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Archive 2013 · 5D classic, please help me decide.
  
 
gipper53
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p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


veroman wrote:
Hello Matt. Ralph's post (above) speaks from experience and wisdom. I hope you've listened to him and taken his thoughts to heart.

I, too, have owned the 5D Classic from the earliest days of its release. I've also owned the 10D, 1Ds, 1Ds Mark II, 1Dx, 5D Mark II, 30D, 40D, xsi and xti.

And yet, after all these years, it's the 5D Classic that I once again brought to a photo assignment yesterday and came home with over 300 gorgeous images of a large home/estate in the affluent community of Spring Lake, NJ. In other words, I no longer own and
...Show more

Gotta say I totally agree. I have a 5D and a 5D2, and the "old" model still gets plenty of mileage. Yes it lacks the bells and whistles some claim are "absolute necessities", but in a strange way I find the simplistic nature of this camera part of the enjoyment. I just shut-up-and-shoot when I have the 5D, and it rewards me with stellar images. In the end, that's all that counts.

Maybe I got a lucky sample, but my 5D focuses fine with all my lenses, rarely has dust on the sensor, and ACR 7 has given new life to the camera's RAW output. Life is good



May 16, 2013 at 03:39 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


veroman wrote:
Hello Matt. Ralph's post (above) speaks from experience and wisdom. I hope you've listened to him and taken his thoughts to heart.

Thank you Steve, you obviously came to appreciate the 5D too I really recognise lots of what you say and totally agree.

There is just this tiny part of your post that seems very interesting, if not a bit peculiar:

veroman wrote:
I've also owned the ...1Dx, ... .
... I no longer own and use the ... 1Dx, ... The 5D Classic is all the camera I need for just about anything...
- Steve

What exactly did you mean by 1Dx?



May 16, 2013 at 05:13 AM
Chris Fawkes
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p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


Don't touch the 5d11. The low light capabilities are offset by the horrible banding making enlarging images out of the question.

Get the original 5d or save and get a 6d. The latter can be had for around $1600



May 16, 2013 at 06:13 AM
justruss
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p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


Another way to look at it is this:

Maybe the 5D has depreciated so far that over the summer months it's not going to depreciate in absolute terms as much as the 5D2 is likely to depreciate. (By the way, I don't know if this is the case, but as a potential buyer you'd be wise to look into it.)

That would mean that buying a 5D now, since that's all you can afford, will let you shoot with the camera all summer. Then you can sell it for a small loss ($50/$100) and buy a 5D2. You'll either lose $50/$100 if the 5D2 used prices don't change (I don't expect them to go up, the 6D is putting downward pressure there), break even, or even make a profit when considering the opportunity costs (say, if the used price of a 5D2 drops more, in absolute terms, than the used value of the 5D you go to sell).

The major caveats are if you lose/break the 5D, have to put any costs in if a shutter fails, etc. Though those are probably safe risks to take on if you only plan to keep it for 3 to 5 months.

You can have your cake and eat it too, it seems. Both cameras are a stunning value.

As for IQ/low light, the 5D outclasses the 7d completely. The 7D is a fine camera, but the 5D is simply better when it comes to IQ. The 7D wins in AF. The 5D2 has all the advantages, but even more: better low light as a result of MP + sensor/electronics/processing improvements, video, AF MA, LCD. Autofocus using centerpoint is fine for the vast majority of folks, even those shooting weddings, kids, and such. I wouldn't use a 5D2 for sports; but I would use a 5d3.




May 16, 2013 at 07:07 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


Chris Fawkes wrote:
Don't touch the 5d11. The low light capabilities are offset by the horrible banding making enlarging images out of the question.

Get the original 5d or save and get a 6d. The latter can be had for around $1600


Again, this all depends on your requirements. I discovered long ago that my eye is much more demanding than the eye of my client. My clients care for the following, in the order given:
1. They look good in the picture, meaning relaxed, or happy, or both
2. Images are sharp
3. Lighting is natural and pleasant
4. Composition, clients only notice when it is bad
5. Noise, banding and other technical imperfections
You'd be surprised how little the average client cares for no. 5. Of course there is a borderline where imperfections should not be too obvious. But what's borderline for a client looks bad for me. So bad that previously I would have run the store and get the latest and greatest. But from a business point of view that is not as necessary as the photographer wishes to believe. The last time I ran to the store like that was 7 years ago when I bought my 5Dclassic. I was as happy as a kid with sweets. I realised that with the 5Dclassic I could make everybody happy. Then of course I found out my shots didn't improve and I needed to learn more about lighting, how to interact with my subjects and how to survive in the business. I still think that my 5D gives me room to learn. It's not limiting me in 98% of my assignments:
- portraits
- events
- weddings
- theatre
- architecture
- product
It's only the weddings and the events that sometimes make me think I "need" another camera. But even with my 5Dclassic and 5DmkII I am doing fine.

I would advise no one to stay away from the 5DmkII, for reasons of noise or banding. I am convinced there's only a tiny group of photographers that really need to stretch to ISO6400 and above and shoot for big prints. Everyone else will do just fine with a mkII or a classic, provided they know their cameras well and are familiar with good PP techniques.

