Home · Register · Search · View Winners · Software · Hosting · Software · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username   Password

  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  New Feature: SMS Notification alert
  New Feature: Buy & Sell Watchlist
  

FM Forums | Post-processing & Printing | Join Upload & Sell

1       2      
3
       4       end
  

Archive 2012 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations
  
 
tived
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #1 · p.3 #1 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


rico wrote:
My personal machine has a pair of latest 8-core Xeon E5-2650 2.0GHz (up to 2.8 w/Turbo), and 64GB DDR3-1600 ECC (upgradable to 512GB with low-voltage DIMMS). The Tyan m/b has 4 GbE ports, which is a bit overkill for me. I just received this box and haven't decided on storage, but it will be something SAS. The temporary SATA drive is great if it doesn't seek.

Will run your bench on my office machine which has a SSD RAID (RAED really).

Memory price circa 1978 was $40,000,000 per GB in unadjusted dollars. Not really practical to deploy, let alone address.
...Show more

i do remember using PDP-11, but don't ask me to code that today, or any other day for that matter, i really suck at it x

i doubt we had more then 16kb maybe 32, those we very different days, i think our computer was the only one in the area, that my dad was playing with for his work.

you system sounds like a really nice machine, Tyan makes good boards, i still have a K8WE (s2895), which was all the hype back in 2005, Dual Opteron 285.

one unfortunate limitation to my current board, is the limitation on the amount of ram, though its advertised to only run at 48Gb, I and several others have been able to run with 96GB, but it does limits the overclocking, at least for me.

Henrik



Dec 28, 2012 at 01:45 AM
tived
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #2 · p.3 #2 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


To overclock or not, or to have two processors (CPU's) or not.

You have to look at the overall system, not just on the individual components, the system is only as good as its weakest component.

My old Dual Opteron 285 (2x 2Core @ 2.66Ghz) was 10% faster then my QX6600 Quad core 2.66Ghz both with 8GB of ram at the time, both with Raptor boot disks.

However, to work on, the Opteron felt so much better, it was smoother to work on, things would flow easier, if its possible to describe a computer system in such a way. However, it was also at least twice as expensive.

Moving forward, to today, where I run a Dual X5650 (2.66Ghz) clocked at 4.2Ghz, and running stable enough to do production work on it, it only runs hotter, but another 20-30C+ at load. This is an air-cooled machine. This beast flys, its very nice to work on, working with multi-gigabyte files, they open within seconds. Rendering Panos, that before would give me ample opportunities to drink liters of coffee while waiting for it to load up the files, just flies throught them, I struggle to keep up seeing the images being added.

To me, thats a great machine - because this is what I use it for, it was build for specific purpose, but it did come at a price. You can probably build a cheaper single processor machine, that will beat this in the CPU tests, but I doubt it will in the over all feel for the system. Also bare in mind that single CPU's are limited in how much ram they can have. I am limited to 96GB, but I struggle to overclock with that much ram in it, so I often pull out 48GB and clock it up.

I am not saying this is what everyone else should do, but that this is what I did, It was more to point out that we are all different, and when the OP set a $1000 budget, some of us would cringe and others would think it s ample. We all have different perceptions of what is required based on our experiences.

Someone here pointed out that people only overclock their computers so they can tell their friends how fast it is. That's his opinion. I look at it as another option in the motherboard/CPU combination that I can use to get to my goal, compute faster. Its not for all, and you need to know what you are doing, If I were running medical procedures on this machines, or manage the control tower of an airport, I would probably not do this, as there is a chance that it will shut down. Overclocking is a calculated risk, in my case! I will sometimes bring it to default if I have something going on that I know I can't afford to loose (eg. Time), the time slot is too narrow for error to get the job back to the client.

To the OP, look at what you are doing with the gear you have, look at what others in similar situations are using to computer/process their files with, if this is what you are wanting to archive, build a system around that, provided that it fits within your budget

I hopo you will all have a great new year

Henrik



Dec 28, 2012 at 02:23 AM
JimmyStephans
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #3 · p.3 #3 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


Funny Comparison...

