p.3 #3 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
jzucker wrote:
Oh, I see...You're saying get the 1600 and the einstein...
Yep. And the Photogenic Solaire if your dealer will let you borrow it for a weekend.
Try both the B1600 and Einstein out (and the Solaire if dealer has great customer service) at the same time using *your* gear and *your* setup. Return whatever you don't like. Keep what works for *you*.
It's not that expensive to do this, and makes a lot more sense than asking complete strangers what's best for you
p.3 #4 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
If I got the 1600 I'd opt for the WL and not the AB because I want the 250w modeling light.
I've had good luck with the photogenic stuff and I can get a PL500 for less than the Einstein. The issue is that it's too heavy to put up on a boom pole. The WL1600 weighs the same as the einstein, is $100 less and can take the 250w modeling light so that's the attraction it has.
p.3 #5 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
Deezie wrote: Sometimes the best customer service is never needing it. Have had my Profoto system for 3 years and never had a reason to contact them.
Actually the only thing that Buff has that I am wanting: user enabled firmware updates. I would hate that the receivers aren’t built in to the Buff lights, and I don’t like the way that they stickup so far. But I have to send two of my earlier D1 Air’s to the MAC Group (Profoto’s distributer in the US) for a free firmware upgrade – it is a working week without them and a hassle to pack and ship them to NY.
If I hadn’t seen the operational difference between the newer and older ones, I wouldn’t have had a clue who dealt with such things. It strikes me that Buff’s service is known to be good because it is used so often.
p.3 #6 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
jzucker wrote:
If I got the 1600 I'd opt for the WL and not the AB because I want the 250w modeling light.
I've had good luck with the photogenic stuff and I can get a PL500 for less than the Einstein. The issue is that it's too heavy to put up on a boom pole. The WL1600 weighs the same as the einstein, is $100 less and can take the 250w modeling light so that's the attraction it has.
A 500 Ws Photogenic PL500 is only 5.5 lbs, it should be no problem on a boom stand with a counter weight. I use 5.36 lbs Profoto heads on booms all the time with just me mounting them and with no problems (small and medium softboxes, 1 x 3 strips, and with grids). I have even used 6.3 lbs Hensel Integra Pro Plus heads on booms without problems, though it was helpful to have an assistant when doing this.
I don’t use super booms, just Manfrotto combi stands with 7 or 10 lbs counter weights. I have also had the D1s handheld on poles.
p.3 #7 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
Customer service is for more than just when something breaks
On two occasions I have lost gear.
Once I lost a set screw from one of my softboxes and once I somehow lost a diffuser panel from a softbox on another job.
Both times I called PB and they sent me replacements that same day and they cheerfully gave them to me for free. They are always helpful on the phone, always answer, and I have never had such consistently helpful service from any company in any industry. To me that is worth something.
Also for what it is worth, I have yet to have anything break on me from Buff. I have Einsteins and I have never had an issue with overheating but I have the newest version and I don't work them very hard either.
Peter
p.3 #8 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
Not helpful to mr. zucker either, but I've used a set of ultra 1200's for about 15 years and have never had a problem with any of them. Also have several of the ultra zaps in different powers and enjoy them also with no problems. Regarding the modeling light intensity, will the unit take a bulb that is 250 watt brightness without giving all the heat like a compact flourescent or LED type bulb? I understand the light quality would be different, but at least you would see the affects and it would be bright enough without overheating the strobe.
p.3 #9 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
regarding flo or led lights, it won't work because to get the equivalent of 250w of light you'd need a bulb about 3x the size of the standard light bulb
p.3 #10 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
FWIW, I have x1600's and have never had a problem with them. I had profoto's for a bit and broke a flash tube when someone knocked over a light stand! Ouch! If I recall correctly, that was a $600 mistake. After that, I learned to like the white lightning mount and there brand overall. Their flashcubes are $20 or so. Much easier to swallow.
Like others have said, their customer service has also been great. Wether on the phone or stopping by in Nashville.
The was I look at it, yeah their products don't have the fit and finish as profoto but I'm not paying that price so I don't expect it. The great thing is I get a quality product and great service because they stand behind their stuff. If you buy it, it won't depreciate like the new profoto gear either!
p.3 #11 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
i ended up doing something different than I expected. I bought a b1600 and a vagabond. I think that'll be more versatile than another heavy flash and it has more power than the PL500 or 1250.
p.3 #12 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
BrianO wrote:
The Einstein uses an insulated gate bipolar transistor(IGBT) for power control, the WL uses voltage control; the Einstein's flash duration -- which is short to begin with -- will get shorter as the output is lowered; as short as 1/13,000 according to Paul Buff -- good for stopping action/movement. The WL starts at 1/600 and gets longer as the power is reduced.
I just noticed that the X1600 (also X3200) have a selector to reduce the unit to 1/4 power output. NOTE: This is DIFFERENT than reducing the power slider to 1/4. In effect, it transforms the unit to a 165 WS unit, which then shortens the flash duration. Subsequent use of the slider will follow suit with the flash duration lengthening, but it basically gives you the option to run the X1600 at reduced power with EITHER shorter or longer flash durations depending on which mode you are in. Not exactly IGBT circuitry, but interesting nonetheless.
Additionally, the modeling light goes 250W and it is fan cooled, and in an aluminum housing (4.9 lbs). This is the first time I really looked at the prospect of the White Lightning, previously assuming it was simply a "tired old dog" in the wake of Einstein and IGBT ... but I'm in the mode of "hmmmm" for the X1600 or X3200 (X800 doesn't offer the 1/4 power mode) to provide EITHER more power, or more speed.
Again, not IGBT, kinda old school workaround @ shorter flash durations (1/4 power mode)... but given the modeling light, fan cooled and aluminum housing ... might be something of interest that would otherwise be overlooked.
For those who have used the White Lightning series ... are the mounts better constructed than the AB's (same style I assume), or any other notable aspects that go "under the radar" in the wake of Alien Bee & Einstein commentary?
One more notable diff that could be of interest according to PCB website:
AB & Einstein = 2 Yr Warranty
White Lightning = 5 Yr Warranty
p.3 #13 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
RustyBug wrote:
For those who have used the White Lightning series ... are the mounts better constructed than the AB's
Yes. Stronger (more space for the mechanism I guess).
The 1/4 power has been mentioned a lot in various forums...it's like having an AB1600 and AB400 in one container (but it's also roughly twice the length of an AB so it really is like having two :-)
The 1/4 switch is similar to a pack/head system where the 1/4 switch switches out a bank of capacitors...
p.3 #14 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
Sweet ... that's what I was hoping to hear.
Also, that would be a "well built" AB400 & AB1600 with cooling and better modeling.
I've already got one AB400 and a few mod's. I was wrestling with abandoning PCB before I invested more as the AB400 is a little sparse on build, etc., but this has presented a very nice twist for me.
p.3 #15 · Paul Buff Einstein vs white lighting x1600
The other cool thing about about the WL1600 is that at full power the t1 is a slow 1/600th, dropping to 1/300th at 1/32nd, making it an excellent candidate for Hypersync (PW) or Supersync (YN-622c).