The only reason I would eventually get a 5DmkIII or IV is AF. Both of my cameras do fine 99% of the time, but sometimes in dark conditions I get some shots where AF just missed and the images are unusable. If ever I get a 50L for weddings I will get a 5DmkIII too. Until then, my cameras and lenses are unbeatable and I make money with them.

All of this is, as stated, my personal findings and preference. Your experience and needs may well be different.

Stay good,

Ralph



May 16, 2013 at 08:05 AM
veroman
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p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


rabbitmountain wrote:
... What exactly did you mean by 1Dx?


What exactly do you mean with your question? Not sure I understand.
- Steve



May 16, 2013 at 08:08 AM
sgraafmans
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p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


I own both 5Dc & 7D, I still think the 5D out performs the 7D in image quality. I bought the 5D new in 2006 & despite all the upgrades & functions of the latest 5D 111, when it comes to actual image quality I realy dont know if there is any differances apart from file size. 5Dc was built ahead of its time & I have no hesitation in useing it with any type of photoshoot.


May 16, 2013 at 08:38 AM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


veroman wrote:
What exactly do you mean with your question? Not sure I understand.
- Steve


Hi Steve,
It just seemed a bit strange to me that you actually bought a 1Dx, being the current top of the line 6000+ $$$ flagship camera and sold it because you feel best shooting a 5Dclassic. Not that there is anything wrong with shooting a 5Dclassic, but I wonder why you bought a 1Dx and sold it again. There must have been a reason to buy one and on top of that you probably lost hundreds of dollars in the Buy and Sell.

Stay good,

Ralph



May 16, 2013 at 10:23 AM
pKai
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p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


I was going to tell you to save up for the 5D2 until I read the financial analisys a few posts up by justruss. What he says makes perfect sense since you cant afford the 5D2 right now anyways and the loss, if any, is likely to be minimal or non-existent if you buy the 5DC right.

I came from the same 2 bodies as you and did the same thing several years ago... At that time , the 5D2 was current and out of my reach at $2500. I got a 5DC and was happy until I traded up for a 5D2 last summer..... The 5DC is a fine camera and the 5D2 is better..... IOW, if you like the 5DC and find it useful, the 5DII will be that much more so.

Compared to the 7d, the 5DC or II blow it away for any subject that does not move much. The more the subject moves, the more the 7D shoots it better..... this trend continues until the 5DC/2 becomes useless... i.e. birds in flight. Speed-wise, I don't think the 5D2 is any better than the 5DC... the '2' improves in other areas such as pixel density, high ISO, video, LCD, etc....

I use both the 7D and 5D2 extensively for what they each are good at. The 20D even sees the light every now and then -- don't get rid of it, its not worth it.

Edited on May 16, 2013 at 02:00 PM · View previous versions



May 16, 2013 at 01:54 PM
veroman
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p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


rabbitmountain wrote:
Hi Steve,
It just seemed a bit strange to me that you actually bought a 1Dx, being the current top of the line 6000+ $$$ flagship camera and sold it because you feel best shooting a 5Dclassic. Not that there is anything wrong with shooting a 5Dclassic, but I wonder why you bought a 1Dx and sold it again. There must have been a reason to buy one and on top of that you probably lost hundreds of dollars in the Buy and Sell.


I sold my 1Ds (original), 1Ds II and also a pristine 1D Mark II. At the time, I still wanted to have a pro body and decided that the 1Dx gives me the best of all worlds ... which is its reason for being.

It took only a couple of weeks or so before I decided it was more camera than I actually needed for my pro work or any other uses. I don't need or want big, heavy cameras anymore and, in prints up to 16" X 20," it's near impossible to tell which camera took the shot. I'm not saying there aren't advantages to the 1Dx. Of course there are. But a major IQ advantage isn't one of them.

The 5D, 40D and my lightweight 500D/t1i (which has no AA filter; I had it removed) are all I need.

- Steve



May 16, 2013 at 01:57 PM
 

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veroman
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p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


pKai wrote:
... Compared to the 7d, the 5DC or II blow it away for any subject that does not move. The 7D rules for anything that moves.

Now that pretty much sums it up nicely.
- Steve



May 16, 2013 at 01:59 PM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


veroman wrote:
I sold my 1Ds (original), 1Ds II and also a pristine 1D Mark II. At the time, I still wanted to have a pro body and decided that the 1Dx gives me the best of all worlds ... which is its reason for being.

It took only a couple of weeks or so before I decided it was more camera than I actually needed for my pro work or any other uses. I don't need or want big, heavy cameras anymore and, in prints up to 16" X 20," it's near impossible to tell which camera took the shot. I'm not
...Show more

Well that makes sense, thanks for the explanation. I love it when someone decides to use older gear and say they don't need the latest and greatest. Most talk on the forums is quite the opposite. Great choices by the way a 5D and a 40D. I had that combo for a while and really liked to have the best of both worlds. When I started doing more events and theatre (dark conditions) I sold the 40D and picked up a 5DmkII. It was a toss between that and a 5D, but eventually having at least one camera with Live View won the battle in my head. As far as IQ goes, the 5DmkII is more than i will ever need.