Two months ago I built a Windows 7 Pro / 64 bit system.

i7 / 3930K processor (Sandy Bridge)
32GB ram
WD Raptor Drives (10,000 RPM).
ATI Firepro 3900 GPU 1GB Ram
Photoshop CS6 (Cloud Version)

More recently I was at Micro Center here in Denver area and noticed a basic Windows 7 machine on sale. I grabbed one for use by bookkeeper. Once it was back at office and set-up I decided to play a little.

http://microcenter.com/product/390975/B710_Desktop_Computer

I added RAM to make it 16gb.
I added second drive so it had two (main and scratch for PS)
I added a used ATI 5470 GPU with 1GB

The thing ran great and it was amusing that it "felt" faster than the main machine. Few days later part time helper decided to try as PS system so it was set up using PS / CS 6 Cloud and he loved it compared to his normal machine (AMD 955x4 Black / 16gb Ram / ATI 5470)

In a non-scientific test we ran same action on folder full of 50 TIFF image (about 8.5mb each on drive).

The enhanced Micro center machine was only about 16-18 seconds slower when doing the entire folder and I credited most of that to the hard drives (10,000RPM with big cache compared to 7200RPM and less cache).

The main machine cost about $2200 to build.
The Micro Center machine, plus tune-up parts, about $825










Dec 28, 2012 at 02:26 AM
CorwinGraves
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #4 · p.3 #4 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


I suppose anything will be better than what I'm currently using, which is a Dell Studio 1558 laptop that uses an i3 2.3 GHz processor (2 cores) and 4 GB of RAM. This thing completely bogs down when I run luminosity mask actions, and I can only imagine how it will behave when I start processing panos, which I'll be doing soon since receiving an RRS nodal slide for Christmas.


Dec 28, 2012 at 04:27 AM
15Bit
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #5 · p.3 #5 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


hugodrax wrote:
Why would you want to overclock? The only reason people overclock is to show off how many Mhz they can push. Why add instability and the risk of data corruption so you can overclock an extra 200 Mhz which will not improve your photo processing speed since the 3770 CPU is already super powerful already.

Now if your goal is to build a PC and play around with the bios all day trying to get an extra mhz or two then I recommend building.


I'm afraid thats a little ignorant. You aren't getting an extra 200Mhz, you're getting an extra 800-1000Mhz across all 4 cores, which translates to an extra 25% or so performance boost on threaded apps. And it does make a difference, especially in LR. The risk of data corruption is low, as overclocking is done now via CPU multipliers, not base clock increases, and the CPU's have extremely good thermal protection that down-clocks them when overheating occurs. It isn't necessary to fiddle with the Bios either - the better brand motherboards come with software utils that will automatically determine a stable overclock for you and set it up.

We have a supplier agreement with Dell at work and we get Optiplexes by the boat load. We generally get the top of the range, so our current desktops are the 9010 midi and mini towers. They are just evolutions of previous models that we have many of. Hugo is right - they are decent machines. We have quite a lot of Optiplexes still running from Core 2 and even P4 days. There are limitations with respect to hard disk bays - you can't expand a lot (especially true for the Small Form Factor Model) and you can't overclock. The PSU is spec'd to be adequate for the job, but no more, so you won't be able to drop in a big fast graphics card. Dell (and others) also have a tendency to use non-standard motherboard formats too, which means you probably won't be able to upgrade to a new motherboard in a few years. I don't think they are designed to be running at high CPU loads for long periods of time either - the cooling is not what i would call "enthusiast class". On the other hand, they do seem to be mostly reliable and the only problem i've seen was when we set one up to collect large amounts of data via ethernet (a steady ~40-50% network load for several minutes at a time). It just couldn't keep up. This is unlikely to be a problem for you.

Henrik - do you do anything that needs/benefits from 16 cores, or do you just have them for the extra responsiveness? I used to buy dual socket machines for the extra snappiness too.



Dec 28, 2012 at 08:30 AM
kumori
Offline

Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #6 · p.3 #6 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


Here's a specific build. For $1000 I don't think you'll do much better.

