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Archive 2011 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added
  
 
cgardner
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


The design of the contact pins changed between 580ex and 580exII becoming larger and rounder which I suspect is the culprit win the contact problems along with the redesign of the lock and the addition of the rubber waterproofing gasket.

In a recent thread someone who had problems with a 580exII and exchanged it for a different one mentioned that the design of the pins on the second one he got was different. So it appears circumstantially that Canon may have made an unannounced alteration in the design in response to the problem.

It would be interesting for the sake of comparison if 580ex owners, particularly recent purchasers, could post a photo of the bottom and pins for comparison.



Dec 08, 2011 at 09:11 PM
danielz
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Yes, I was the one that had my flash returned/replaced via amazon. The pins have been changed. The older ones that caused misfires and ETTL/TTL / overexposure (full flash and no flash) had lower, rounded pins.

The new flash that I got has a slightly longer set of pins and they are pointed in shape, its a clear visible difference. So far after a few days of use the one with new pins sees to be rock solid......

I emailed canon support and they suggested that for my other 3 580-EXIIs, to send them to NJ and request that the units be repaired....... I assume that is the foot replacement/pin change... I am sending my other 580-EXIIs in next week, as each one at times has this problem and I was tired of playing with adjustment, moving them, etc... .and I dont want to open the unit myself to do the DIY thing that is on the internet.



Dec 09, 2011 at 12:57 AM
cgardner
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


danielz wrote:
Yes, I was the one that had my flash returned/replaced via amazon. The pins have been changed. The older ones that caused misfires and ETTL/TTL / overexposure (full flash and no flash) had lower, rounded pins.


Can you shoot an post a photo of the new pins? Curious to see the difference.



Dec 09, 2011 at 01:53 AM
digitalbug30d
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


here a comparison...why did Canon change the pins so radically,on the 420 they seem longer and stiffer( better contact with shoe)





580 EXII on left...older 420 EX right







close up 580 EX II pins







close up EX 420 pins




Dec 09, 2011 at 02:33 AM
digitalbug30d
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


.


Dec 09, 2011 at 02:36 AM
cgardner
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Here's a photo of the new 580exII pin design danielz forwarded to me via e-mail...







Longer and pointier than the original issue... I predict a lot of calls to Canon service tomorrow...

My 580ex pins are similar to digitalbug30d's 430ex shot.



Dec 09, 2011 at 02:51 AM
johnip
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Yeah, mine has the round pins. I figured it was to make the flash slide on easier. I always had trouble with my mom's old Minolta that had pointy pins like the updated 580exII.
Maybe that's why Canon swapped in the first place but led to the problems some of you have.

I don't think I've had trouble with mine though. The missed flash on the second shot of a high-speed burst is most likely due to recycle times.



Dec 09, 2011 at 02:56 AM
Binh Ly
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Very interesting. I checked all my 580EX II's and indeed, the one that I bought this year (2011) has the pointy pins. The other 2 older ones have the rounded pins. I did have problems from time to time but it just seemed random it never bothered me that much. Now I know what was causing it all along.

danielz wrote:
Yes, I was the one that had my flash returned/replaced via amazon. The pins have been changed. The older ones that caused misfires and ETTL/TTL / overexposure (full flash and no flash) had lower, rounded pins.

The new flash that I got has a slightly longer set of pins and they are pointed in shape, its a clear visible difference. So far after a few days of use the one with new pins sees to be rock solid......




Dec 09, 2011 at 04:22 AM
timbop
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


I got rod of my 580ex2 for this reason. On the older bodies (pre 5d2/7d) in vertical orientation the flash would fire erratically. It's a POS design....


Dec 09, 2011 at 04:25 AM
Yohan Pamudji
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


danielz wrote:
Yes, I was the one that had my flash returned/replaced via amazon. The pins have been changed. The older ones that caused misfires and ETTL/TTL / overexposure (full flash and no flash) had lower, rounded pins.

The new flash that I got has a slightly longer set of pins and they are pointed in shape, its a clear visible difference. So far after a few days of use the one with new pins sees to be rock solid......

I emailed canon support and they suggested that for my other 3 580-EXIIs, to send them to NJ and request that the units
...Show more

Are Canon doing this for free or are they charging you? I have the older rounded pins and have only encountered this problem on mine when shooting in the cold (makes sense that the pins would shrink a bit in the cold and cause problems if the design is iffy to begin with) and would definitely send mine in to Canon for a retrofit if they're doing it for free.