Good luck!

Stay good,

Ralph



May 16, 2013 at 04:26 PM
outlawyer
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p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


From a strict IQ perspective, the only difference I see in normal shooting (low ISO, no focus problems) between 5Dc and 6D is that the latter's files can be printed larger. 5Dc has stellar IQ, and used ones generally seem to be in excellent shape.
One of photography's best buys now.



May 16, 2013 at 04:36 PM
safcraft
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p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


You already have tons of responses suporting the 5D purchase. Just do it

I will say that you have a magic lens to partner the 5D and you still dont know it (because you only use crop cameras) - the MDP 80-200L !!

That lens is just MAGIC with FF. I will never part with mine, even if it breaks down.



May 16, 2013 at 04:43 PM
rabbitmountain
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p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


Before you decide on a 5D of your liking, I can recommend testing your preferred lenses for AF accuracy, especially if it's difficult to have them calibrated by Canon. I once had a 135L that was so far off that I hardly used it until I had it calibrated. Sometimes you're lucky and sometimes you're not.


May 16, 2013 at 06:05 PM
cputeq
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p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


I've owned all three versions of the 5D, rockin' the 5D3 right now.

5Dc is an excellent camera, *especially* for the price. It's a no-frills, very nice image-making device.

If you get one - A) Don't freak out when you take your first few shots and review on the rear LCD and think everything is wrong - it's not, the rear LCD sucks. Use it for histogram or composition review only.

B) Revel in the excellent quality and sharpness of the files (assuming good glass) - I believe (IIRC) it has a fairly weak AA filter, so files can pop rather easily.

Also, ISo 3200, even though it's a boost from the camera (native stops at 1600), still looks good, better than the 7D for sure at all ISOs (and yes I've owned the 7d twice also).


At today's prices it's almost a no-brainer unless you seriously need video, live view or > ~13MP, or fast FPS. I also used three lenses on mine and never needed MA, but maybe I got lucky (24-105, 85/1.8, 70-200 mkii)




May 16, 2013 at 06:43 PM
M Lucca
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p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


5dc is a wonderful camera. I love the simplicity and quality images it provides. With the current used prices it is hard to ignore this camera if you are into photography (vs. gadget collector). I love the pleasing DoF when partnered with a quality prime. It is a slow camera by today's standards.

Having said that, the 7d is far more versatile of a camera for you based on your initial post. Robust AF. Ergonomics is similar to the 5d3. The 7d will provide more photography options as it reacts well with fast moving subjects. HDSLR might come in handy too should you want to record your kids singing or doing something. Other things include flash commander via pop up adds new dimensions to your photography.

Get the 5dc if and only if you never stray out of the center point AF and that you only shoot mostly static objects. Everything else the 7d.

IQ is nothing if it's not in focused.



May 17, 2013 at 04:29 AM
Johnny B Goode
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p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


Kids sports, portrait photography, occasional macro. I'd say go for it. The AF isn't too terrible, at least mine works excellent with the 135L.

Lens results may vary (and I never shoot BIF) but the AF did okay here

IMG_4172 copy by Pete the Irish Guy, on Flickr

And here:


IMG_0146 by Pete the Irish Guy, on Flickr

I'm not going to suggest it hits 100% of the time just remind that it's not something to be scared of.


I'm considering upgrading to the 6D as It seems to have everything I want at the moment. Although I may wait till the 6Dii is released. If I didn't own one I'd pick a good one up at a great price and see what all the fuss is about.



May 17, 2013 at 02:14 PM
markshelby
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p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


Image quality is IMO better than the crop bodies. Price is unbeatable. (And, assuming you don't break it, you won't lose much on a purchase and subsequent sale.)

One thing to note, however: not only is the AF not as accurate as 7D etc., but it's also slower and more prone to hunting than modern cameras. Additionally, you will find the shooting speed to be slower, and that the buffer fills up fast and takes a loooooong time to clear (even compared to other older bodies like the 20D).

So get the 5Dc and see how you like it, and then go from there.



May 17, 2013 at 11:09 PM
Johnny B Goode
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p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · 5D classic, please help me decide.


markshelby wrote:
Image quality is IMO better than the crop bodies. Price is unbeatable. (And, assuming you don't break it, you won't lose much on a purchase and subsequent sale.)

One thing to note, however: not only is the AF not as accurate as 7D etc., but it's also slower and more prone to hunting than modern cameras. Additionally, you will find the shooting speed to be slower, and that the buffer fills up fast and takes a loooooong time to clear (even compared to other older bodies like the 20D).

So get the 5Dc and see how you like it, and then
...Show more

Never once filled the buffer on my 5D. If you spray and pray, sure, though It doesn't shoot fast enough. Usually after 3-4 frames the action already gone lol. It's not a perfect camera but for what the OP was needing it seems ideal.



May 17, 2013 at 11:44 PM
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