CPU: Intel Core i7-3770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($289.98 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V LK ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($104.99 @ NCIX US)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Crucial M4 128GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($99.99 @ B&H)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Green 2TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($89.99 @ B&H)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 650 Ti 1GB Video Card ($129.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower Case ($49.94 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic 520W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($75.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Optical Drive: Asus BW-12B1ST/BLK/G/AS Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer ($59.60 @ NCIX US)
Total: $980.44



Dec 28, 2012 at 08:59 AM
aubsxc
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #7 · p.3 #7 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


hugodrax wrote:
Why would you want to overclock? The only reason people overclock is to show off how many Mhz they can push. Why add instability and the risk of data corruption so you can overclock an extra 200 Mhz which will not improve your photo processing speed since the 3770 CPU is already super powerful already.


There are several inaccuracies in your statements:

1. People don't overclock just to play with their systems. Many people including myself overclock because it significantly speeds up tasks that require heavy CPU processing. If you can cut your procesing time by 20 to 30% or more, why would you want to sit around and wait?

2. A vast majority of current generation SandyBridge and IvyBridge unlocked quads can be overclocked by 600 to 800 MHz with little or no tweaking (voltage adjustments) with inexpensive coolers (~ 25 heatsink+fan combo). With minor tweaking and good cooling ($40 to $60 heatsinks), most can be overclocked to speeds 1.2 to 1.4 GHz faster than stock. Many of the same processors can be clocked 1.6 to 1.8 GHz faster than stock with moderate to heavy tweaking and high end cooling ($100 plus liquid cooled systems). My AMD Thunderbird from 2000 could be clocked to run about 100MHz faster, while my 2005 AMD Clawhammer could be run 600 MHz faster than stock. You are grossly misinformed about what how much overclocking can speed up your work.

3. In order to run an overclocked system in daily production you need to check for hardware stability using easily available free software. For CPU and memory you can use Prime95, IntelBurn, and OCCT just to name a few. For testing memory you can use MemTest86 or one of its variants. For testing the graphics processer you can use Furmark. If your system can pass 12 or 24 hours of torture testing with IntelBurn or Prime95, it is very unlikely that you will actually have overclcok stability related issues in real life use where the demands on the processor are quite a bit lower than the torture tests were simulating.

4. You are right that SB and IB quads are fast to begin with. With overclocking they can be made significantly faster, to the point that they are more than competitive with the high priced ($2000+) E5 Xeons with twice as many cores (the Xeons are locked and cannot be overclocked other than small changes through the base clock). If the applications you work with are not able to efficiently use two or more cores in a multithreaded environment, a $250 SB or IB quad can actually be significantly faster than that Xeon which costs 8 times as much.

Now if your goal is to build a PC and play around with the bios all day trying to get an extra mhz or two then I recommend building.

But if your goal is photography then I would recommend against building a computer.


If you cannot tolerate any potential downtime then you should buy a professional workstation built by Dell and spend the few hundred dollars for a next-day on-site service contract. On the other hand, if the time to learn and a little patience you can build a custom workstation with high quality name brand parts for much less than what you would pay for that Dell. Plus when you have have issues with the machine you can be your own tech support and not have to rely on expensive technicians who may or may not know what they are doing.


The power supply dell would choose would be appropriate, since it is not in their best interests to put in a crap PSU when they are selling that computer with a 3 year next business day onsite support. Just one visit because they skimped on the PSU means they lost money to save a few cents.

I don't who Dell uses as their OEM for parts, but I am willing to wager good money that the name brand parts you can buy from Newegg or Amazon are better built and offers much higher quality feature sets than Dell is willing to pay their OEMs for. There is a reason Dell can sell cheap computers, and its not because they are buying Seasonic Platinum power supplies, or putting $300 motherboards in their boxes.



Dec 28, 2012 at 02:30 PM
CorwinGraves
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #8 · p.3 #8 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


kumori wrote:
Here's a specific build. For $1000 I don't think you'll do much better.

CPU: Intel Core i7-3770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($289.98 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V LK ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($104.99 @ NCIX US)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Crucial M4 128GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($99.99 @ B&H)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Green 2TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($89.99 @ B&H)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 650 Ti 1GB Video Card ($129.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower ($49.94 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic 520W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($75.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Optical Drive: Asus BW-12B1ST/BLK/G/AS Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer ($59.60 @ NCIX US)
Total: $980.44
...Show more

Excellent! Thanks for putting this together. I wasn't considering an SSD drive or graphics card, but you have them both included while still keeping the total cost below $1,000. One thing this building doesn't include is an OS, so I would need to tack on another $130 or so for an OEM version of Win 7.



