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Archive 2012 · $99 or $500 Gimbal
  
 
Bifurcator
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p.7 #1 · p.7 #1 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Ah, OK. Thanks Lars. I'm not sure why you don't use it for shorter lenses than 400mm but OK. What kind of head do you prefer for 100-300 (for example) if I may ask? How about panoramas? I mean sure, I can do panoramas hand-held in bright light but even then this gimbal makes it so much easier. And ballheads kinda suck a little bit for larger panoramas IMO.






Apr 27, 2012 at 01:42 PM
Lars Johnsson
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p.7 #2 · p.7 #2 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


I have many good and strong ballheads also. RRS BH-55 & BH-40, Arca-Swiss Z1, Markins Q3, Gitzo Systematic GH 5380SQR and a lot of other stuff


Apr 27, 2012 at 03:28 PM
Bifurcator
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p.7 #3 · p.7 #3 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Oh IC... Nice!

Which one do you use/like most and why?

I've not seen that Gitzo Systematic GH5380SQR prior. Interesting shape!




Apr 27, 2012 at 05:42 PM
Lars Johnsson
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p.7 #4 · p.7 #4 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


I use the Markins Q3 most. Because it's rather small and I bring it when travelling.
The Gitzo is for big/long lenses. Very nice with 200-300mm lenses



Apr 27, 2012 at 05:57 PM
Bifurcator
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p.7 #5 · p.7 #5 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Cool! Thanks man!




Apr 27, 2012 at 05:59 PM
LocoPhoto
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p.7 #6 · p.7 #6 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Just caught up on this thread, and just two cents to Bifurcator... ...you make great points. I'm not trying re-orient the thread to go into another political tangent, but I do agree with you, and what is happening is obviously true as you state it, for the same underlying reason of previous actions like these...evil is real....but you're right...America and it's Constitutional powers are being parceled out bit by bit and slowly to avoid notice or nationalized objection, so that it can be dismantled and transitioned into socialism or anything less than it's foundational policies and beliefs in the US Constitution, as if an elitist President (supposed to be an employee of the people, not it's dictator) has the authority to mandate a selfish vision as being the final say.

Having a different "opinion" doesn't change the truth of what is happening, but when people value their video games, tv, are over-busy fighting to keep their job, etc., it's understandably hard to stay abreast on everything to the point of being able to discern "opinion" from "spin", and actual event from what is being sold as a perceived non-event. However, when the pattern is clearly volatile to the content of the US Constitution, over and over and over, it is very easy to see that the US people are being played, being told "nothing to see hear...please move along and take us for our word, do NOT explore this issue"...as they play down various acts and policy changes, personnel choices and cover ups, it's clearly easy to see truth, and then see a scale of lies that is truly bigger than mere political scandal....our country is being whored out to non-US powers, being sold to the highest political buyer, in exchange for helping the US crumble so division can grow, a new system be put in place, and that system be one of bondage where freedom is enjoyed.

This should be talked about more thoroughly, elsewhere, to learn more of truth, NOT just opinions, so we can all make more informed decisions come re-election time. Obama is the most dangerous President by simply being the most uncaring of the U.S. citizens, and the most willing to say anything that nets him progress in his political agenda of dismantling America.

End of two cents...sorry..that was probably a nickels worth. , and six cents more than anyone wanted to hear. heh

Loco



May 03, 2012 at 12:51 AM
Smiert Spionam
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p.7 #7 · p.7 #7 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Oh, please. People can, in fact, disagree with you without being mindlessly addicted to video games and TV. If you're reduced to calling those who disagree idiots, who's the elitist?

What you call 'truth" smells like just another load of political horseshit: left, right, or sideways. Find another soapbox. This ain't the place.




May 03, 2012 at 01:57 AM
Bifurcator
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p.7 #8 · p.7 #8 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Yeah!!! And what about them gimbals?

I found that mine works really well with macro-rails attached! Kewl stuff!

Dudez!






CZ MP 100mm f/2.8 at F/8

  DMC-GH1    1/50s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  




May 03, 2012 at 04:35 AM
LocoPhoto
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p.7 #9 · p.7 #9 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


"Oh, please. People can, in fact, disagree with you without being mindlessly addicted to video games and TV. If you're reduced to calling those who disagree idiots, who's the elitist?"

oh boy This is why I directed my post to Bifurcator, just as a comment of hey I agree and see the same things. So no getting huffy!

