D2/ZE's?


Everyone has a different mix of needs, the point is that DLSRs - even quite humble ones - can do it all, and the boutique cameras trade off that overall capability set for their physical attributes. That is in regard to usage.

But for image quality, they are very close. Lens quality being equal (say) if you picture camera-based image quality on a board with markings going from zero to 100 on the Y axis, there will be a distribution from very low (camera phones) to (very high) medium format digital.

Only a few people need 'very high'. Now, we each have different 'thresholds of quality' at which point we consider the camera has 'enough', 'fully acceptable' image quality...but soon everything at APS-C will satisfy almost all photographers. Then m4/3 will follow suit, Ctein makes fabulous prints from an Olympus, at 20 inches.

For those maybe 15% that might presently fall into either FF DSLR or E/X mount categories, the goalposts are changing fast. I see low end FF DSLRs co-existing with APS-C MILC cameras as kind of workhorses for macro and tele, TS applications, but for most who do not need those capabilities...the Touits and Fuji OEM lenses and all the adaptee lenses out there are compelling.

It has implications for FF mirrorless also, these will be expensive and will really need to justify their considerable cost of entry, over the E/X mount cameras, the development of which is now very rapid. They need to fully realise the potential of M class lenses in my view, as native lenses will be 'start again time' otherwise.



May 31, 2013 at 10:35 PM
1      
2
       end




FM Forums | Leica & Alternative Gear | Join Upload & Sell

1      
2
       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username       Or Reset password



This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.