Dec 28, 2012 at 03:22 PM
aubsxc
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #9 · p.3 #9 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


kumori wrote:
Here's a specific build. For $1000 I don't think you'll do much better.

CPU: Intel Core i7-3770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($289.98 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V LK ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($104.99 @ NCIX US)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Memory: Samsung 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($39.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Crucial M4 128GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($99.99 @ B&H)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Green 2TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($89.99 @ B&H)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 650 Ti 1GB Video Card ($129.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Corsair 200R ATX Mid Tower ($49.94 @ Newegg)
Power Supply: SeaSonic 520W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($75.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Optical Drive: Asus BW-12B1ST/BLK/G/AS Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer ($59.60 @ NCIX US)
Total: $980.44
...Show more


I would spend a little bit extra and get the unlocked 3770K instead. This will allow you to run the CPU at 4.2 to 4.4 with minimal effort, and will significantly boost your speed. I would also buy an aftermarket heatsink like a Corsair H60 ($50) or a Coolermaster Hyper 212 Plus ($30) to cool the CPU.



Dec 28, 2012 at 03:38 PM
15Bit
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #10 · p.3 #10 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


If you aren't using a lot of photoshop filters, video editing or playing games you don't need the graphics card either. The onboard HD4000 intel is good enough for most day to day tasks.


Dec 28, 2012 at 04:45 PM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



CorwinGraves
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #11 · p.3 #11 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


15Bit wrote:
If you aren't using a lot of photoshop filters, video editing or playing games you don't need the graphics card either. The onboard HD4000 intel is good enough for most day to day tasks.


Thanks - was planning on leaving that out.



Dec 28, 2012 at 05:29 PM
CorwinGraves
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #12 · p.3 #12 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


aubsxc wrote:
I would spend a little bit extra and get the unlocked 3770K instead. This will allow you to run the CPU at 4.2 to 4.4 with minimal effort, and will significantly boost your speed. I would also buy an aftermarket heatsink like a Corsair H60 ($50) or a Coolermaster Hyper 212 Plus ($30) to cool the CPU.


Makes sense - thanks. By the way, how much is a "little bit extra?"



Dec 28, 2012 at 05:29 PM
aubsxc
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #13 · p.3 #13 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


The 3770K is $320 at Amazon. If you live close to a Microcenter it would run you about $250 including taxes (this is an in-store only special that Microcenter runs).

EDIT: you could substitute an i5 3570K for the i7 3770K and not see any real difference in your day to day use. This would save you about $100 if your budget is tight. The 3570K does not have hyperthreading, but hyperthreading will only speed up certain heavily mutithreaded applications like video processing.

Another thought: if you think you will want to overclock your processor, I would take a hard look at the SandyBridge (SB) i5 2500K and i7 2600K also. The IvyBridge processors (3570k and 3770k) are slightly faster at the same clockspeed and use slightly less energy, but get very hot when overclocked because Intel messed up the die-to-heatspreader connection on these processors. The SB processors do not have this issue and will happily run at 65 to 70C all day long with good cooling at 4.8 GHz, while your IB cpus will be hitting 85 to 90C at those speeds (if you can get there at all) even with high end water cooling. The SB processors will work on all current Z68 and Z77 chipset boards, while IB processors will work on Z77, and on Z68 with a BIOS update. I have used both SB and IB processors and I would pick the 2500K or 2600K over IB any day of the week.

Edited on Dec 28, 2012 at 06:18 PM · View previous versions



Dec 28, 2012 at 06:00 PM
Mataz426
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: On
p.3 #14 · p.3 #14 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


Window 7 64
http://www.amazon.com/Windows-Premium-64bit-System-Builder/dp/B004Q0PT3I/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1356717802&sr=8-1&keywords=windows+7+64



Dec 28, 2012 at 06:04 PM
BobCollette
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #15 · p.3 #15 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


aubsxc wrote:
EDIT: you could substitute an i5 3570K for the i7 3770K and not see any real difference in your day to day use. This would save you about $100 if your budget is tight. The 3570K does not have hyperthreading, but hyperthreading will only speed up certain heavily mutithreaded applications like video processing.

