Home · Register · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username  

FM Forum Rules
Wedding Resource List
  

FM Forums | Wedding Photographer | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       3       end
  

Archive 2013 · If you could do it all over again...

  
 
roland hale
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · If you could do it all over again...


What's the #1 thing you would do or not do in starting up your business? Did you make any particularly good/bad initial decisions that effected your business?

I'm officially "opening shop" as a wedding photography LLC in Washington state this July, and my last two years have been spent saving and learning as best I can from the internet and colleagues. I've been planning for quite a while and feel like I have a good idea of what to expect and how to put my best foot forward.

That said, hindsight is 20-20, and I'm sure everyone here has something worth sharing. So, what would you "do over?"



May 17, 2013 at 11:03 AM
Chris Fawkes
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · If you could do it all over again...


I would not do both portrait and weddings, just one or the other.

I would have had a specific time frame set for working in a partnership. Set an end date.



May 17, 2013 at 11:07 AM
Prettym1k3
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · If you could do it all over again...


I could contact all local authorities and see what needs to be paid.

Last summer I contacted the Board of Equalization for the State of California. Remember: I went to them. They didn't find me. They forced me to pay backed sales tax on two years of sales, interest and penalties. I disputed the charges, and all they did was waive the penalties.

I am honest to a fault. I claim any dime I make, including tips. And then this happens. I got totally punished by "The Man" for doing the right thing.

Also, carry insurance. Don't screw around with that.



May 17, 2013 at 11:29 AM
Brian Virts
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · If you could do it all over again...


I wish I would have listened to my inner voice years ago with my fascination for light. Picking up a camera a few years ago at 40 isn't the end of the world, but let's just say I'm not as energetic as I once was.


May 17, 2013 at 12:29 PM
eephoto
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · If you could do it all over again...


Brian Virts wrote:
I wish I would have listened to my inner voice years ago with my fascination for light. Picking up a camera a few years ago at 40 isn't the end of the world, but let's just say I'm not as energetic as I once was.



Ditto...at 40 you start to feel like you're in a race...I guess you are more aware of time fading at that age. I look into the future and think will I still be able to do this at 50? So I wish I had gone to school for photography (when my parents were pushing me to do it!) But maybe that was the problem I was inadvertently rebelling. Instead I went to school for accounting! How different!?!?!

Anyways, don't think you need to be a photography student to succeed in the least, but what I'm saying is I wish I had followed my gut and intuition more.



May 17, 2013 at 12:39 PM
lilyphoto
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · If you could do it all over again...


I think the best decision I've made is that I have never bought anything I couldn't pay for in full for my business. There was no "Oh I'll buy this 3k camera now and pay it off with the balances from the upcoming weddings!". If I don't have all of the money in the bank, I don't buy it.




May 17, 2013 at 01:40 PM
D. Diggler
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · If you could do it all over again...


Prettym1k3 wrote:
They forced me to pay backed sales tax on two years of sales, interest and penalties. I disputed the charges


Why weren't you paying the sales tax in the first place?



May 17, 2013 at 01:47 PM
DigMeTX
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · If you could do it all over again...


Prettym1k3 wrote:
Last summer I contacted the Board of Equalization for the State of California. Remember: I went to them. They didn't find me. They forced me to pay backed sales tax on two years of sales, interest and penalties. I disputed the charges, and all they did was waive the penalties.


So were you not reporting sales taxes at all before that?

brad



May 17, 2013 at 01:47 PM
sboerup
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · If you could do it all over again...


I'd hire a bookkeeper to manage my accounting on a semi-weekly basis. While I do a good job, I'd rather have someone else managing tax payments, keeping track of expense receipts, managing my equipment schedule for insurance and depreciation purposes. My accountant handles all the heavy federal/state tax stuff, but someone to make it cleaner would be super helpful for me. It would also keep my reports more accurate, giving me better financial information about my business.

Oh, and be better at vendor networking.

More importantly, should have gone to school for computer programming and I would have been wildly more financially successful with apps



May 17, 2013 at 03:01 PM
roland hale
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · If you could do it all over again...


Thanks for all the input guys!


May 17, 2013 at 06:59 PM
roland hale
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · If you could do it all over again...


lilyphoto wrote:
I think the best decision I've made is that I have never bought anything I couldn't pay for in full for my business. There was no "Oh I'll buy this 3k camera now and pay it off with the balances from the upcoming weddings!". If I don't have all of the money in the bank, I don't buy it.



Great advice! I'm from the same school of thought, and while it's a hefty price (especially starting out) I've saved for it and wouldn't do it any other way.



May 17, 2013 at 08:50 PM
scottam10
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · If you could do it all over again...


Invest in your website and blog including SEO (Search Engine Optimisation), and make sure it loads quickly and clearly on all platforms (PC, Mac, Tablet, Smartphone)

- it's a very important marketing tool



May 17, 2013 at 09:36 PM
morganb4
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · If you could do it all over again...


I would not have started it at all.

Seriously.

roland hale wrote:
What's the #1 thing you would do or not do in starting up your business? Did you make any particularly good/bad initial decisions that effected your business?

I'm officially "opening shop" as a wedding photography LLC in Washington state this July, and my last two years have been spent saving and learning as best I can from the internet and colleagues. I've been planning for quite a while and feel like I have a good idea of what to expect and how to put my best foot forward.

That said, hindsight is 20-20, and I'm sure everyone here has
...Show more



May 18, 2013 at 01:55 AM
CW100
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · If you could do it all over again...




^^ serious advice

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/24/fashion/weddings/for-wedding-photography-competition-from-amateurs.html

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/30/business/media/30photogs.html?pagewanted=all



May 18, 2013 at 06:10 AM
cineski
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · If you could do it all over again...


