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RX1(R/R2) Image Thread
  
 
Tariq Gibran
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p.95 #1 · p.95 #1 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


sebboh wrote:
what do you recommend for resizing?



In PS, I use good old Bicubic (best for smooth gradients). I have seen some really terrible results from Bicubic Sharper.



Sep 24, 2013 at 07:05 PM
sebboh
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p.95 #2 · p.95 #2 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


Tariq Gibran wrote:
In PS, I use good old Bicubic (best for smooth gradients). I have seen some really terrible results from Bicubic Sharper.


oh, that's the same as i use...




Sep 24, 2013 at 07:12 PM
Tariq Gibran
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p.95 #3 · p.95 #3 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


sebboh wrote:
oh, that's the same as i use...



Hmm, that's odd then. So you work completely from the raw in 16bit all the way through, including re-sizing using the standard Bicubic, then convert to 8bit? Maybe it does have something to do with the auto vignetting correction as Douglas mentioned if that's the case. I also leave that off.

What color space do you convert/edit in and when do you convert to SRGB? Maybe it's also causing an issue? EDIT. If you are editing in ProPhoto RGB and converting to SRGB at the very end, this should not be an issue either. hmm


Edited on Sep 24, 2013 at 07:21 PM · View previous versions



Sep 24, 2013 at 07:15 PM
Jonas B
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p.95 #4 · p.95 #4 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


It would be interesting to try that image in a couple of converters. Maybe I"ll yry to get a couple of similar images and see what I can find.


Sep 24, 2013 at 07:20 PM
sebboh
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p.95 #5 · p.95 #5 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


Tariq Gibran wrote:
Hmm, that's odd then. So you work completely from the raw in 16bit all the way through, including re-sizing using the standard Bicubic, then convert to 8bit? Maybe it does have something to do with the auto vignetting correction as Douglas mentioned if that's the case. I also leave that off.

What color space do you convert/edit in and when do you convert to SRGB? Maybe it's also causing an issue?


auto vignetting correction is always turned off on all my cameras.

my standard workflow is to do all my real processing from raw in LR then to export to 8-bit jpeg and downsize/sharpen in PS5. that is what i did to the posted version. since then i re-exported in 16-bit prophoto rgb and did my downsizing/sharpening in that, only converting to 8-bit srgb as the final step before saving the 8-bit jpeg at level 12 in PS5.

here is the original with my normal processing and here is the one processed in 16-bit prophoto till the last step.

edit: apologies to all for wasting so much space on an image thread talking about this.




Sep 24, 2013 at 07:26 PM
Tariq Gibran
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p.95 #6 · p.95 #6 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


sebboh wrote:
auto vignetting correction is always turned off on all my cameras.

my standard workflow is to do all my real processing from raw in LR then to export to 8-bit jpeg and downsize/sharpen in PS5. that is what i did to the posted version. since then i re-exported in 16-bit prophoto rgb and did my downsizing/sharpening in that, only converting to 8-bit srgb as the final step before saving the 8-bit jpeg at level 12 in PS5.

here is the original with my normal processing and here is the one processed in 16-bit prophoto till the last step.

edit: apologies to all for
...Show more

I think it's what you said a while back (RX1 encourages extreme processing) - you just pushed the file to the extreme (you pushed the shadows +100).



Sep 24, 2013 at 07:46 PM
Brody LeBlanc
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p.95 #7 · p.95 #7 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread



Sleep by brodyl.91, on Flickr



Sep 24, 2013 at 07:59 PM
Jonas B
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p.95 #8 · p.95 #8 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


sebboh wrote:
auto vignetting correction is always turned off on all my cameras.

my standard workflow is to do all my real processing from raw in LR then to export to 8-bit jpeg and downsize/sharpen in PS5. that is what i did to the posted version. since then i re-exported in 16-bit prophoto rgb and did my downsizing/sharpening in that, only converting to 8-bit srgb as the final step before saving the 8-bit jpeg at level 12 in PS5.

here is the original with my normal processing and here is the one processed in 16-bit prophoto till the last step.

edit: apologies to all for
...Show more

But it has to be discussed somewhere, doesn't it?
Interesting that the artifacts still remain, to a lesser degree though, in your second version. Like Tariq I wonder if the initial colour space (ProPhoto) has something to do with it. I work in aRGB in Lightroom and Photoshop as I never really bothered with a wider gamut as I'm ignorant enough not to know what to do with it. Or maybe the colour space doesn't matter due to the PP steps taken?



Sep 24, 2013 at 08:08 PM
HelenaN
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p.95 #9 · p.95 #9 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


Thanks everyone for the input! What sebboh suggests makes a lot of sense; that the huge dynamic range makes it tempting to go a bit too far with the shadow lifting and highlight recovery. I'll keep it in mind the next time it occurs.


Sep 24, 2013 at 08:34 PM
ebookman
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p.95 #10 · p.95 #10 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


HelenaN wrote:
Some more from our trip up to north-eastern Norway:

Helena -- I love the light in the northern latitudes and you capture it so well!