Dec 09, 2011 at 05:19 AM
 

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Greggbhill
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


My 2 580 EX IIs were both purchased from Amazon -- the one on the left (serial# 9865xx) was purchased in March/2011 and the one on the right (serial# C6007x) was purchased this week. Haven't had any issues on 7D or 5D2.
Looks like the coneheads are a better design (anyone remember Remulac? )







Dec 09, 2011 at 06:24 AM
Daan B
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Great... a silent cone head introduction. Why would Canon have kept this silent? Bah.


Dec 09, 2011 at 09:51 AM
danielz
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


I sent in two this week, that should be under warranty. When you do this via their product repair website, it automatically said warranty/$0 since purchase date was recent. I should know if the change their minds early next week after they receive these and follow-up.

I purchased several over the past year, and it seems hit and miss on the flash functioning, so I am trying to get all of the modified with the new shoe.... I'll follow up..



Dec 09, 2011 at 01:50 PM
cgardner
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Greggbhill wrote:
Looks like the coneheads are a better design (anyone remember Remulac? )


Would you like chips with that 6-pack?



Dec 09, 2011 at 03:09 PM
omarlyn
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


Greggbhill wrote:
Looks like the coneheads are a better design (anyone remember Remulac? )


cgardner wrote:
Would you like chips with that 6-pack?


Wow, you guys are REALLY showing your age...I'll happily deny any knowledge of coneheads, Remulac and anything else from the previous century!

Back to the subject of the 580 II pins...I'm having a hard time trying to figure our WHY the 'conehead' pins would be any better than the 'rounded' pins. It seems to me that there would be less contact surface area with the new design versus the old design...hence, the 'conehead' pins would be inferior. Am I not looking at this correctly? Can someone elaborate to the contrary? For the record, I have not had any communication issues with both my (old style) 580 II's on either my 1D, 5D, or 7D.

Omar




Dec 09, 2011 at 03:24 PM
cgardner
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


omarlyn wrote:
Back to the subject of the 580 II pins...I'm having a hard time trying to figure our WHY the 'conehead' pins would be any better than the 'rounded' pins. It seems to me that there would be less contact surface area with the new design versus the old design...hence, the 'conehead' pins would be inferior. Am I not looking at this correctly? Can someone elaborate to the contrary? For the record, I have not had any communication issues with both my (old style) 580 II's on either my 1D, 5D, or 7D.


Part of the problem is the length of the pins. The contact problems were due mainly to the resistance of the rubber seal Canon added to the foot. The shorter pins wouldn't seat on the contacts as firmly so any flex in the gasket or hot shoe attachment to the camera would cause the loss of contact sending the flash into the film body A-TTL mode, resulting in a full power flash.

Also the contacts on the hot shoe are in shallow wells. The wider / flatter radius of the tip makes it more likely for the flexing to make the pin ride up onto the plastic around the pin breaking contact.

The pointed pins, while having a smaller contact area have, for the same amount of spring loading, more contact pressure per square MM and are less prone to riding up out of the contact wells on the camera.

Speaking of showing one's age, I find it ludicrous that in the 21st century camera makers are still using 20th century legacy mechanical connectors for flash. The only design worse than the 1930's hot shoe design is the other flash connector the PC cord / plug.

What I'd like to see is elimination of the hot shoe entirely replacing it with a integrated bracket system which positions the flash more effectively, connected via radio or Tos-Link style digital optical connector.



Dec 09, 2011 at 04:26 PM
Kafn8td
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


both my 580 II and 430 II have the round pins. I've never had an issue and they've been used on a 30d, 5d and 7d.


Dec 09, 2011 at 04:51 PM
BrianO
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


danielz wrote:
...I am trying to get all of the modified with the new shoe.


New foot.

The shoe is on the camera, and -- just as with people -- the foot goes into the shoe.

Kafn8td wrote:
both my 580 II and 430 II have the round pins. I've never had an issue and they've been used on a 30d, 5d and 7d.


You aren't alone. Not everyone had problems with the old design, but with the new design hopefully even fewer will.



Dec 09, 2011 at 05:32 PM
danielz
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


yeah, I always say it that way... you are right :-)




Dec 09, 2011 at 06:00 PM
BrianO
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · gonna rant about the 580 EXII...pics added


digitalbug30d wrote:
I could skip the pins and get a short PC cord... will ETTL be transfered via PC?


Nope; PC is a sync-only, two-conductor system. With the addition of screw locks to the original Prontor-Compur design, it's now pretty rugged and reliable, but it doesn't have the "band-width" for anything more advanced than "go-bang-now" communication.

I like both the short Canon OC-E3 ETTL cord and the 24-foot version from Flash Zebra. Because the weight of the flash isn't being put on the hot shoe there's less of an issue with changing stresses causing the pins to lift as the camera is moved around than when using flash on camera.



Dec 09, 2011 at 08:32 PM
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