Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

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khurram1
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p.1 #1 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

I've got the Vari ND 77mm thin mount that I use with my 24-105L and 70-200 F2.8L IS lenses and have had no issues using these filter with my old 1DIII, 5D or 5DII.

However, when I need an ND filter when using my 5DII and 16-35L II or 24 TSE II lenses, I've been using Singh-Ray's 5 stop 4x6 ND filter. Problem is that unlike the Vari-ND i'm finding a lot of color shifting - especially when used for long exposures (which someone in the General Gear talk section said was a known issue and provided me with a link regarding the issue on another forum site).

What I wanted to know is if anyone has experience using the 82mm Vari-ND (which only comes in a standard ring, not thin), with the 5D mkII and the 16-35LII or the 24 TSE II lenses, as well as how much vignetting should be expected

From what I understand the Duo is only available in 77mm. Any idea how much vignetting there would be with the 24-105L with the standard or thin versions with the 5D mk II?

Nov 07, 2009 at 11:39 PM

tsdevine
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p.1 #2 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

I made the mistake of getting the non-slim 82mm when I first got my 16-35 mk II....no go with my 5D. Vignetting was bad on the wide end.

I was able to get a slim mount version, you may want to drop them an email to see if they are ever going to do another run of 82mm slim Vari-NDs.

Nov 08, 2009 at 12:46 AM

khurram1
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p.1 #3 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

tsdevine wrote:

I made the mistake of getting the non-slim 82mm when I first got my 16-35 mk II....no go with my 5D. Vignetting was bad on the wide end.

I was able to get a slim mount version, you may want to drop them an email to see if they are ever going to do another run of 82mm slim Vari-NDs.

How is your slim 82mm on the 16-35?

Does anyone have any experience with the 24 TSE and the 82mm Vari-ND

Are there any other options for a good ND filter to use with the 24 TSE II or the 16-35L II lenses

As i stated I've got the Singh-Ray 5 stop 4x6 ND filter, however, I get really stong color cast with that filter when I'm using the filter with my 5D II with either of these lenses.

At first I thought the issue was only when I was using a ND grad filter with the 5 stop Singh-Ray ND 4x6 filter. However, I've got the issue when using the Singh Ray ND filter on its own as well.

Nov 08, 2009 at 05:31 AM

stanj
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p.1 #4 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

I have the slim SR polarizer, and the normal VND (since there isn't one that's non-slim in 82mm). When I use the 82mm stack on a 77mm lens, such as the 24-70, it vignettes a bit. When I use it on the 16-35/II, the vignetting is severe. The VND alone is not quite as bad but it is still bad. Here a JPG straight out of 1Ds3 @ 16mm.

Nov 08, 2009 at 06:25 AM

mMontag
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p.1 #5 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

I use a 77mm Vari-ND slim on a 24 II TS-E with a 82-77 step-down ring - 1-2 degree tilt - no vignetting even at f3.5. If you shift or tilt over 4 or 5 degrees it will vignette. A 77mm slim will vignette to about 21-22mm on a 17-40. The 24-105 vignettes very easily & shows up to around 28mm. All on FF. It might be nice to have - but - do you really need 5 plus stops of ND at 16-22mm?

I'm not aware of the "color shifting" issue you mentioned using the 5 stop - is it occurring at wider angles - maybe post an image - if your able to provide that link to Gear Forum might be helpful. I use GND's quite often - unwanted color usually is too much filter - underexposure - similar to darkening skies, etc.

Call Bob at Singh Ray - great consultant, product & service.

Nov 08, 2009 at 07:18 AM

tsdevine
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p.1 #6 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

When I use the Vari-ND on the 16-35 mk II, I'm usually stopped down past f/8. I don't notice any vignetting problems with the 82mm slim Vari-ND. I will say though, for what I like to do...I miss not having polarization. So I also carry around a regular ND and a slim polarizer. Lately I've been using that combo more than the Vari-ND.

It boggles my mind that Singh-Ray isn't producing the slim version any more. Like another poster mentioned, you may want to give them a call and see if they are going to do any "special" runs.