Another thought: if you think you will want to overclock your processor, I would take a hard look at the SandyBridge (SB) i5 2500K and i7 2600K also. The IvyBridge processors (3570k and 3770k) are slightly faster at the same clockspeed and use slightly less energy, but get
...Show more

I built my system just over a year ago, when the Sandy Bridge CPU's were popular (Ivy Bridge wasn't out yet). I'm running an i5-2500K with a CoolerMaster Hyper212+ heatsink on a Gigabyte Z68XP-UD4 motherboard with 16GB of RAM (4x4GB). My system is running very stably at 4.65GHz (3.3GHz is stock). I'm very pleased with the system. While I don't have anything else to compare it with, it seems blazingly fast to me.



Dec 28, 2012 at 06:28 PM
rico
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #16 · p.3 #16 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


I'm humbled by you overclockers and your knowledge, especially the part about the IB heat-spreader botch. Being a stability junkie, I try to operate far from the edge, and that includes thermal. My selected torture test for this new Xeon box is a certain C source that noticeably elevates temperatures. Compiling it repeatedly x16 for a couple of minutes raises core temps, but not even close to the red-line of 100C. Graph of the asymptotic results:



Results would be higher with some floating point or SSE instructions, but that's not my main pattern of use.



Dec 29, 2012 at 12:00 AM
hugodrax
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #17 · p.3 #17 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


15Bit wrote:
If you aren't using a lot of photoshop filters, video editing or playing games you don't need the graphics card either. The onboard HD4000 intel is good enough for most day to day tasks.



Actually On my Mac Mini (2012 model i7 fusion drive model) with the HD4000 I can edit 1080p realtime, even realtime scrubbing and effects using final cut pro and this is with a large number of apps and windows open (even aperture).

It could be because OS X is more efficient and on windows machines you need a monster videocard to do what an HD4000 can do in OS X.




Dec 29, 2012 at 01:09 AM
blob loblaw
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #18 · p.3 #18 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


hugodrax wrote:
Actually On my Mac Mini (2012 model i7 fusion drive model) with the HD4000 I can edit 1080p realtime, even realtime scrubbing and effects using final cut pro and this is with a large number of apps and windows open (even aperture).

It could be because OS X is more efficient and on windows machines you need a monster videocard to do what an HD4000 can do in OS X.




, no that's not why and I doubt OS X is "more efficient".
HD4000 is part of your intel 3770 CPU and it works the same way in Windows, except you need a different video editing program that supports the GPU acceleration since FCP is OSX only



Dec 29, 2012 at 01:14 AM
k7xd
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #19 · p.3 #19 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations


hugodrax wrote:
Actually On my Mac Mini (2012 model i7 fusion drive model) with the HD4000 I can edit 1080p realtime, even realtime scrubbing and effects using final cut pro and this is with a large number of apps and windows open (even aperture).

It could be because OS X is more efficient and on windows machines you need a monster videocard to do what an HD4000 can do in OS X.



Comment about your hypothesis about the superiority of OSX but
my old W7 2.6 ghz i5 handled 1080p with effects just fine.

My friend with an equivalent iMac has to spend hours/days transcoding footage to Prores
before he could even begin editing.









Dec 29, 2012 at 02:30 AM
WAYCOOL
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #20 · p.3 #20 · Computer Build for Photo Editing - Need Recommendations




It could be because OS X is more efficient and on windows machines you need a monster videocard to do what an HD4000 can do in OS X.



It's this type of arrogant inaccurate outdated crap that gives Windows users a reason to dislike mac fanboys.
Then again if I were forced to use basically a laptop with a low power lightweight cpu, 2.5 in harddrive (though the fusion helps alot) with no ability to upgrade the video card I might cling to outdated fiction to me feel better about the less than steller performance of my computer.




Dec 29, 2012 at 05:43 AM
1       2      
3
       4       end




FM Forums | Post-processing & Printing | Join Upload & Sell

1       2      
3
       4       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username   Password    Retrive password