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Archive 2012 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D
  
 
galenapass
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p.1 #1 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


I have had a 7D in the past but did not like the noise that I saw in the files - particularly in the blue sky or other color homogenous backgrounds. However, I am FL limited and find myself cropping regularly. I am once again thinking of getting a 7D. But this time trading or selling my 1DMIII for the 7D. Any former owners of the 1DMIII do this and regret it? How about no regrets? Opinions from active wildlife shooters will be most relevant for me. Thanks.


Aug 20, 2012 at 02:35 AM
onegreatcity
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p.1 #2 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


For what it's worth I went the other way, selling my 7D for a 1DmIII and I don't regret it for a second. I'm not a hardcore wildlife shooter however so feel free to disregard...


Aug 20, 2012 at 02:47 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.1 #3 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


My biggest grief with the 1D3 was its lack of resolution, not much else to complain about.

The 7D is very manageable regarding noise. Turn down sharpening in camera, do a really low NR if it really bugs you, then USM the sharpness back.




Aug 20, 2012 at 02:52 AM
Liquidstone
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p.1 #4 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


galenapass wrote:
I have had a 7D in the past but did not like the noise that I saw in the files - particularly in the blue sky or other color homogenous backgrounds. However, I am FL limited and find myself cropping regularly. I am once again thinking of getting a 7D. But this time trading or selling my 1DMIII for the 7D. Any former owners of the 1DMIII do this and regret it? How about no regrets? Opinions from active wildlife shooters will be most relevant for me. Thanks.



I use a 1D4, 5D2 and 7D for birding. When reach limited, I have no hesitation mounting the 7D instead of the other two bodies. I have no extensive experience with the 1D3, so I can't comment on its IQ.

As regards noise, it's indeed more noticeable with the 7D files than with the other two bodies (1D4 and 5D2) when viewed at the pixel level, but ACR does a nice job in filtering it and retaining detail. Selective NR and sharpening in PS further improves the IQ of the 7D shots. So much so that I regularly shoot at up to ISO 3200 with the 7D.

Lowland White-eye (Zosterops meyeni, a near Philippine endemic, 4 inches total length)
Shooting info - Canon 7D + 400 2.8 IS + Canon 2x TC II, 800 mm, f/5.6, ISO 3200, 1/250 sec, 475B/516 support, manual exposure in available light, near full frame.









Aug 20, 2012 at 03:22 AM
Bmetcan
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p.1 #5 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


Mike,
I've been using the 7D for my primary camera for a couple of years now. I carry my 1-400L with me when I hike and the 7D gives me some extra cropping ability for those times when I can't or shouldn't get any closer. I regularly shoot in the ISO 800 and 1600 range since I usually head out in the late afternoons and spend a lot of time in the shaded side of the front range. I use DPP and PSE 10 for my processing and have found that making the major adjustments (Levels/curves, Highlight/Shadow, and Color) while still in 16 bit mode minimizes some of the noise you mention. I hit the cropped version of the image I'm working with noise reduction before outputting to web or print. I also don't worry too much about how it looks at 100% view. I've found 50% view to be a pretty good indicator for how it looks in print for me (8x10s, 11x14s). Of course, your acceptance of noise can be very different than mine.
Steve



Aug 20, 2012 at 03:28 AM
mco_970
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p.1 #6 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


I was not happy w/o 1D3 in my kit, and I finally gave up and added it back in (5D2, 7D, and 1D3). I really should part with either 7D or 1D3, but I'm pretty much torn between them, too. I'd rather shoot 1D3 & work with it's output, but at times want the 7D's reach...


Aug 20, 2012 at 03:33 AM
Liquidstone
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p.1 #7 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


TeamSpeed wrote:
My biggest grief with the 1D3 was its lack of resolution, not much else to complain about.

The 7D is very manageable regarding noise. Turn down sharpening in camera, do a really low NR if it really bugs you, then USM the sharpness back.




TS is the master at extracting detail and minimizing noise of 7D high ISO files. How about some high ISO 7D samples, TS?



Aug 20, 2012 at 03:36 AM
Imagemaster
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p.1 #8 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


I had no regrets moving from a 1D3 to a 7D.




