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Archive 2012 · couple being persistent about all RAWs
  
 
morganb4
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


I dont give RAWs period.

I have now been asked again about this from different angle. Any suggestions on what I can say?



Aug 20, 2012 at 10:30 PM
imaginephotoaz
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


You ask them what they plan to do with RAW files, as most couples just hear the term after reading some advice on theknot.com, but don't actually know that they require specialized software and knowledge to utilize.

So ask them "what is it you are going to do with RAW files?" "Do you mean full-size edited files?"

Educate them.



Aug 20, 2012 at 10:33 PM
tobicus
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Softball: Explain why you don't give out RAWs.

Hardball: Walk away.

I'm presuming this is an inquiry and not a signed couple.



Aug 20, 2012 at 10:36 PM
sherijohnson
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


can you give more details about the request and the reason for it?


Aug 20, 2012 at 10:36 PM
TRReichman
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Make sure you understand why they want them. If they really do put a price on it. Why not make extra money for no additional work? I would accompany the sale of RAW files with some kind of agreement that the files are as is so they can't complain about quality later.

- trr



Aug 20, 2012 at 10:38 PM
qwyjibo
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


There isn't a price that you would take for your RAW files?


Aug 20, 2012 at 10:39 PM
Guari
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


When I got married i requested the RAWs before signing the contract, all of them.

Why? Because i wanted them, i was the client, i wanted to edit them and print. Granted, most photographers in my part of the world (not the uk, that's where I currently live) do not sell prints as part of their work scheme.

By having the raws i had insurance that if I didn't like the edita on a jpg made by the photographer, I could do it myself.

With that said i wouldn't have been as persistant if I had been offered albums. But i would have asked for them anyhow. I mean, prints fade. I am not going to call the photographer 30 years later for a reprint (assuming he's still alive). I have the raws, I do it.

I understand this might not be relevant if your business model depends on prints.

Edit: it doesn't hurt to ask why they want them. I know my photog asked me while raising an eyebrow in the process. I said because I might not like the pp in ten years. Because i want to print and you don't offer that. Because i love photoshop, etc etc... You get the idea.

It's your call anyhow.



Aug 20, 2012 at 10:48 PM
morganb4
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Wow, humbled by the speed of replies. Thank you very much.
OK answer to all in here
A lot of my stuff is extensively worked up, its a kind of trademark for me. Love it or hate it, heavy work up on semi-PJ is essentially my brand. It takes me a long time. I never submit unedited images because they are not fully reflective of what I as thinking at the time of the shot - if I was thinking . There is no realistic price I can put on RAWs.

OK, the 'why they want them':
Going over history, original request was for all images as they didn't want to get just a few out of the whole night. I assured them that they would get plenty. (I nearly always over deliver due to a mix of ego and indecision).

Now they have asked for RAWs because there might be some family portraits where one is smiling and another is not. I have replied that I have never submitted a family shot without smiling people in it/eyes closed etc. I didn't go as far as to say that I can swap heads etc etc.

Im not primarily print based.



Aug 20, 2012 at 11:09 PM
tobicus
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


If this is post-contract, all you need to do is point to the part of your contract where you refer to the format you deliver.


Aug 20, 2012 at 11:10 PM
Guari
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


morganb4 wrote:
Now they have asked for RAWs because there might be some family portraits where one is smiling and another is not. I have replied that I have never submitted a family shot without smiling people in it/eyes closed etc. I didn't go as far as to say that I can swap heads etc etc.

Im not primarily print based.


Well here i would agree with your stance. I had no interest to have all the raw so that i could have oof, blurry etc pictures. I had to trust my photog on that. If i were a wedding photog, I might consider it if they were asking for the raws of the deliverables. Not of the cull. Nono. I wouldn't want oof pictures with my name around for everyone to see...

Just my opinion




Aug 20, 2012 at 11:25 PM
 

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morganb4
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


@At tobicus, yes this is now post contract, surprisingly. They have signed and payed yesterday and sent me the question. I have given them an out - I dont want to shoot for them if I cant give them the product they want. Its actually against AIPP code of conduct.