I play video games not that means anything by itself, and I never connected video gamers and TV watchers (I don't watch tv personally, mostly junk on tv nowadays) with anyone being an idiot, I just mentioned I was glad to see someone else staying informed of more important matters, choosing to self-inform as something more important than video games and entertainment, etc, as nowadays in recent years there are far more important matters underway than self-entertaining events. If you're hearing any accusation, that's coming from your own heart I'm afraid...not mine. I'm just talking about priorities...we should all care enough about this country to protect it, and that includes getting the truth so informed decisions can be made, and so that truth can be shared with those it affects.

People who don't do this are human...and we are self-centered creatures...but that doesn't make them idiots.

Now...back to the Gimbal and discussing its merits and ethics.

Loco



May 03, 2012 at 08:26 PM
Sjjindra
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p.7 #10 · p.7 #10 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Bifurcator wrote:
Yeah!!! And what about them gimbals?

I found that mine works really well with macro-rails attached! Kewl stuff!

Dudez!



Bifurcator

Would you mind posting a photo of your setup with the gimbal for macro?

I ordered a 100mm dovetail that arrived. It has holes already drilled and tapped where it extends behind the dovetail clamp that allowed my to mount a handle to the bottom. This provides for very fine, smooth adjustments.

This is a great setup for my 70-200mm and 400mm lenses, with or wthout extenders, or even one of my smaller telescopes for liveview photos or for video. Hope to try it out in the wild this weekend. I don't currently have rights to post photos on FM, but I am going to try to rectify that soon. Then I'll post a photo of my setup.

Thanks



May 03, 2012 at 11:14 PM
 

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Bifurcator
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p.7 #11 · p.7 #11 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


LocoPhoto wrote:
This is why I directed my post to Bifurcator, just as a comment of hey I agree and see the same things.

Yup! It's called "Television Programming" for a reason. It's not programming the TV set... It's programming from the TV set. And it's been very well documented about the affects of games on people. Radio, Music, and other forms of "media" too. To "see" the things you and I seem to be able to glimpse all that's needed are low stakes, some desire, and the effort to actually look. I suppose knowing history helps a lot.

Now...back to the Gimbal and discussing its merits and ethics.

Yup, Hehe...



Bifurcator wrote:
Yeah!!! And what about them gimbals?

I found that mine works really well with macro-rails attached! Kewl stuff!

Dudez!

Sjjindra wrote:
Bifurcator

Would you mind posting a photo of your setup with the gimbal for macro?

I ordered a 100mm dovetail that arrived. It has holes already drilled and tapped where it extends behind the dovetail clamp that allowed my to mount a handle to the bottom. This provides for very fine, smooth adjustments.

This is a great setup for my 70-200mm and 400mm lenses, with or wthout extenders, or even one of my smaller telescopes for liveview photos or for video. Hope to try it out in the wild this weekend. I don't currently have rights to post photos on FM, but I
...Show more
I'm not sure what you mean by "allowed [me] to mount a handle to the bottom..." but... Sure, here's some images. It's nothing special tho. Just a set of very common macro-rails mounted on the Gimbal and then the camera mounted on the rails. All straight up normal.






The only vibrations in this rig are from the GH1's lens-mount itself.






The GH1 (and GH2) are very plasticky pieces of junk! The tripod-mount is so sturdy that the camera is very solid - so all the bounce is isolated (focused?) to the camera's lens mount.






There's lots of bouncy vibs with a lens this long. Setting the delay timer solves the problem tho! So does using a lens with it's own tripod collar mount.




May 04, 2012 at 02:11 AM
Sjjindra
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p.7 #12 · p.7 #12 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Bifurcator wrote:
Yup! It's called "Television Programming" for a reason. It's not programming the TV set... It's programming from the TV set. And it's been very well documented about the affects of games on people. Radio, Music, and other forms of "media" too. To "see" the things you and I seem to be able to glimpse all that's needed are low stakes, some desire, and the effort to actually look. I suppose knowing history helps a lot.

Yup, Hehe...


I'm not sure what you mean by "allowed [me] to mount a handle to the bottom..." but... Sure, here's some images. It's
...Show more
The dovetail bar "allowed me", since by chance, it had 2 holes that matched those on a handle from one of my telescope mounts and stuck out the rear of the clamp far enough to have room to mount it.

I appreciate your posting the photos, I've never seen or used a macro-rail before, but I can see it's usefullness.

Thanks



May 04, 2012 at 03:57 AM
ukkisavosta
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p.7 #13 · p.7 #13 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Well, I decided to take a shot at this gimbal as well (in spite of my experiences with the less-than-satisfactory clamp), and mine arrived yesterday.