  Canon EOS 7D    200-500mm lens    500mm    f/6.7    1/2000s    1600 ISO    0.0 EV  






  Canon EOS 7D    EF100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM lens    360mm    f/8.0    1/200s    800 ISO    -0.3 EV  




Aug 20, 2012 at 04:41 AM
galenapass
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p.1 #9 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


Thanks for the all the information so far.


Aug 20, 2012 at 05:24 AM
galenapass
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p.1 #10 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


Liquidstone wrote:
TS is the master at extracting detail and minimizing noise of 7D high ISO files. How about some high ISO 7D samples, TS?


That would be great. I may have to pay more attention to post-process with the 7D. Any examples/tips would be very useful.



Aug 20, 2012 at 05:25 AM
 

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uz2work
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p.1 #11 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


I used a 1D Mark III and a 7D together for a short time. When I got the 1D Mark IV, I chose to sell the 1D Mark III and keep the 7D because I felt that the 1D Mark IV and 7D each had strengths that complement each other well.

While the 1D Mark IV is the best all-around body that I've used, the 7D is, by far, the best body that I've used in focal length-limited situations. I know that there are many who are down on the 7D, but I truly believe that the negative feelings toward the camera come either as a result of judging noise in an invalid manner and/or not being willing to accept the concept that, with a high pixel density 1.6 crop sensor, it becomes critical to keep your shutter speeds up at a higher level than with other cameras if you want to be able to get consistently good results.

There is another recent 7D/1D Mark III thread that is worth reading. If you read some of my posts in that thread, you will find more details about my feelings with regard to using the 7D successfully in focal length-limited situations, and I won't take the time to repeat them all here. In my posts in that thread, I did provide sample photos. Note that those sample photos were not ones that I cherry picked from the best shots I've taken with the 7D over a 3 year period. They were ones that I just happen to have taken earlier in the same day that I posted in that thread.

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1139318

For me, when I'm not in a focal length-limited situation, I will choose to use the 1D Mark IV, but, when I am in a focal length limited situation, I reach for the 7D without hesitation. I've been working for 5 1/2 months on a project documenting an eagle nest. I've visited and photographed the nest and birds virtually every day during that time. While the single chick was in the nest, I used my 1D Mark IV and 500/4 from a tripod. Since the chick fledged, I've been able to follow it, observe it, and photograph it. To do so, I've needed a more compact and mobile rig, and I switched to using the 7D and my 400 DO (which is another piece of equipment that those with "internet wisdom" love to bash). The combination has been a joy to use. The 7D AF has not let me down a single time, even when shooting bursts of fast action with busy backgrounds, and, if I didn't know which camera/lens I had been using, I wouldn't be able to tell the 7D/400 DO pictures from the 1D Mark IV/500/4 pictures.

You can find those nest pictures on my website.

http://www.wildlifeimagesbyles.net/Eagle_Nest/Eagle_Nest_2012/eagle_nest_2012.html

Again the shots of the young bird once it left the nest are the ones taken with the 7D/400 DO. Note that, since my purpose for the project is documentation, I do have some shots that I included which were taken under extreme conditions, including some that were totally back lit or extreme crops because I wanted shots of a particular behavior, but most of the shots do have better quality.

The bottom line is that, on a daily basis, I can come home with shots from the 7D that I could not have gotten with the 1D Mark III (or, for that matter, the 1D Mark IV) because, if I had to crop the 1D Mark III shots down to the same field of view as I get with the 7D, I would be down to about 6 1/2 MP.

Les



Aug 20, 2012 at 11:17 AM
indiawilds
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p.1 #12 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


I somehow don't like the files of the 7D. The 1D III files are good, and you can use it if the AF of that body is fine. I use my 1D Mark IV and if I am in a focal length limited situation, I simply stop shooting. I normally use my 400mm f2.8 L IS USM lens plus EF 2xII TC.


Aug 20, 2012 at 11:52 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.1 #13 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


galenapass wrote:
That would be great. I may have to pay more attention to post-process with the 7D. Any examples/tips would be very useful.


Keep histograms to the right, don't sharpen anything until noise is dealt with, that means in-camera sharpening down to the left if you shoot raw and process with DPP. I have a large thread over on another board where we go through a host of settings and processing.

All my high ISO shooting revolves more around sports, family casual, and band than birding. Some of the players and cheerleaders lead a wild life, so maybe these would actually work.









Aug 20, 2012 at 04:50 PM
galenapass
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p.1 #14 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


TeamSpeed wrote:
Keep histograms to the right, don't sharpen anything until noise is dealt with, that means in-camera sharpening down to the left if you shoot raw and process with DPP. I have a large thread over on another board where we go through a host of settings and processing.

All my high ISO shooting revolves more around sports, family casual, and band than birding. Some of the players and cheerleaders lead a wild life, so maybe these would actually work.


Thanks!



Aug 21, 2012 at 12:18 AM
galenapass
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p.1 #15 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


uz2work wrote:
I used a 1D Mark III and a 7D together for a short time. When I got the 1D Mark IV, I chose to sell the 1D Mark III and keep the 7D because I felt that the 1D Mark IV and 7D each had strengths that complement each other well.

While the 1D Mark IV is the best all-around body that I've used, the 7D is, by far, the best body that I've used in focal length-limited situations. I know that there are many who are down on the 7D, but I truly believe that the negative feelings toward
...Show more

Thanks Les.

Nice shots and I enjoyed your website. Each year there are several Great Horned Owl nests that I visit frequently. A 7D would definitely give me more cropping room, and mobility once the young have fledged.



Aug 21, 2012 at 12:22 AM
uz2work
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p.1 #16 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


galenapass wrote:
Thanks Les.

Nice shots and I enjoyed your website. Each year there are several Great Horned Owl nests that I visit frequently. A 7D would definitely give me more cropping room, and mobility once the young have fledged.


For me, the mobility that it affords is one of the key benefits of the 7D. Even if I was willing to spend almost $20,000 more on gear to buy a 1DX and a 600/4 II to be able to put as many pixels on the subject as I can with the 7D and my 400 DO and regardless of how good the 1DX and 600/4 II might be, being able to use a lens that weights half as much as the 600/4 II and that is significantly smaller allows me to get pictures that I would have no chance to get with a bigger and heavier rig. Not only do I appreciate having the opportunity to get those pictures, but my two damaged rotator cuffs (which I suspect sustained their damage as a result of years of hand held shooting with the 500/4) also appreciate the lighter rig. Even though I enjoy using my 1D Mark IV and 500/4, the 7D and 400 DO have become my favorite shooting combination, and it is the pixel density of the 7D that allows that combination to have serious reach.

Les



Aug 21, 2012 at 01:09 AM
Andrew J
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p.1 #17 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


The 7d has twice the pixels per duck so a huge advantage. But then it is true mid-tone noise is a bit of a problem. Event photography lacks mid-tones, so yes those are great.


Aug 21, 2012 at 01:40 AM
Liquidstone
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p.1 #18 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


TeamSpeed wrote:
All my high ISO shooting revolves more around sports, family casual, and band than birding. Some of the players and cheerleaders lead a wild life, so maybe these would actually work.



Your ISO 12.8T shots make me want to try this sensitivity next time I bird. Great work, TS!



Aug 21, 2012 at 03:25 AM
RogerC11
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p.1 #19 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


Andrew J wrote:
The 7d has twice the pixels per duck so a huge advantage. But then it is true mid-tone noise is a bit of a problem. Event photography lacks mid-tones, so yes those are great.

What does that mean "event photography lacks mid-tones"?



Aug 21, 2012 at 03:30 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.1 #20 · Question for wildlife photogs - 1DMIII >>>7D


RogerC11 wrote:
What does that mean "event photography lacks mid-tones"?


I am curious as well, since the noise is really different by color channel, per the exposure selected. My NR techniques, when I need to get the absolute most out of a high ISO shot, involves cleaning noise differently on each color channel. So I don't understand the comment at all, especially after how much experience I have had with NR over the past few years across several different bodies, including the 7D.



Aug 21, 2012 at 04:14 AM
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