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Archive 2013 · Canon 135L question
  
 
gwei8
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p.1 #1 · Canon 135L question


Hi all,

I have a question regarding my new Canon 135L (on 5D2) that I just received yesterday. I am doing some random test shots and the lens is sharp even at f2 (without filter). I then add a Hoya Pro 1 Digital Protective filter on it, and the same shot at f2 becomes a little "hazy" feel... I would need to stop down to around f4 with filter on to get the same sharp results as f2 without filter.... is this normal since I never really used a filter on my lenses before.

Thanks for the help.



Jan 09, 2013 at 04:52 PM
goosemang
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p.1 #2 · Canon 135L question


i will tell you that i had to ditch the filter on my 135L for the same reason. and i'm talking a b&w HMC, which have never given me issues on any other lens. but the 135L wasn't having it, so i eventually ditched it. at least it's got that nice deep hood to protect the front


Jan 09, 2013 at 05:01 PM
goosemang
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p.1 #3 · Canon 135L question


and i'm not anti-filter... i use them for protection when i feel it's worth it and i can get away with it. but i couldn't get away with it on the 135, imo


Jan 09, 2013 at 05:05 PM
vsg28
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p.1 #4 · Canon 135L question


ya, the 135 L and 100-400 L are 2 lenses I can think of which do not like filters.


Jan 09, 2013 at 05:10 PM
gwei8
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p.1 #5 · Canon 135L question


Thanks all for confirming this....


Jan 09, 2013 at 05:13 PM
gwei8
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p.1 #6 · Canon 135L question


http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/post/13785369

Found this on the web... he is using a super cheap Tiffen filter on Canon 135L...
My results with filter is NOT even half as bad... but still significant diff. between with and without filter. I guess this is one lens that I need to go commando....



Jan 09, 2013 at 06:40 PM
OntheRez
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p.1 #7 · Canon 135L question


gwei8 wrote:
Hi all,

I have a question regarding my new Canon 135L (on 5D2) that I just received yesterday. I am doing some random test shots and the lens is sharp even at f2 (without filter). I then add a Hoya Pro 1 Digital Protective filter on it, and the same shot at f2 becomes a little "hazy" feel... I would need to stop down to around f4 with filter on to get the same sharp results as f2 without filter.... is this normal since I never really used a filter on my lenses before.

Thanks for the help.


This will generate opposition/scorn/argument, but Why would you put a $40? piece of glass in front of a $1200 collection of superb lenses? Personally, I can't find any reason for putting a "protective filter" on any lens.

As noted above YMMV.

Robert



Jan 09, 2013 at 06:49 PM
Paul Mo
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p.1 #8 · Canon 135L question


Check out my flickr set 'Thai Culture', there you'll see 135 f2L shots with a filter. Oh, the haze!!! The softness!!!


Jan 09, 2013 at 07:05 PM
irieweasel
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p.1 #9 · Canon 135L question


I don't currently have a 135L in my bag, but have had two in the past. I always kept filters (B+W MRC UV) on them and never noticed a sharpness problem. Does that same filter produce the same problems on other 72mm lenses?

Despite the never-ending debate on the merits of shooting "naked" or not, there should be no reason a filter makes an individual lens perform poorly and not others.



Jan 09, 2013 at 07:43 PM
gwei8
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p.1 #10 · Canon 135L question


I never noticed that problem on my 35L (which uses same filter), but then I never shot it without filter before. As goosemang and vsg28 confirmed, maybe some lenses just don't like filters...

Edited on Jan 09, 2013 at 08:48 PM · View previous versions



Jan 09, 2013 at 07:53 PM
 

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RedRinger
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p.1 #11 · Canon 135L question


I use the same filter on my 135L and have not noticed any issue. I cannot explain why your lens and some others' don't like it.

I had a huge softness issue with a cheap CP filter on my 70-200L many years back and it took me a lot of pain to isolate the cause. With a better filter, the problem went away.



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:00 PM
goosemang
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p.1 #12 · Canon 135L question


i have no idea why this lens wouldn't be good w/ a filter and others are no problem.

i really did notice it though, which is why i stopped using it. could have just been the filter. but i had that filter on a 20mm previously without any ill effects. (although it's a completely different type of lens... so who knows.)

another lens i ditched the filter on is the canon 50mm f1.4. it absolutely screwed with the accuracy of my AF. at first i upgraded the filter on it, thinking it was just not good enough, but AF and servo were still notably better with nothing at all. so i stripped it down. it helped that i saw some video on youtube of someone smashing the front element of a canon 50 with a hammer with very little damage... convinced me i might not need to be all that concerned about protecting it!