My only big lens is the Sigma 120-300 f/2.8 OS, but I guess it is heavy (3 kgs) and big enough to warrant the use of a gimbal. I know it's hard to handle with a ballhead, and very heavy for extended handheld shooting. I've never actually handled a gimbal before, and really didn't know what to expect. I live amidst seals (see here) in the middle of nowhere, so there are no gimbals around to test. Actually the problem applies to all my gear - I only have what is being said on the 'net to go by, and then just need to take a blind leap and order the item.

Anyhow, it appears that a gimbal is pretty much an essential piece of gear to get the most out of a heavy lens. A revelation for me, really.

The Beike (at least my copy) has some shortcomings, and it is quite obvious that this is not "the real thing". The panning action could be smoother - it clearly binds in places and has some free play in others when turning by hand without any weight on the gimbal. Luckily the weight of the lens helps here.

The rocking motion on the other hand is very smooth with no binding or free play whatsoever. However, it is very stiff even with the knob released. I'm not sure how proper gimbals are supposed to feel, but with the Beike, I can leave the camera/lens pointing in almost any direction, and it will stay there. I also have to exert some force to be able to rock the lens/camera. I might be wrong, but I suppose that in the loosened state, the rocker should just return to the horizontal position by itself.

I popped the cheesy compass off of the large knob, and there is a hex screw beneath it. I thought that maybe loosening the screw might loosen the rocking action, but the screw is _very_ tight, and my heavy duty metric hex set does not fit... it's something like 5.5mm.

Anyway, quality-wise the gimbal is pretty much what is expected considering the price. I hope I can loosen the rocking action some way.

Jaakko



May 04, 2012 at 08:19 AM
Bifurcator
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p.7 #14 · p.7 #14 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Cool! Sounds like you're living my dream life! Away from it all, skis, dog sleds or snowmobiles for ground travel, small planes to get anywhere, and did I mention away from it all?


"...it clearly binds in places and has some free play in others when turning by hand without any weight on..."

Mine did too at first. But after "working it" in for about 3 to 5min it's nearly perfect. The tension knob allows for playless panning without any tight spots. Actually though, mine never had any play in it.



"The rocking motion on the other hand is very smooth with no binding or free play whatsoever. However, it is very stiff..."

The pitch action on mine was a little stiff but only for the first few minutes. It didn't need "working in" beyond the first use. Now I can set it so that a lens that is every-so-slightly off center will slowly and steadily yield to gravity - Or when completely loosened fall at free-fall speeds (no play) - And of course the tension knob allows for tighter dampened and completely locked states.



"...I suppose that in the loosened state, the rocker should just return to the horizontal position by itself."

If it's properly balanced, no. Setup right it should smoothly swing and stay in whatever position it's placed. Right, balanced means balanced - so there's zero weight bias in any position. With mine loosened all the way I get about a 100˚ to 180˚ degrees of inertia travel when I "give it a spin" horizontally (Y Axis) - depending how much weight is on. I'm not going to give any big lenses "a spin" on the X Axis for the obvious reasons but right now with the Macro Rails, the GH1, and a Minolta AF 28-80 on it I get about 20˚ to 40˚ of inertia travel loosened all the way - depending how hard I swing it. Of course if I gorilla-swing it I could probably get 300˚ out of it but I don't wanna do that. With some actual weight on it it just floats and I can get it to float into a crashed position with a single finger push.



"...it's something like 5.5mm."

That's interesting. The Chinese are using American Standards? Hehehe...



"Anyway, quality-wise the gimbal is pretty much what is expected considering the price. I hope I can loosen the rocking action some way."

Considering the original is near $600 I would have guessed this unit to be about $400 but mostly due to the finish. While I actually like the rubberization on the Beike better than the Wimberley's it's flaws and unevenness spell "cheapy" to me. It was certainly a pleasant surprise for me at $99 delivered and after a little playing feels exactly like the Wimberley.

On making it smoother I suggest two steps be taken. 1) Tighten the tension slightly and give it a workout and 2) peal back the rubber tubbing a little bit and apply some graphite powder. (Note if you don't have any graphite powder on hand up there near the pole, a soft pencil led works - burn off the wood and crush or file the led (graphite) into a fine powder.





In closing, how do you like using a Gimbal generally speaking and is this your first one?





May 05, 2012 at 06:30 AM
ukkisavosta
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p.7 #15 · p.7 #15 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Bifurcator wrote:
Cool! Sounds like you're living my dream life! Away from it all, skis, dog sleds or snowmobiles for ground travel, small planes to get anywhere, and did I mention away from it all?


Heh, well, maybe I was exaggerating a bit... I live in Savonlinna, which is a mid-sized city (by Finnish standards) in Eastern Finland, but considering camera gear, sometimes it really does feel like I'm living next to the pole.

