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Archive 2013 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement
  
 
bigbluebear
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Hello,

I was curious what causes a mirror box to fail. Is it high actuations, which is the same for a shutter replacement? I'm just trying to understand if there is a relationship between the two. For example, does a mirror box replacement come with a new shutter?






Feb 26, 2013 at 10:12 PM
Gochugogi
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


An old skool tech might troubleshoot and replace failed items at the component level. However it is faster and more cost effective for them to just remove and replace the mirror box rather than fix the worn wee parts.


Feb 26, 2013 at 10:22 PM
PaulB
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Gochugogi wrote:
An old skool tech might troubleshoot and replace failed items at the component level. However it is faster and more cost effective for them to just remove and replace the mirror box rather than fix the worn wee parts.


You don't seem to grasp the difference between the two assemblies.
The shutter assembly is just that - nothing else.
The mirror box not only has the shutter assembly fitted into it but also contains all the mirror linkages, the AF system and the electronics to control the shutter/mirror/AF.

The mirror box really is the heart of the camera and costs something like three times that of a simple shutter replacement, the last I heard.
It is in the electronics of the mirror box that the camera actuations are stored - note, not shutter actuations - replacing a shutter will not reset the actuations to 0, but replacing the mirror box will.



Feb 27, 2013 at 11:17 AM
jcolwell
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


I think Peter (Gochugogi) does grok.


Feb 27, 2013 at 11:35 AM
jcolwell
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


P.S. Just after posting the above comment, I asked CPS Canada the following question.

"I have a quick technical question. When the shutter fails for some reason, is it normal practice to replace the mirror box assembly, which includes the shutter and other items, or to replace just the shutter assembly?"

The CPS Canada reply,

"This is depending on the model.".

They also note,

"However, repairs are flat rate and if required they would replace what is necessary.".

So, for some camera models, they normally replace the whole mirror box assembly in order to repair a shutter, despite it's greater complexity and higher cost. For other camera models, they don't necessarily do this. If you have CPS Canada membership, it doesn't matter.



Feb 27, 2013 at 02:32 PM
Gochugogi
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


PaulB wrote:
You don't seem to grasp the difference between the two assemblies.
The shutter assembly is just that - nothing else.
The mirror box not only has the shutter assembly fitted into it but also contains all the mirror linkages, the AF system and the electronics to control the shutter/mirror/AF.

The mirror box really is the heart of the camera and costs something like three times that of a simple shutter replacement, the last I heard.
It is in the electronics of the mirror box that the camera actuations are stored - note, not shutter actuations - replacing a shutter will not reset the actuations
...Show more

Actually you didn't grasp the gist of my prose. I don't doubt they could merely replace the shutter but if their service guide says replace the works, that is what they do. And, obviously, the more stuff they can remove and replace, the more money they collect. You are free to contract a private tech to do the job as you like. Some years ago I replaced a gummed up shutter assembly in an old EOS 10S and, while it was my first go at it, it was a fairly easy job and worked perfectly. It took me a couple hours mainly because I labeled everything and made drawings so I'd remember how to reassemble it.



Feb 27, 2013 at 09:22 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Gochugogi wrote:
...And, obviously, the more stuff they can remove and replace, the more money they collect.


Not at CPS Canada - "flat rate".




Feb 27, 2013 at 09:27 PM
bigbluebear
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Thanks everyone. I was asking since there is a 1Ds3 that just had it's mirror box replaced last year and a shutter replaced about three years ago.

It sounds like the mirror box replacement also includes a new shutter? This is new info to me.

I'm still unclear on the two but it sounds like the shutter is one component of the mirror box.



Feb 27, 2013 at 11:00 PM
 

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Gochugogi
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


jcolwell wrote:
Not at CPS Canada - "flat rate".



Well then, I'd let them replace all the goodies and celebrate the camera surgery with a couple cold ones!



Feb 27, 2013 at 11:01 PM
PaulB
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Gochugogi wrote:
Actually you didn't grasp the gist of my prose. I don't doubt they could merely replace the shutter but if their service guide says replace the works, that is what they do. And, obviously, the more stuff they can remove and replace, the more money they collect. You are free to contract a private tech to do the job as you like. Some years ago I replaced a gummed up shutter assembly in an old EOS 10S and, while it was my first go at it, it was a fairly easy job and worked perfectly. It took me a couple
...Show more

I'm afraid the soaring gist of your prose must have passed right over me.................

I have never had this 'escalation' of unnecessary repairs from Canon UK nor I have ever heard of anyone else who has either. Shutter failed = shutter replaced (and a new mirror which I didn't ask for and was not charged for either); AF motor failed = AF motor replaced etc.etc.; nothing more than that.

You must have been at the cynical drinks again.



Feb 27, 2013 at 11:07 PM
bigbluebear
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Hi Paul,

This sounds like a similar situation then. The mirror box was replaced for free due to an ERR99.



Feb 27, 2013 at 11:09 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Gochugogi wrote:
Well then, I'd let them replace all the goodies and celebrate the camera surgery with a couple cold ones!


I always celebrate the "replace ... the goodies" part with at least a couple of cold ones, but I don't get to pick which goodies they replace. I celebrate the result.



Feb 27, 2013 at 11:27 PM
bigbluebear
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


Look at the bright side. At least u get to pick the cold ones.


Feb 27, 2013 at 11:28 PM
PM01
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


The mirror box has all of the movements, af mirror, primary mirror, and most importantly, the "charge" motor. The charge motor is what primes the mirror into the flipped position. If the motor is faulty, this can generate a 99 error.

Shutter assembly is just that. Just the shutter. It's not sold as part of the mirror box assembly.



Feb 28, 2013 at 04:04 AM
Gochugogi
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


PaulB wrote:
I'm afraid the soaring gist of your prose must have passed right over me.................

I have never had this 'escalation' of unnecessary repairs from Canon UK nor I have ever heard of anyone else who has either. Shutter failed = shutter replaced (and a new mirror which I didn't ask for and was not charged for either); AF motor failed = AF motor replaced etc.etc.; nothing more than that.

You must have been at the cynical drinks again.


Maybe I confused Canon Service with automotive and medical services...



Feb 28, 2013 at 06:53 PM
bigbluebear
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Mirror box vs shutter replacement


PM01 wrote:
The mirror box has all of the movements, af mirror, primary mirror, and most importantly, the "charge" motor. The charge motor is what primes the mirror into the flipped position. If the motor is faulty, this can generate a 99 error.

Shutter assembly is just that. Just the shutter. It's not sold as part of the mirror box assembly.



Thanks PM01 for clarifying. It looks like I wasn't the only one that was confused about these two parts.



Feb 28, 2013 at 08:58 PM





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