This Friday's wedding... just got the timeline from the bride. 6 hours of coverage: 7pm - 1am.
Ceremony at 9:00pm, couple does not want to do a first look.
Allotting 20 minutes for family portraits and "romantic portraits of the couple"
Couple "ok" with me pulling them out for some portraits if needed during the reception but the less the better.
So I was just on the phone talking about it and I said to her:
"whatever you decide, I will work with and willl do my best to get awesome photography for you, however I would be doing you a disservice if I didn't make a last-ditch effort to suggest you consider doing a FIRST LOOK and see each other prior to the ceremony at 8pm.
The decision is yours and whatever it is I respect it but, given the absence of natural light after the ceremony, the time constraints for portraiture (which would all have to be lit portraiture which takes longer to set up and do) and the fact that you've stated multiple times that you'd rather spend time enjoying that party rather than being pulled out for photos.
We actually always recommend a first look specifically to couples who, like you, prefer to spend more time enjoying themselves with family and friends."
She got rather silent and then after maybe 10 seconds of silence she said "well... if it was raining we would have to take the photos inside anyway, so I'd have to deal with that" with a tone of voice that suggested she was not happy with my professional recommendation.
I guess she didn't like what I said.
Even after seeing the outcome I still think I did the right thing in telling her. I think that when you say "I'm going on vacation for a month and I'd rather postpone the surgery till i get back" your doctor should tell you it's your choice but also inform you if they feel it's not the wisest decision. I think your Lawyer should point out that they feel your insurance coverasge is not complete ... and I think your photographer should suggest you go against tradition if everything else you said would work better if you did so.
Your job is to get the best possible photos while keeping your client as happy as possible. You gave an option that would do both based on your experience. You did nothing wrong.
When she's running around like crazy trying to round up her family and munching on appetizers during the 5 minutes you have for B&G portraits, she'll begin to understand.
When it comes down to it, it is their decision...I never push people when they do not want to. The one time I REALLY tried to push a couple to do a first look, they steadfastly refused. We ended up getting some of the best photos after the wedding that I have ever shot.
I will suggest it and explain why, but when it comes down to it...it is their day. As long as you have let them know the potential shortcomings of their choice and informed them that you will do your best whatever they decide, that is all you can do.
Tony Hoffer wrote:
Your job is to get the best possible photos while keeping your client as happy as possible. You gave an option that would do both based on your experience. You did nothing wrong.
When she's running around like crazy trying to round up her family and munching on appetizers during the 5 minutes you have for B&G portraits, she'll begin to understand.
agreed...
I had a couple last year, that swore they wanted table shots, despite my advice that they can be difficult at best.
After waiting for 10 minutes at 2 separate tables (they had 20+ tables) to round up all of the people for each table...she scrapped the idea.
The onus is on her to realize that you have done this enough to know the outcome of her choices, but that you will be there to try to make the best of them. That's the sign of a true professional.
Maybe she thought you were trying to get her to pay you more for the first look coverage. Was the first look covered in the current package or would she have had to fork out more $? If the former, was it clear to her?
I don't know, if I was a bride I would gladly take in any suggestions to help capture the day ... particularly since first look is done and dusted before the ceremony and party begins. I think you did the right thing.
edit: Mmmm, ok, the first look is @ 8 which is within the 6hrs, so no extra charge.
I agree, though there is a lot of emotion attached to the wedding day as it is. Considering many ladies spend a lot of time throughout their lives planning their wedding in their mind to a T, she may have known exactly what she wants. And since she had previously mentioned what she wanted, she may have interpreted your genuine attitude and suggestion as disrespectful since she already stated what she wanted. I feel where you are coming from as I have experienced the same thing, however she probably is already at an emotional high with wedding planning, so anything you say could be totally taken out of context and perceived the wrong way.
Seeing your significant other before the wedding to some is just completely not an option and not debatable. I'm not sure how she conveyed it to you in your original discussion on the topic, but she may have thought she was straightforward and up front about the issue....which could be the reason for her attitude now. Only you know how that played out
Perhaps a kind apology is in the works stating that you had good intentions but respect and want to honor her wishes and will capture her wedding like a rockstar and look forward to her special day. Don't let it weigh on you too much, but don't let it be an sticky issue between you and the bride either.
