Home · Register · Search · View Winners · Software · Hosting · Software · Join Upload & Sell

Moderated by: Fred Miranda
Username   Password

  New fredmiranda.com Mobile Site
  

FM Forums | Alternative Gear & Lenses | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       end
  

Archive 2011 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA
  
 
Jman13
Online
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #1 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


So, a while back, I asked about some slower 200mm lenses, and got some good suggestions, none of which I have unfortunately had a chance to try out yet. At that time I was looking in the f/4 range, though now I'm thinking of expanding into the f/2.8 range for additional subject separation. These will be used on micro 4/3, so it'll be a long lens, and not used all that often, but I'm hoping to use it for shooting golf next summer (where white hats and dark lettering and dark backrounds make for fringing fun).

I have a Vivitar 200mm f/3.5, which is passable. It has decent resolution, though it's a little gauzy in its rendition until f/5.6, which is a bit too slow. It also has fairly prominent blue fringing and really ugly bokeh on distant subjects (it's fine up close).

I just received a Canon FD 200mm f/2.8 IF from KEH, as I thought I'd give it a shot since I already have an FD adapter. This is almost there....resolution is fine...actually quite good from f/2.8, and contrast is much better than the Vivitar. It, however, also suffers quite severely from fringing (though Purple in this case), and while I can correct it to large degree provided there isn't other purple in the shot, it is rather annoying. It also has quite severe longitudinal CA, with green edges on OOF objects in the background. I fear the CA issues here are just too much for me to bother dealing with for the $215 I paid for the lens, so I will probably end up returning it.

So...I'm looking for a 200mm lens, f/4 or faster (f/2.8 would be preferable), in the $250 or lower price range, with high resolution to provide generally sharp shots wide open on a micro 4/3 sensor, with minimal (or preferably zero) CA and at least decent bokeh.

I have adapters for Konica AR, Minolta MD, Olympus OM, Nikon F and Canon FD, so those would be great so I don't need to buy a new adapter, but I'm open to others.

One of the consensus picks from the first round was the Pentax M 200mm f/4 (or, for less, the SMC Takumar 200/4), though both of those would require me to buy an adapter to try. Is this still my best bet?

Any f/2.8 options in this range for this price range? I've heard the Nikon 180/2.8 is also very good, but also has some CA issues and it's generally too expensive for what I want to spend.

Thanks!



Dec 08, 2011 at 06:03 PM
AhamB
Online
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #2 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


You remember that you opened a thread about the exact same thing not too long ago?

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm afraid that no lens under $500~600 will give you the CA control you're looking for, perhaps with the exception of a cosmetically ugly Nikkor 180/2.8 ED. I think only the Voigtländer APO-Lanthar 180/4 and Leica APO-Telyt-R 180/3.4 are in the slower than f/2.8 category that are good enough. The aforementioned lenses are well worth their money and so is the Mamiya 645 200/2.8 APO, which probably offers best value for money if you can find one, but I wouldn't recommend the latter for a m43 body (since the lens has no tripod mount).



Dec 08, 2011 at 06:26 PM
Z250SA
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #3 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


I don´t know much about prices, but Aham is most probably correct there. It takes more complex lens designs, and in tele lenses expensive glass types to get rid of CA. The result is good or better lenses, at a higher cost. And then you want speed too. Faster lens = higher price. Good correction+fast = expensive. Very difficult to avoid.


Dec 08, 2011 at 09:15 PM
Smiert Spionam
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #4 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Yeah, this sounds like a tough request to fulfill. I think you're going to have to either expand your budget, get really lucky, or work around the problem. Even a Nikon 180/2.8 tends to show CA in high contrast areas wide open, and it's likely better than any of the f/4 options. There's no free lunch.

Sometimes, people get a little obsessed with testing in situations that are well outside what a lens is designed for, or likely to be used for. Immediate digital feedback has of course exacerbated this tendency. At the top of this list is taking high speed primes outside on a glaringly bright day and shooting a bunch of bare tree branches, which is followed by much gnashing of teeth about the terrible CA wide open.

Your case isn't that extreme, but I think it's reasonable to ask yourself: is this a real problem? In the lighting conditions in which this problem is likely to manifest itself, will you really need to shoot wide open? We've become a little obsessed with shooting wide open, partly as a result of being trained to see such images as "professional" in character. In many cases, that's an aesthetic and a cultural taste, and not really a technical need.

If you really want/need to shoot a medium long telephoto lens wide open in bright light, you need modern corrected optics to do it, especially if you're straining the lens' limits by cropping heavily, which will exaggerate its flaws.



Dec 08, 2011 at 09:31 PM
Z250SA
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #5 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


This is a better place to show the images of CA of 200-250mm lenses than the "New Zeiss article" thread. So here they are again, with addition of the whole view. The TT image is quite nice on a 27" iMac screen. It captures what I saw with my eyes at sun set Nov 17th at pm 03.34. Yes, the Superachromat images are far sharper, with no aberrations what so ever. But the SA is 20x the price of the TT. You do get what you pay for. But the TT is, IMZO better than it´s reputation, as it has the Zeiss look despite the obvious shortcoming of Lateral CA. On crop bodies the TT does very well.

Contax 200/3.4 Teletessar (at f/5.6) and Hasselblad 250/5.6 Superachromat, middle outermost left edge 100% crop.



















Dec 08, 2011 at 09:36 PM
inglis
Offline
• •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #6 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


What about the Canon FD L 80-200mm f4 zoom with its Fluorite for CA and UD lenses? KEH and Adorama often have them around 300$


Dec 08, 2011 at 09:43 PM
Jim Schemel
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #7 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Mamiya 200APO Great lens.Very sharp WO and 0 CA
-Jim



Dec 08, 2011 at 10:01 PM
Jman13
Online
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #8 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Jim - is that the 200/2.8 APO? Approximate cost?

I have thought about the FD 80-200L...I've had a hard time locating them for less than $400-$450, though. I will keep my eyes peeled.

I think I've decided to keep the FD 200/2.8, at least for now, but I will keep my eyes peeled for the 80-200L and the Mamiya. I have found that I can set a preset and eliminate about 95% of the PF pretty easily (provided there isn't purple in the image). Unfortunately what I will be using this lens for primarily is in situations where PF is a problem, but I think I'll be able to deal with it. It is rather sharp and contrasty, and while I will have to deal with heavy LoCA that I can't eliminate, I don't think I'm going to get better without spending twice as much. I'd think about adapting the Olympus 50-200 f/2.8-3.5 if I needed this focal length often, but I rarely shoot longer than 135mm on m4/3, and I've got great glass up to that level, and the little Oly 40-150, which is quite good, when I don't need more subject separation.

Thanks, everyone!

One quick shot of my daughter tonight with the FD 200, wide open...works great in this situation!







Dec 09, 2011 at 01:17 AM
denoir
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #9 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Canon EF 70-200/2.8 IS MkII - it's unbelievably good. At the wide end it has less aberrations than the Leica APO-Summicron-M 75/2 ASPH and it's as good at the tele end. Although it has a typical Canon rendering, which is not my cup of tea, in terms of raw optical performance it runs circles around most high end prime lenses.


Dec 09, 2011 at 02:19 AM
Jman13
Online
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #10 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Gee thanks! And with zero aperture control and only $2,300 over my budget, it'll be perfect!

I've actually owned the 70-200/2.8 II, but I sold it last year when I sold all my Canon gear.



Dec 09, 2011 at 02:41 AM
 

Search in Used Dept. 



Jim Schemel
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #11 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Jim - is that the 200/2.8 APO? Approximate cost?

Jordan,
They run in price anywhere from $500-$700 depending on condition.The only 'weakness' to the lens was its MFD i believe its around 6ft.

Here is a sample shot when i had it along with the full size image.As you can see there is no CA or purple fringing.
-Jim














Dec 09, 2011 at 03:00 AM
denoir
Offline
• • • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #12 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Jman13 wrote:
Gee thanks! And with zero aperture control and only $2,300 over my budget, it'll be perfect!


Oops, I guess I should have read through your post



Dec 09, 2011 at 03:08 AM
Jman13
Online
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #13 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Jim, you are evil...I can't afford to spend that on a lens I'd use 3-4 times a year, but man does that look beautiful....


Dec 09, 2011 at 04:19 AM
FlyPenFly
Offline
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #14 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Minolta 200mm f2.8 But its a grand.


Dec 09, 2011 at 04:42 AM
huddy
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #15 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


AhamB wrote:
You remember that you opened a thread about the exact same thing not too long ago?

I hope I'm wrong, but I'm afraid that no lens under $500~600 will give you the CA control you're looking for, perhaps with the exception of a cosmetically ugly Nikkor 180/2.8 ED. I think only the Voigtländer APO-Lanthar 180/4 and Leica APO-Telyt-R 180/3.4 are in the slower than f/2.8 category that are good enough. The aforementioned lenses are well worth their money and so is the Mamiya 645 200/2.8 APO, which probably offers best value for money if you can find one, but I
...Show more

FWIW, if you look, you should be able to find EX and EX+ Nikkors on ebay for $375-450 pretty frequently. And KEH occasionally has BGN copies on there for much less that are in much better than bargain condition IMO, at a very fair price.

This one is quite nice: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Nikon-180mm-f-2-8-ED-AIS-Telephoto-Len-Caps-419325-/120822441134?pt=Camera_Lenses&hash=item1c219424ae#ht_1111wt_952



Dec 09, 2011 at 04:55 AM
phuang3
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #16 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Z250SA wrote:
Contax 200/3.4 Teletessar (at f/5.6) and Hasselblad 250/5.6 Superachromat, middle outermost left edge 100% crop.


Your superachromat test shot is very impressive! What is your camera body? Because hassy SA is a medium format lens, you can't see the real edge on a 135 body. However, I believe SA should have even IQ on whole image plane.



Dec 09, 2011 at 06:16 AM
Z250SA
Offline
• • •
Upload & Sell: Off
p.1 #17 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


phuang3, it´s shot with my 5D2. Yes, the IQ is quite even over the whole 6x6. But on 135 this _is_ the real edge, though the image circle is far wider.

As can be seen from Jim´s images less corrected lenses are good enough on todays sensors, perhaps on future sensors with far smaller pixels too.



Dec 09, 2011 at 06:41 AM
AhamB
Online
• • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #18 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


Jim Schemel wrote:
Here is a sample shot when i had it along with the full size image.As you can see there is no CA or purple fringing.


At 100% view it's actually quite easy to see cyan/magenta fringing in many of the OOF parts. Still, it's controlled very well. On my 5D I have never found any lateral fringing with this lens though, truly zero, starting from wide open, across the entire frame. I could take a 100% corner crop at f/2.8 and it would look very similar to the Hassy Superachromat, at least on the 5D.

Like I already said, this lens doesn't have a tripod mount and it's 1.1kg, so it will be difficult to use with a m43 body.



Dec 09, 2011 at 11:26 AM
jcolwell
Offline
• • • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #19 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


I agree with Jim S., the Mamiya A 200/2.8 APO is the best 180mm to 200mm lens that I've ever tried. Of course, I still own it.

On the slower side, the Olympus 200/4 OM is a peach. I don't know if I mentioned this on your earlier thread. I recently (last weekend) did a comparsion of the 200/4 OM with the Canon 135/2L + Kenko Pro 1.4x - the OM blew it away.



Dec 09, 2011 at 02:25 PM
Jman13
Online
• • • • •
Upload & Sell: On
p.1 #20 · 200mm lenses - High resolution - low CA


How's the fringing on the OM? It doesn't need to be flawless, but on the FD200 ((and my Fd 135/2 I used last year), the PF is about 8-10 pixels in some cases. This case is pretty typical. I can correct it decently, but if I can get better for the price it would be nice. (it can be worse than this with more white)

100% crop, no correction






100% crop, correction in Lightroom






Full corrected image. I do think I can live with this, but better is always nice.







Dec 09, 2011 at 02:56 PM
1
       2       end




FM Forums | Alternative Gear & Lenses | Join Upload & Sell

1
       2       end
    
 

You are not logged in. Login or Register

Username   Password    Retrive password