Sep 24, 2013 at 09:42 PM
 

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sebboh
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p.95 #11 · p.95 #11 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


HelenaN wrote:
Thanks everyone for the input! What sebboh suggests makes a lot of sense; that the huge dynamic range makes it tempting to go a bit too far with the shadow lifting and highlight recovery. I'll keep it in mind the next time it occurs.


another issue with this particular photo is that it is split toned highlights are sepia and shadows are selenium. i'm not sure exactly how lightroom deals with the transition point from light to shadow particularly with shadow recovery jacked up all the way...




Sep 24, 2013 at 09:51 PM
rji2goleez
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p.95 #12 · p.95 #12 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


A couple using pano mode. Sometimes this works quite well!












Sep 24, 2013 at 10:48 PM
douglasf13
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p.95 #13 · p.95 #13 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


douglasf13 wrote:
That example from sebboh seemed to be because of stitching different sky tones, which isn't really an RX1 issue.

In-camera vignetting correction in a lot of cameras can be an issue, too. I leave mine off.


My apologies. I got confused.

Another thing to consider is that all RX1 (and A99/A77) raw files are compressed. They're essentially using the same compression as the old "cRAW" option on the A900, and it can be slightly lossy. If I remember correctly, the raws are compressed down into only 11 bits of tonal value, so that could cause this occasional issue when things are cranked in the raw converter.



Sep 24, 2013 at 10:59 PM
Tariq Gibran
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p.95 #14 · p.95 #14 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


douglasf13 wrote:
My apologies. I got confused.

Another thing to consider is that all RX1 (and A99/A77) raw files are compressed. They're essentially using the same compression as the old "cRAW" option on the A900, and it can be slightly lossy. If I remember correctly, the raws are compressed down into only 11 bits of tonal value, so that could cause this occasional issue when things are cranked in the raw converter.


I didn't know that, though I should have from owning the a900 (which offered a non lossy raw option). Sony really should be offering the option of a non lossy raw in addition to cRAW on all of their higher end cameras.



Sep 24, 2013 at 11:20 PM
douglasf13
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p.95 #15 · p.95 #15 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


Tariq Gibran wrote:
I didn't know that, though I should have from owning the a900 (which offered a non lossy raw option). Sony really should be offering the option of a non lossy raw in addition to cRAW on all of their higher end cameras.


I'd imagine that the smaller files that Sony gets by using cRAW in the newer cameras allows them to use smaller buffers and whatnot while still maintaining fast frame rates. I've also read that using continuous shooting mode on the A99 means they use a 12 bit file that is compressed down, rather than the 14 bit file of single shot mode.



Sep 24, 2013 at 11:26 PM
Tariq Gibran
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p.95 #16 · p.95 #16 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


douglasf13 wrote:
I'd imagine that the smaller files that Sony gets by using cRAW in the newer cameras allows them to use smaller buffers and whatnot while still maintaining fast frame rates. I've also read that using continuous shooting mode on the A99 means they use a 12 bit file that is compressed down, rather than the 14 bit file of single shot mode.


Sure would be nice to know if the 12 bit vs 14 bit in single shot vs continuous drive mode of the A99 was also the case with the RX1.

I suspect all this is academic though as I sort of doubt sebboh's posterization issue is due to this.



Sep 24, 2013 at 11:38 PM
douglasf13
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p.95 #17 · p.95 #17 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


Tariq Gibran wrote:
Sure would be nice to know if the 12 bit vs 14 bit in single shot vs continuous drive mode of the A99 was also the case with the RX1.

I suspect all this is academic though as I sort of doubt sebboh's posterization issue is due to this.


Oh, the A99 still compresses both the 12 bit and 14 bit files down to 11 bits, so it isn't any better in that regard.

I'm kind of wondering if this may be the issue, once you add jpeg compression on top of the built-in raw compression.



Sep 24, 2013 at 11:43 PM
Tariq Gibran
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p.95 #18 · p.95 #18 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


douglasf13 wrote:
Oh, the A99 still compresses both the 12 bit and 14 bit files down to 11 bits, so it isn't any better in that regard.


Well, 12 bit vs 14 bit in the raws makes no difference (as was fully explored a few years back) so I just figured that 1 extra bit might not matter. I could be wrong.

I really think his issue would have been there regardless due to how much cooking the file has gone through. Maxing out the shadow recovery alone might not do it but combined with other editing (split toning, possibly pushing one of the channels hard in the B&W conversion)...the only raws I have played with that can withstand those sort of extremes with subtle tonal transitions were from MF sensors.



Sep 24, 2013 at 11:51 PM
rji2goleez
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p.95 #19 · p.95 #19 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


I love how well this sensor handles shooting into the sun.












Sep 24, 2013 at 11:59 PM
douglasf13
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p.95 #20 · p.95 #20 · RX1(R/R2) Image Thread


Tariq Gibran wrote:
Well, 12 bit vs 14 bit in the raws makes no difference (as was fully explored a few years back) so I just figured that 1 extra bit might not matter. I could be wrong.

I really think his issue would have been there regardless due to how much cooking the file has gone through. Maxing out the shadow recovery alone might not do it but combined with other editing (split toning, possibly pushing one of the channels hard in the B&W conversion)...the only raws I have played with that can withstand those sort of extremes with subtle tonal
...Show more

Here's one of the threads I found about it.
link



Sep 25, 2013 at 12:31 AM
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