All this to say you presented the option clearly and well to her, and she prob took it the wrong way. You did your part as the professional. But sometimes even then, that is not enough because clients *think* they know what they want and what is best.
Yes. Either you're the expert guiding them or they're the experts guiding you.
I think the real disservice is the photographer who falsely promises exceptional results while the bride and groom cut the ways it can happen.
Though I wouldn't wait until the last moment to have the timeline. I do that way up front, when we meet. I tell them how much to allow, so when they get to planning out schedules with the other vendors, they know what I need, even if we haven't fine tuned it.
I understand her reaction. You freak me out on a frequent basis!
Maybe she thought she'd made her preferences clear. Maybe she's confused why this is important enough to you to bring up the subject again. Maybe she thinks that as a professional, you should be able to handle the situation, meeting her requirements with a minimum of impact on the wedding festivities.
THe problem in situations like this is we know and they don't. We have shot many weddings and they have been in one maybe two. We know the day will be frantic. We know what will work. We know the reception is waiting. We know there will be a last minute request for Aunt Alma. We also know we are working for a customer who doesn't understand that in the years to come it will be the photographs that are kept. One modeling shoot and you get hours, but not on wedding day. Did you do right or not? This bride felt not, maybe. Maybe she just wanted to make it clear. It is our job to educate the bride so that she can make the decision. You can always apologize and then prove your worth it.
I usually get the timeline well in advance and I do give my input ahead of time as well. But if a client is just "whatever, I'll get to it when I get to it" what am I supposed to do?
I had mentioned the first look when we met to sign the contract. They decided against it but it wasn't like a "no way!" when I brought it up and it wasn't worded to me strongly enough that I felt it was an unmovable mountain. I also was not aware of the timeline at the time so I only sold it based on their desire to spend more time with friends... I didn't know I was going to also deal with the desire to get environmental portraits in pitch dark or near so.
I will probably go check out the venue again tonight... lightmeter in hand and make a plan of attack. I usually like to "be surprised" and come up with stuff on the fly.... however if there's a time to be prepared this may be it. Plus I'll be heading to the casino... the scenery isn't exactly repulsive
Sergio Mottola wrote:
its not a bad thing to mention but its a bad thing to mention the week before.
my thoughts exactly.
i have a tight timeline for a wedding in august. i made my suggestions (similar to yours) about a first look. she wants the 'walk down the aisle thing'. i told her things would be really tight. She said she was OK with that.
so from this point on, her plan is the plan and as far as she knows, I am 100% cool with it. i'll never mention the challenges i face that day with her from this point on as to cause doubt in her own mind.
The problem is that she has an unrealistic fantasy stuck in her head about standing in the entry way to the ceremony arm-in-arm with her dad and seeing the groom catch his breath seeing her for the first time that momentus day and maybe he'll shed a tear or two because she's so beautiful and you're effing with her fantasy. Weather report for this wedding: Stormy skies ahead.
i have a tight timeline for a wedding in august. i made my suggestions (similar to yours) about a first look. she wants the 'walk down the aisle thing'. i told her things would be really tight. She said she was OK with that.
so from this point on, her plan is the plan and as far as she knows, I am 100% cool with it. i'll never mention the challenges i face that day with her from this point on as to cause doubt in her own mind.
Yeah you guys make an excellent point. Maybe I should have pressed her about getting a timeline together months ago. I asked a few times, she said she hadn't gotten to it and I let it slide.
Now it's 2 days from the wedding and I just got it today.
lisy78 wrote:
Yeah you guys make an excellent point. Maybe I should have pressed her about getting a timeline together months ago. I asked a few times, she said she hadn't gotten to it and I let it slide.
Now it's 2 days from the wedding and I just got it today.
Booo to me
maybe a reassuring call to her? 'i got this, you are going to look beautiful and your photos WILL reflect that, you are going to have a great time, etc etc etc'.
In my area if I would ever mention the copule seeing each other before the ceremony I would be laughed at and most likely run out of town. I guess it is a southern thing but it is traditional in my area and I have never shot a ceremony where they see each other before the ceremony. She could be used to that tradition and surprised anyone would do it different. Explaining that it is common and showing some images of others who have done it might be helpful.
Ya just reassure her that everything will be alright. Your Italian charm will surely do the trick!
I would not worry to much about it, you will be fine!