Roland, I just checked out your work. I absolutely love your branding and the locations you shoot in. Kudos for speaking a very specific voice.

That said, it's no secret the photo industry is in big trouble and many are feeling the heat and their advice reflects that. Even in your locale I've seen some very talented photographers and business people having to lower their pricing because competition is growing in all markets. Considering what I've been witnessing over the past 4 years, this trend isn't stopping. I just found out an extremely busy (and big photographer) in LA is booking jobs for $1500. Another confessed to making half what they used to. I was flabbergasted but the trend is still moving downward. But the LA economy is literally an incredible pile of poo to behold so different markets will obviously be different. There are photographers who happen to have been in the right place at the right time and are rocking it (even in Cali) but the reality is those are a very few percentage. You may become one

That said, and I have no idea what you're currently doing for work, but my advice for you is to not put all your eggs in one basket until you get busy enough with photography that you absolutely must not do anything else. I say this because of many reasons but as someone who reads a lot about the health of the economy, 2014 is looking especially worrisome and it's just good to be prepared in life. When you progress through life, you realize quickly that $2000 for complete wedding coverage with an album like you're offering won't cut it running a business and you'll eventually realize just how important being a responsible adult with retirement plans and health care is. I remember when I booked my first jobs in that range for just photo and a DVD as a beginner....I was ecstatic. Now I look at those budgets going riiiiiight, that doesn't pay for what needs to be paid for by any stretch of the imagination. If you did 30 weddings a year (when you're in your mid 30's you'll also realize just how much 30 weddings a year starts to hurt ) you're looking at $60K gross which depending on your gear habits and local taxes you'll probably end up with half if you're lucky. That's not a lot of money in the real world unless you're happy living in an apartment eating ramen. The catch 22 with this is you also realize that your referral base is only as good as what your past clients spent because people with money generally hang out with people who have money and just about the time you establish yourself there's a whole slew of new photographers who are underbidding the past underbidders. Try to spend cash on all gear and avoid debt at all costs (personal experience speaking here). This will not be possible at all times but try. Buying used is especially good for saving money. Moments caught are more powerful than what you catch it with, but a camera that won't focus properly in all light can miss moments and poor gear can dictate your style. Getting published on blogs and SEO are important but I'd probably say getting on blogs is way more important. For full day coverage, DVD and an album, there's people out there willing to spend $5-6000 and well beyond that. Why not go after those people from the get-go?

Edited on May 18, 2013 at 11:10 AM · View previous versions



May 18, 2013 at 11:05 AM
NYstyles
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · If you could do it all over again...


I would of started a blog earlier than I did. I also would of avoided some of these "for exposure" projects... Lesson learned.

I also realized how back stabbing client poaching copy catting vultures some photographers are in my community. Not like these kinds of people dont exist in all industries but I never encountered so many till this. It made me become very selective on what i talk about or show.



May 18, 2013 at 11:07 AM
TRReichman
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · If you could do it all over again...


I definitely would have taken that government job I turned down....

- trr



May 18, 2013 at 11:30 AM
dmacmillan
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · If you could do it all over again...


TRReichman wrote:
I definitely would have taken that government job I turned down....

- trr

I know this is half in jest, but things aren't so rosy in the civilian market right now. I work with 6 civilians who are term employees. They are not full fledged civilians yet. Downsizing the DoD and sequestration has them very nervous now.

Things aren't better in the defense contracting realm either. Quotas and minority set asides has decimated mid sized contractors. I know of one company whose employment at an Air Force base went from 150 to 18 in three years. Some of the employees were hired by the contract winners, but with substantially lower pay and benefits. Now there's very little pay differential between a contractor and a civilian.

Anyway, back to the OP. What I would have done is thought 20 or 30 years in the future, which I finally did. I wanted to send my boys to college and I wanted to be able to save for retirement. I know of few photographers who are making a decent living wage, much less being able to save for the future.

Look at the industry indicators. Are they pointing towards growth, decline or stasis? How much capital will your startup cost? What rate of return do you expect? What rate of return is the industry standard? What rate of return can you get be putting that money elsewhere?

PS - I looked at your link. The heading said "engagement", but I was nine photos in before I saw the first human.



May 18, 2013 at 12:10 PM
D. Diggler
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · If you could do it all over again...


NYstyles wrote:

realized how back stabbing client poaching copy catting vultures some photographers are in my community ... It made me become very selective on what i talk about or show.


For whatever reason, I have found that I don't like having my work copied [] and this has led me to not displaying on the internet some of my more favorite or unique images.



May 18, 2013 at 01:45 PM
D. Diggler
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · If you could do it all over again...


cineski wrote:
it's no secret the photo industry is in big trouble and many are feeling the heat and their advice reflects that. Even in your locale I've seen some very talented photographers and business people having to lower their pricing because competition is growing in all markets. Considering what I've been witnessing over the past 4 years, this trend isn't stopping. I just found out an extremely busy (and big photographer) in LA is booking jobs for $1500. Another confessed to making half what they used to. I was flabbergasted but the trend is still moving downward.


Everyone in my area has had to lower prices considerably since the Great Recession started. Occasionally I work with some of the more popular photogs and I've noticed that in the last few years they're just not as happy as they used to be. They used to smile when they were out working; not anymore. And they've cut back on the value of gear: used to work with full-frame cameras but now using croppers. I've seen some of the delivered images and it seems like not much work has been put into the images, not even basic brightness adjustments.



May 18, 2013 at 01:59 PM
1
       2       3       end




FM Forums | Wedding Photographer | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       3       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username       Or Reset password



This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply.