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Archive 2012 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and tha...
  
 
tylerdrumm
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p.1 #1 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Here's the situation.

I was hired by a family of three (two adults, one toddler) to do family/lifestyle photoshoot of them. It turns out that the husbands brother, who is divorced, wants photos of himself and his child shot as well in the same session. That's totally fine with me, so I adjusted the price accordingly.

This morning, I received a text message from the ex-wife:

"Hello Tyler. I understand that you will be taking photos of [name redacted]. The point of this text is to let you know that I do not give you my permission for you to put pictures of [name redacted] on the Internet or use pictures of him in any way to represent your business. If you have any questions, feel free to ask me."

It is part of the agreement/contract with the father that I retain copyrights to the images for web usage and as part of my portfolio. They share joint custody of the child, and she is not involved with the shoot or paying for it in any way.

Does she have any leg to stand on if I tell her "Sorry, Ma'am, but I retain the copyrights and usage rights for social media or portfolio usage." I've put the shoot on hold due to the weather, and partly because of this reason.

I would like nothing more than to be able to display the images on social media, or my portfolio, because frankly I hate his ex wife (past history with her, huge bitch).

Any help or experience would be appreciated. Thank you all!



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:20 PM
Guari
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p.1 #2 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Muddy waters if you ask me.


Aug 16, 2012 at 04:26 PM
Steve Wylie
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p.1 #3 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


I'm no lawyer, but it seem to me that if the ex-wife who shares custody of the child is putting you on notice that she doesn't agree to let her minor child's image be put on the internet, that's something you need to carefully consider, regardless of who booked or paid for the shoot, regardless of past history or any other consideration. I don't think she can prohibit you from carrying out the shoot, booked by the child's father, but from that point forward, I'd be really careful about posting anything from it.


Aug 16, 2012 at 04:27 PM
benee
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p.1 #4 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Not a lawyer, but no I wouldn't post pics of the son on the internet. Sure, you could post them and try to "call her bluff," but not worth the hassle. She might try to sue, or smear your name or who knows.....

Won't you have shots of the other parents/kids to use for your portfolio?



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:29 PM
friscoron
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p.1 #5 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)



If we're just talking about the brother, the ex-wife has no say. If we're talking about the brother's kid, as Guari said, it's muddy waters. I wouldn't even go there. Do the shoot, fulfill the orders, and move on.



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:31 PM
tylerdrumm
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p.1 #6 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


benee wrote:
Won't you have shots of the other parents/kids to use for your portfolio?


Yes, I will have photos from the other family to use in my portfolio, and I could care less about a smear campaign from her.

It would mainly just grant me extreme personal satisfaction to find that she had no grounds to dictate what I do with my own photos.

Thank you everyone for your input so far.



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:32 PM
lee1371
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p.1 #7 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


being right legally doesn't mean she won't try to sue you. when you have a litigious person id be careful. i think it is the smart thing to do even though you feel like you are being held hostage. principle is one thing. dealing with a headache is another.


Aug 16, 2012 at 04:33 PM
Robin Usagani
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p.1 #8 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Just post it all over the internet.. maybe you two will end up on TV. Good publicity!

JK.

I would just shoot it and not post any of the kid. Even if legally you can post it, not worth the hassle.



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:33 PM
tylerdrumm
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p.1 #9 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Here is what I am leaning towards...

I am strongly considering doing the shoot of both of them (more $$$ that way). Not posting photos of the said child in question on the internet, but also working into my usage rights that the ex-wife will have no printing rights, or access to any of the images by her or her family members.

Does that sound like a good plan?



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:38 PM
davenfl
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p.1 #10 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Not a good plan, for goodness sake don't you have more important things to worry about. Anytime a minor child is involved either parent can raise issues about images of their child that could cause your problems that regardless of whether your right or wrong could cost money for legal issues. You cannot be talking about images here that are that important to your portfolio that just taking the photo's, not posting them anywhere and just moving on to the next job would seem like an easy decision. If you cannot see that drop the job.

Dave



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:53 PM
 

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dmacmillan
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p.1 #11 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


tylerdrumm wrote:
I am strongly considering doing the shoot of both of them (more $$$ that way). Not posting photos of the said child in question on the internet, but also working into my usage rights that the ex-wife will have no printing rights, or access to any of the images by her or her family members.

Does that sound like a good plan?

No. I understand your anger, but this will probably get you into a big fight. At the least, it will be a major time suck.

Just shoot the job and get what sales you can.