I would do contract pointing only if all other efforts at customer service/reason have first failed.

Thanks though.



Aug 20, 2012 at 11:28 PM
joelconner
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


And by the "raw," you are sure that they are meaning actual camera raw files? Based on what you described, it just seems like they want all of the photos...even if unprocessed.


Aug 20, 2012 at 11:42 PM
marti.g3
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


morganb4 wrote:
I dont give RAWs period.

I have now been asked again about this from different angle. Any suggestions on what I can say?


Uh, just say what you said in your first line..."I dont give RAWS period ".....unless it's raw raw raw for the local football club......



Aug 21, 2012 at 12:33 AM
DmitriM
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


morganb4 wrote:
I dont give RAWs period.

I have now been asked again about this from different angle. Any suggestions on what I can say?


Don't ever say, I can't, I won't, I will never.

Put a high price tag for it. A price tag that will make you happy if someone will actually buy it yet deter 99% of the clients from it. This way you don't say NO to them.



Aug 21, 2012 at 02:40 AM
GeorgeM
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Read the initial thread earlier today. Was thinking about it while I was out fishing this afternoon. Foolish me. I should learn to live in the moment.

The thoughts that crossed my mind are the only person on this board who makes a point of saying he delivers images SOOC, straight out of the camera, is TrenchMonkey. Everyone else, maybe implied, does post processing myself included.

I don't just take pictures. I create images.

The difference between a processed finished image and a raw is like the difference between a loaf of bread and the makings, flour, water, yeast. No one can make a loaf of bread the same as anyone else as no one can process an image the same as someone else.

In this case the finished product includes the 'magic' of the processing by the OP. The client having the raw images will do nothing for the client except frustrate them. They won't be able to add the 'magic' ingredient.

George



Aug 21, 2012 at 02:55 AM
NathanHamler
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Just updated my contract to say "under no circumstances will raw files be delivered to clients....files delivered are high resolution jpeg files, which are more than adequate for all types of printing and viewing."....Thanks for reminding me to write that in! :-)


Aug 21, 2012 at 03:19 AM
dmward
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Its an interesting world... When I started shooting weddings, on film, we made prints to fit the selected album, and prints for framing. Never considered giving the client the negatives.

Now with digital there are more and more photographers willing to shoot a wedding and deliver the whole batch as JPGs with little more than a quick edit to get rid of the over/under exposed or blurry shots.

Then there are others that understand the craft/artistry of image making that do significant post processing to any image that finds its way off the working disk to a lab, or DVD.

When was doing a lot of commercial photography with film it was understood that the client got transparencies after we edited them for best exposure etc. They never got negatives because we made money selling prints. In fact a B&W work order specified size of film and type of prints.

Now there are customer thinking that the photographer is holding back so they want the "negatives"? After they signed a standard contract, which apparently was not clear. Tough spot.

I shoot weddings as a contractor for several studios, ranging from carriage trade to the mid-range. Only once, to my knowledge, has a client asked for RAW files. It was a stipulation in the contract, and we were required to shot raw for the job. Turns out the groom's parents owned a wedding photography business in another city and the bride was one of the editors. :-)

If it were me, I'd give them their money back if they don't accept your explanation.



Aug 21, 2012 at 04:31 AM
D. Diggler
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


dmward wrote:
Only once, to my knowledge, has a client asked for RAW files.


I've never been asked for RAW. As a matter of fact, I've never heard a client even utter the word "RAW".

Never had a client inquire if I shoot RAW or JPEG.

They don't even ask about equipment or gear that will be used!



Aug 21, 2012 at 05:11 AM
imaginephotoaz
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Generally speaking, only Craigslist and TheKnot brides ask for stuff like this. Lower end of the scale. They don't know why they want the files, they just read somewhere they "need" to ask for the files.

Since these type of brides usually disappear when we for them a quote, we don't run into the problem either.



Aug 21, 2012 at 01:29 PM
Tony Hoffer
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · couple being persistent about all RAWs


Could you post how they asked the question? That would help.


Aug 21, 2012 at 01:58 PM
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