-Tim

Nov 08, 2009 at 11:38 AM

tsdevine
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p.1 #7 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

Answering the second part of that question. I know this is blasphemy, but I'm using a Tiffen HT .6 ND and a Singh-Ray LB Warming Polarizer more than my Vari-ND. I've been very happy with that combo. I do suggest using the hood to insure you don't get reflections from the filters. Here's some examples, all shot with a 5D and the 16-35 mk II with the filters mentioned.

Nov 08, 2009 at 11:45 AM

khurram1
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p.1 #8 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

stanj wrote:
I have the slim SR polarizer, and the normal VND (since there isn't one that's non-slim in 82mm). When I use the 82mm stack on a 77mm lens, such as the 24-70, it vignettes a bit. When I use it on the 16-35/II, the vignetting is severe. The VND alone is not quite as bad but it is still bad. Here a JPG straight out of 1Ds3 @ 16mm.

thanks for posting an example, it speaks volumes of what to expect

Nov 08, 2009 at 06:58 PM

khurram1
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p.1 #9 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

mMontag wrote:
I use a 77mm Vari-ND slim on a 24 II TS-E with a 82-77 step-down ring - 1-2 degree tilt - no vignetting even at f3.5. If you shift or tilt over 4 or 5 degrees it will vignette. A 77mm slim will vignette to about 21-22mm on a 17-40. The 24-105 vignettes very easily & shows up to around 28mm. All on FF. It might be nice to have - but - do you really need 5 plus stops of ND at 16-22mm?

I'm not aware of the "color shifting" issue you mentioned using the 5 stop - is it occurring at wider angles - maybe post an image - if your able to provide that link to Gear Forum might be helpful. I use GND's quite often - unwanted color usually is too much filter - underexposure - similar to darkening skies, etc.

Call Bob at Singh Ray - great consultant, product & service.

Thanks for the info about the step up ring with the 77mm filter on the TSE. I'll give it a try. I guess i won't be able to stich pano's with the combo, since limited shift is available, but at least it sounds like the best option for using a 24mm lens with my Vari ND.

Here's a link to the Gear Talk post.
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/815681/0#7553242

Below are the photos I posted there.
The first is just using a ND grad. The next two are with the 5 stop Grad added, the last is again with the 5 stop ND removed.

These photos represent situations why i bought the SR 5 stop 4x6 ND filter. I got it for when I also need to use a ND grad to hold back the sky, and when I wanted to use my 16-35L II lens. I find using a 4x6 ND filter is much faster then using a screw in, since you can focus and compose and then insert the filter very quickly in the Lee WIde ANgle filter hood. I experienced the same issue at Glacier NP when trying the same combo at Swift Current falls.

I did try calling singh-ray a few times and both times a lady said he would call back, to explain the technical reason that this was happening. I figured, that I'd probably get the same answer as i got in the gear forum, so I didn't bother calling back again after the second attempt to call him.

2008 © khurram1

Exif information
Model	Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Date	2009:09:19 14:23:35
Original date	2009:07:18 21:37:22
Exposure time	2 sec
Focal length	25mm
Focal number	f/16.0
ISO speed	100 ISO
Exposure compensation	0.0

Exif information
Model	Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Date	2009:09:19 14:23:28
Original date	2009:07:18 21:38:30
Exposure time	13 sec
Focal length	25mm
Focal number	f/16.0
ISO speed	100 ISO
Exposure compensation	0.0

Exif information
Model	Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Date	2009:09:19 14:23:52
Original date	2009:07:18 21:38:54
Exposure time	25 sec
Focal length	25mm
Focal number	f/14.0
ISO speed	100 ISO
Exposure compensation	0.0

Edited on Nov 08, 2009 at 07:24 PM · View previous versions

Nov 08, 2009 at 07:04 PM

khurram1
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p.1 #10 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

last shot without the SR 5 stop ND 4x6 filter.