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:55 PM
tylerdrumm
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p.1 #12 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


davenfl wrote:
Not a good plan, for goodness sake don't you have more important things to worry about. Anytime a minor child is involved either parent can raise issues about images of their child that could cause your problems that regardless of whether your right or wrong could cost money for legal issues. You cannot be talking about images here that are that important to your portfolio that just taking the photo's, not posting them anywhere and just moving on to the next job would seem like an easy decision. If you cannot see that drop the job.

Dave


Did you read my post? I'm not going to post any images anywhere on the net of the child, per the mothers request. However, I am going to restrict her or her family from printing the photos or having access to them. There is nothing wrong with that. She's not paying for the session, and she is not entitled to the photos.



Aug 16, 2012 at 04:55 PM
Lutefisker
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p.1 #13 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


To be honest, it sounds like a bad plan. Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems like you're trying to punish the mother. Perhaps she has a legitimate reason to be concerned about her son's photo being posted that you are not aware of--maybe a friendly phone call would be helpful?

Maybe this is an opportunity to bring a little joy and harmony into the world?







Aug 16, 2012 at 05:07 PM
tylerdrumm
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p.1 #14 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Lutefisker wrote:
To be honest, it sounds like a bad plan. Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems like you're trying to punish the mother. Perhaps she has a legitimate reason to be concerned about her son's photo being posted that you are not aware of--maybe a friendly phone call would be helpful?

Maybe this is an opportunity to bring a little joy and harmony into the world?


I'm not trying to punish the mother. She has the right to decide where photos of her son can be displayed, just as I have the right to determine who can print photos that I own the copyright to.

Pretty fair, I think.



Aug 16, 2012 at 05:09 PM
benee
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p.1 #15 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Here's the problem - It sounds like you're doing a "shoot and burn." Fine - its something I do too. Once you've gotten your $$ up front for the disc, its very hard to enforce useage/printing rights. What's to prevent dad (or son!) from sharing the pics with his Ex?

Now, in the future, if you really do want to make some more $$ here, you could just sell prints a la carte. That way mom and dad would be free to purchase the images separately

For now, just let it go..... you'll come across as the classiest player in this mess.



Aug 16, 2012 at 05:22 PM
tylerdrumm
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p.1 #16 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


benee wrote:
Here's the problem - It sounds like you're doing a "shoot and burn." Fine - its something I do too. Once you've gotten your $$ up front for the disc, its very hard to enforce useage/printing rights. What's to prevent dad (or son!) from sharing the pics with his Ex?


That's really the least of my worries. I'm not concerned at all with the ex husband sharing images with her. They hate each other, which is most likely why she decided to play the card she did. There is no doubt in my mind that he will keep the images to himself and his mother.

One thing that concerns me is the WIFE of his brother. She and his ex-wife are still friends, so she could easily share photos with her... But, I'm burning two separate discs. Only images where the father, and son appear with the other family will be on both discs.

Now, in the future, if you really do want to make some more $$ here, you could just sell prints a la carte. That way mom and dad would be free to purchase the images separately

For now, just let it go..... you'll come across as the classiest player in this mess.


Thanks for your thoughts, I will keep that in mind.



Aug 16, 2012 at 05:38 PM
derry1
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p.1 #17 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


think I would swim past this one and keep going,,

Derry



Aug 16, 2012 at 05:56 PM
Morganbeaudry
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p.1 #18 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


You've got the consent of one parent, the one involved in the activity in question i.e.: getting the shots done. I don't believe the law requires a consensus from divorced parents but then again I'm not a lawyer. If I had to guess I'd say she doesn't have any legal basis for a complaint. Get the commercial use waiver signed up by the dad and you oughta be fine.


Aug 16, 2012 at 06:32 PM
whitewash
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p.1 #19 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


It seems to me that you have a pretty basic choice here.

Do you want to prolong your unpleasant interaction with Miss Crazybitch by engaging in petty back-and-forth jabs with her and her broken family over things you can't even enforce?

Or do you want to get done with the situation as quickly as possible by maintaining professional detachment from a family drama that doesn't involve you personally and just doing your job?

I would just shoot, sell, and move on. I don't need to borrow trouble from other folks. YMMV, of course. I mean, if the kid were Prince Harry or something, maybe it would be a different equation.



Aug 16, 2012 at 06:35 PM
jefferies1
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p.1 #20 · LEGAL QUESTION (Yes, I know this is the internet, and that you're probably not a lawyer)


Legal or not you are asking for a lot of bad press is you post them. Stuff like that stays online forever and no one cares who was legally right. Mom always wins when it comes to the child. Even in court the jury would say who cares about your copyright, mom said no and she wins.


Aug 16, 2012 at 06:42 PM
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