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:11 PM
dhphoto
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p.1 #13 · Canon 135L question


I have no interest in getting into a slanging match over whether or not to use a filter, that is up to individual users, but you should be in no doubt, putting a layer of glass, however high quality in front of a lens will have some effect on the optical properties of that lens.

No filter is 100% clean, dust free, flat or clear.

The amount of image degredation will depend on the optics of the lens, the position and type of light, the focusing distance and the coating on both the lens and the filter.

Sometimes this may show up, sometimes not. But there is a difference.



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:20 PM
WilliamFinley
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p.1 #14 · Canon 135L question


I'm not going to spend all that money on an expensive piece of equipment, and then put a cheap piece of glass in front of it. If you want an alternative way to protect your front element, use your lens hood.

Just a thought, Bill

Edited on Jan 10, 2013 at 01:40 AM · View previous versions



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:23 PM
skibum5
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p.1 #15 · Canon 135L question


irieweasel wrote:
I don't currently have a 135L in my bag, but have had two in the past. I always kept filters (B+W MRC UV) on them and never noticed a sharpness problem. Does that same filter produce the same problems on other 72mm lenses?

Despite the never-ending debate on the merits of shooting "naked" or not, there should be no reason a filter makes an individual lens perform poorly and not others.


+1 I don't recall seeing any problems with a filter on mine either (B+W MRC) at least so long as not shooting into or near into the sun. I've even posted a few photos in the past where I was like wow look the colors, the contrast!!!! and it had a filter on it when they were taken.

I guess it depends.



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:24 PM
skibum5
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p.1 #16 · Canon 135L question


WilliamFinley wrote:
I'm not going to spend all that money on an expensive pieced of equipment, and then put a cheap piece of glass in front of it. If you want an alternative way to protect your front element, use your lens hood.

Just a thought, Bill


You never know though.

I was once filming a post team victory street celebration. Next thing you know bonfires all over. Next thing you know I get back that night and find that apparently tiny embers permanently burned scorch marks onto the filter all over. I'd hate to have had that have been the front element (and on the lens used that time the hood was very shallow and for sure would not have blocked any of the ember bits).

And if grit is whipping around I'd prefer a filter on too.



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:27 PM
johnsarra
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p.1 #17 · Canon 135L question


Check out my flickr set 'Thai Culture', there you'll see 135 f2L shots with a filter. Oh, the haze!!! The softness!!!

the OOF areas in some of these images are particularly soft



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:31 PM
gwei8
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p.1 #18 · Canon 135L question


dhphoto wrote:
I have no interest in getting into a slanging match over whether or not to use a filter, that is up to individual users, but you should be in no doubt, putting a layer of glass, however high quality in front of a lens will have some effect on the optical properties of that lens.

No filter is 100% clean, dust free, flat or clear.

The amount of image degredation will depend on the optics of the lens, the position and type of light, the focusing distance and the coating on both the lens and the filter.

Sometimes this may show up, sometimes
...Show more

Totally agreed! And I just saw that youtube video on some guy hammering the 50mm glass, very impressive!



Jan 09, 2013 at 08:46 PM
gwei8
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p.1 #19 · Canon 135L question


Paul Mo wrote:
Check out my flickr set 'Thai Culture', there you'll see 135 f2L shots with a filter. Oh, the haze!!! The softness!!!



Yea I totally noticed the softness in some images.



Jan 09, 2013 at 09:15 PM
zlatko
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p.1 #20 · Canon 135L question


WilliamFinley wrote:
I'm not going to spend all that money on an expensive pieced of equipment, and then put a cheap piece of glass in front of it. If you want an alternative way to protect your front element, use your lens hood.


Why does a filter have to be cheap? A 72mm B+W MRC filter costs $52, not exactly cheap. The 135L currently costs $900 and has ten elements. If, say, $400 of that $900 is for the construction of the lens, then the glass in the lens costs no more than $500, or an average of $50 per element. So adding a filter is not necessarily adding a cheap piece of glass on an expensive piece of glass. It adds one more piece of high quality glass of roughly equal value to the average piece of glass in the lens.

And a filter-free lens is not necessarily a pure, clean, dust-free, unobstructed lens. If a filter-free lens gets a smudge, it may require special cleaning materials which may not be instantly available. If a filtered lens gets a smudge, I can wipe it with any cloth and have a smudge-free lens. I can be shooting again in seconds. In practice, a filtered lens is easier to keep clean.

Of course the whole filter vs. no filter argument is separate from the question of whether this particular lens doesn't like filters.



Jan 09, 2013 at 11:17 PM
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