The seals are a local peculiarity - only 300 of the exist worldwide, and most of the population is spread around my hometown.

"...it clearly binds in places and has some free play in others when turning by hand without any weight on..."


Mine did too at first. But after "working it" in for about 3 to 5min it's nearly perfect. The tension knob allows for playless panning without any tight spots. Actually though, mine never had any play in it.


The panning action is actually much better now, and it doesn't bind at all with the lens on. The (very) small play doesn't affect use, but it can be felt by rocking the bare gimbal to and forth on the tripod in certain positions.


"The rocking motion on the other hand is very smooth with no binding or free play whatsoever. However, it is very stiff..."


The pitch action on mine was a little stiff but only for the first few minutes. It didn't need "working in" beyond the first use. Now I can set it so that a lens that is every-so-slightly off center will slowly and steadily yield to gravity - Or when completely loosened fall at free-fall speeds (no play) - And of course the tension knob allows for tighter dampened and completely locked states.


Well, this is very much different from my copy. Even in its loosened state, the pitch action is stiff, and will not budge anywhere without using both hands and a considerable amount of force. I've been working it for some time, but it hasn't really loosened up at all, so my copy is obviously out of spec (even for a Chinese piece of kit).


With mine loosened all the way I get about a 100˚ to 180˚ degrees of inertia travel when I "give it a spin" horizontally (Y Axis) - depending how much weight is on.

With some actual weight on it it just floats and I can get it to float into a crashed position with a single finger push.


Yeah, that's about what I was expecting for a working gimbal.

Sigh, I guess I need to contact the seller. I'm pretty sure they will ask me to send it in at my own cost (which is probably about half of the cost of a new copy). So, I guess I've been burned by a Chinese product yet again.

"...it's something like 5.5mm."
That's interesting. The Chinese are using American Standards? Hehehe...

It actually is exactly 5.5mm. I guess I'm going to try and find a suitable hex bit for a large ratchet.


On making it smoother I suggest two steps be taken. 1) Tighten the tension slightly and give it a workout and 2) peal back the rubber tubbing a little bit and apply some graphite powder. (Note if you don't have any graphite powder on hand up there near the pole, a soft pencil led works - burn off the wood and crush or file the led (graphite) into a fine powder.


I'll give it a try, but even a slight tightening of the knob makes the gimbal so stiff, that it is nearly impossible to move. Don't know whether the graphite could make its way into the gliding surfaces, as it appears that there is absolutely no clearance there.


In closing, how do you like using a Gimbal generally speaking and is this your first one?


Well, I haven't really had the time to test it out yet, and the tightness really doesn't feel at all right, but the basic idea of the gimbal seems very good.

Will report how the situation plays out.

Jaakko



May 05, 2012 at 08:22 AM
Bifurcator
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p.7 #16 · p.7 #16 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Savonlinnam... hehe; you're almost in Moscow... from the seal shot and your text I pictured you being in the Kaldoaivi wilderness somewhere around Barents Sea or something.

"Both hands... Considerable force..." and "(very) small play"? I'd say that sounds like you need to replace it! The Both Hands With Force thing almost sounds like you're trying to use it with the knob turned in to a dampened position. Give it some cranks and twists and see if it doesn't loosen up for ya. If it doesn't I'd send it back with a letter explaining why and a request for them to test the replacement before sending it out.

BTW, if you buy a tube of graphite that's one of the properties of the tube delivery system - it like, blows the graphite dust into small tight places. I suppose you could use a rocket blower to assist that further. I haven't tried lubes like machine oil and etc. on this one but I use thin grease on one of my ball-heads with great success. That or machine oil might help your gimbal if graphite doesn't cut it.




May 05, 2012 at 10:11 AM
jotdeh
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p.7 #17 · p.7 #17 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


What lens is that Bif?


May 05, 2012 at 10:17 AM
Bifurcator
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p.7 #18 · p.7 #18 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


The one in the picture (above)? That's the Contax Zeiss Makro-Planar 100mm F/2.8 at 1:1




May 05, 2012 at 10:20 AM
jotdeh
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p.7 #19 · p.7 #19 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Ah cool, first time I see it. It's huge on the GH1! Thanks!


May 05, 2012 at 10:27 AM
Sven Jeppesen
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p.7 #20 · p.7 #20 · $99 or $500 Gimbal


Both the pan knob and tilt knob actions are incredible smooth on the original Wimberley head. And it remains so even after many years of hard using.


May 05, 2012 at 06:54 PM
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