2008 © khurram1

Exif information
Model	Canon EOS 5D Mark II
Date	2009:09:19 14:23:44
Original date	2009:07:18 21:40:28
Exposure time	2 sec
Focal length	25mm
Focal number	f/16.0
ISO speed	100 ISO
Exposure compensation	0.0

Nov 08, 2009 at 07:05 PM

khurram1
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p.1 #11 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

tsdevine wrote:

When I use the Vari-ND on the 16-35 mk II, I'm usually stopped down past f/8. I don't notice any vignetting problems with the 82mm slim Vari-ND. I will say though, for what I like to do...I miss not having polarization. So I also carry around a regular ND and a slim polarizer. Lately I've been using that combo more than the Vari-ND.

It boggles my mind that Singh-Ray isn't producing the slim version any more. Like another poster mentioned, you may want to give them a call and see if they are going to do any "special" runs.

-Tim
I think it might be because the have issues (or at least had issues), with the 82mm thin rings. I know I got the thin 82mm Color combo polarizer and was actually one of the individual who called SR to request the filter when Canon announced the 16-35L II lens. However, i found that the glass moves around in the ring. I know they had stopped making that filter for a while as well after the first batch.

One thing I don't understand is why Singh-Ray doesn't work on making thinner mounts like the Hoya HD, B+W XS, Heliopan ES and Rodenstock HR digital filters. All of these filters have very thin mounts WITH front threads so that filter holders/filters can be attached.

Nov 08, 2009 at 07:13 PM

khurram1
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p.1 #12 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

Have you tried using the Tiffen ND filters with a ND grad? Most of my issues are when I'm trying to use an ND grad with the 5 stop ND filter.

Nov 08, 2009 at 07:16 PM

tsdevine
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p.1 #13 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

No, I haven't, sorry.

I haven't had any problems with my 82mm LB slim polarizer either (glass turning) I do expect the sticker to wear down like my 77mm one has, although I've used it probably as much and it still seems okay.

Nov 09, 2009 at 01:36 AM

kop.cppua
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p.1 #14 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

tsdevine wrote:
Answering the second part of that question. I know this is blasphemy, but I'm using a Tiffen HT .6 ND and a Singh-Ray LB Warming Polarizer more than my Vari-ND. I've been very happy with that combo. I do suggest using the hood to insure you don't get reflections from the filters. Here's some examples, all shot with a 5D and the 16-35 mk II with the filters mentioned.

Hi, tsdevine, would the Tiffen HT be a screw-in-type filter? .. do you also need the 0.9 ND or other densities? Any severe vignetting if you double stack them plus a circ polarizer?

CP

Nov 09, 2009 at 02:45 AM

tsdevine
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p.1 #15 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

Yeah, it's a screw in. I mainly use the combo for waterfall photography and I generally look for cloudy or partly cloudy conditions. There are occasions I need somethings stronger and I'll probably pick up a .9 or 1.2. Sometimes I don't even need the ND as the polarizer suffices. It just depends on conditions. I've been pretty lucky though using the .6 and a polarizer.

If I wasn't looking for any polarization, I'd probably use the Vari-ND. I just don't see an easy way to use the slim (let alone the standard version) Vari-ND on FF and then get polarization in addition.

Nov 09, 2009 at 03:00 AM

kop.cppua
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p.1 #16 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

tsdevine wrote:

Yeah, it's a screw in. I mainly use the combo for waterfall photography and I generally look for cloudy or partly cloudy conditions. There are occasions I need somethings stronger and I'll probably pick up a .9 or 1.2. Sometimes I don't even need the ND as the polarizer suffices. It just depends on conditions. I've been pretty lucky though using the .6 and a polarizer.

If I wasn't looking for any polarization, I'd probably use the Vari-ND. I just don't see an easy way to use the slim (let alone the standard version) Vari-ND on FF and then get polarization in addition.
Thanks, tsdevine. Oh, by the way, congrats on the voightlander 125mm.

CP

Nov 09, 2009 at 03:33 AM

tsdevine
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p.1 #17 · Singh Ray Vari-ND/Vari N Duo with Canon Wide Angle

Thanks.....I new I shouldn't have read the APO thread in the Alternative lenses forum....

-Tim

Nov 09, 2009 at 04:01 AM


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